thrllskr

I have a brooks B17, my first. Bought it about a year ago, it has about 15K miles on it, and it is saggy saggy. I have tried to tighten it up and it makes it more uncomfortable then ever. I think it is time to replace it.
Has anyone purchased a B17-special and had better luck with the amount of miles it will hold up? Is the special worth the extra money?

tarwheel 

The B17 Special is definitely made with thicker, higher quality leather. They also look nicer. However, because they are made of natural leather, there will be some variation in the thickness of all Brooks saddles. At one point, I had two B17s, a black one and a honey one. The black one was made of noticeably thinner leather and started sagging much quicker than the honey one.

tarwheel 

By the way, you might be an ideal candidate for a Cambium C17 saddle, which in theory should never sag.

thrllskr

I tried the Cambium out and it was too narrow

Wanderer

If it's only a year old, and sagging badly - have you tried contacting Brooks about it********** Or the dealer you bought it from?

thrllskr

The LBS I bought it from will return for store credit or exchange. However, I am curious about the mileage of a Brooks. I don't want to be unethical and return the seat when it is just worn out from use. The saddle does have 15K miles on it. Great suggestion though, I have not thought about contacting Brooks. I am still curious as to anyone using the B17 Special.

Steamer

Did you ride it wet a lot? Or apply leather conditioners more than once or twice over that 1 year period? Either of these will hasten the sagging.

Did you try lacing the skirts?

thrllskr

I had never thought about lacing it. I have never done that but, I am sure there is a video on youtube on how to do it. I will look it up. It is very dry here so it was never in wet weather and I only put saddle conditioning on it once. Again, it has 15K or maybe more miles on it.

Steamer

You just drill holes in the sides, near the bottom, and lace it together with some leather shoe laces or similar material.

chasm54

I've got more than 10,000 miles on my B17, and probably 15,000 on my Swift. Neither is remotely saggy, and I've barely had to use the tensioning screws at all. So I'd certainly go back to Brooks and ask about it. 15,000 miles is only three years moderate commuting, for example - I'd certainly expect them to last much longer than that.

unterhausen

I think this is the lower range of expected life for these things. I have a vague recollection that Brooks is unapologetic and that your best bet is to get store credit. Even if you lace it, it's not a good specimen.

Tourist in MSN

On your next one, apply some Proofide to it when you think it is about 80 percent broken in, both top and bottom. That helps reduce the potential for water getting into the leather, water is the best way to hasten sagging. Do you use a waterproof cover on it when it is raining?

chandltp

You don't mention.. what problem is the sagging causing?

Wanderer

You can buy a cheap leather hole punch at Harbor Freight, and it is worth it, to get quality holes to lace through - just like factory!

JFuller

My B17 has gotten thoroughly soaked and when I rode it this way it sagged quite a bit. I've tightened the adjuster most of the way out and after a few more years it's not gotten any worse. I'm not sure if you have much more adjustment left in that screw at the nose, but I do think that the stretching will taper off so don't worry too much about saving some more threads for later.

dwmckee

how much do you weigh?

rhm

A few points:

--Lacing a saddle changes it pretty radically. Which is not to say this is a bad idea; it might be worth a try, but you will end up with a different saddle.

--The wider version of the B.17 (Champion Standard) always gets softer than the narrow version (Champion Narrow). It has nothing to do with the leather, but something about the architecture of the wider saddle.

--You can soak a too-soft saddle in water for a few hours and restore it to its original shape. I don't know exactly why, but this has the effect of hardening the leather, especially if you hasten the drying process with heat. Which is not to say this is a good idea; but it might be worth a try.

Steamer

No doubt, when it's already saggy.

But FWIW lacing a saddle prophylactically (before it sags) doesn't.(at least not in my experience)

rhm

Well, I disagree with that, but that's fine, everyone can make up their own mind about it. Try this: press down on the top of a leather saddle, that isn't laced, with your hand. As you put more weight on it, the skirt will gradually spread out. If you were on the bike, the spreading skirt will press against your inner thighs. The pressure of your thighs supports the top of the saddle, and your weight is effectively supported by a larger area of leather than is immediately apparent. Now, if you forcibly connect the skirts, as on a Brooks Swallow and the like, the skirts cannot spread out, and the top cannot sag quite so much. This makes the top of the saddle quite a bit harder, and increases the pressure on the sit bones. This may be just what the rider wants; or maybe not.

Steamer

Hmm. Could be. I laced mine a half dozen rides or so after adding my own slot cut out and the saddle hardness didn't seem to change as a result of the laces being added, but I guess I muddied the waters by changing two things at once (well, sort of).

rhm

Yes, I think that's exactly right. The typical saddle has some give in it because the skirts spread under the rider's weight. Lacing the skirts removes that flexibility. The slot in the top replaces some flexibility, especially near the slot. There's a trade-off: pressure is reduced at one area but increased elsewhere.

Judging by what's been sent to me for repair, the slot also reduces a saddle's longevity, but we're talking about a small sample size and anyway, no one seems to mind.

fietsbob

Seen People who liked the saggy B17 and did not want to replace it

after all a saddle shaped line is not a straight line . It's a Curved one.

A C 17 wont sag, It's not leather . (C 19 is out now, its wider)

thrllskr

Thanks for all the advice guys. For the time being I bought a new B17 Standard Select, registered it online for the 10 year/100,000km warranty. Ethically, with 15K miles on the saddle, I felt it was not Brooks responsibility to replace it. I got a hole punch and I am going to lace it. BTW, the leather on the Select is almost 2x as thick as the Standard