That may be true. I'll wait and see if my newish B-17 lasts as ong as my 31 y/o Pro:)

Still, compared to a Brooks, SA leather looks like chicken hide.

I can't tell a difference between the leather on my most recent B-17 and the leather on my Anatomica. The Anatomica uses a thin bit of moderate quality leather attached to a non-stretch layer of synthetic. My Brooks uses a thin layer of moderate quality leather. *shrug*

Nothing like a Brooks thread to get this forum fired up, eh?

I had my Brooks tipped up, because when it was flat, it had me sliding forward, and putting a ton of pressure on my hands. I think the tip back also encourages you to arch your back the way you should.

I first started riding after tearing a disc. It took me a while to figure out how important this riding posture was, even though it seemed very awkward at first. Of course, back advice is even more sketchy than saddle advice. In both cases, everyone has to figure out what works for them.

I believe that it is a myth, circulating around the web-based cycling community, that Brooks saddles are using inferior grade leather blanks. While no expert, I've spent some time (2 years) in a neighbor's custom leather shop, and from what I can see, there is no practical difference in the quality of older saddles vs. the ones made recently. Without exception, every Brooks I've seen is a masterpiece within it's own parameters. Buy with confidence.

The main reason, IMO, for people getting different results from this or that setup, is simply because Brooks are made of a moldable, natural material. No rider is the same, but we are all relatively similar. Brooks recommends the same starting setup for the 17 series that I do because it makes sense for that particular blank thickness. B-17's have much more "give" than Pros or other more expensive models. They have a flatter cross section and will compress more initially, whereas a Pro will not. A 17 will work for the widest type of uses, yes, even for those who have discovered that a level saddle works best, or that they like their bars a bit lower while still using a 17. This is all good.

However, there are models mentioned that typically work better for a more aggressive posture.

...a bit more bloviating:

Titanico saddles are very good quality saddles. But, they have different characteristics than a brooks, to be sure. Again, the issue revolves around a natural, moldable material. Titanico has tried to enter a niche that is populated by riders who have, for various and sometimes questionable reasons, given up on Brooks.

This is fine. However, there used to be a universal understanding among cyclists that your saddle will need some time to break in. Due to the introduction of syntheics, we have lost that patience. Titanico saddles try to address that issue with a softer leather, requiring a laminted blank. The cut-out is a good idea for those who feel the need to have one, but must surely compromise longevity in so soft a blank.

Thus Titanico saddles may need to be tensioned sooner and more often than a Brooks, which rarely, if ever need it. As long as the tension can be maintained, riders should have no real concerns with a Titanico.

NOTE: I advise against trying to soften a Brooks.

"Still, compared to a Brooks, SA leather looks like chicken hide."

Close. I believe it's Ostrich :D

I had a Brooks Team Pro on one of my bikes, had it set up so it was bang on level from front to back, used a spirit level to do this, and it was absolutely perfect. Took it off to try a more racey saddle, but considering putting it back on.

The Pro is designed for flat setup, lower bars.

I like my B17 and B17 Imperial saddles, and I'm sketchy about trying an An-Atomica after getting to check one out during a ride last year. (I think it was papawizo's bike I saw it on).

The only reason I'm averse to a more pliable saddle like the An-Atomica's leather-over-synthetic structure is because I'm Sasquatch. At 250 pounds, I'll mess up a saddle like nobody's business if it's designed around lighter riders. The B17 (with the sides laced) is the only saddle I've found that lasts me more than a year.

I've been up to 220 pounds while using the Anatomica. It's holding up nicely so far. Whether it will be good for five or ten years is anyone's guess.

Even though I know An-Atomica makes a decent product, I have the same skepticsm as CliftonGK1. For the same reason.:( My older 17 is a candidate for lacing, I think. Maybe next year...

Not necessarily.. The Flyer on my '07 Sirrus is tilted slightly upward.:thumb:

You shouldn't even feel the nose of a Brooks. Adjust it so you don't slide forward or backwards, and don't feel any pressure anywhere except your sit bones. It will break in under your sit bone.

You might have the nose too high..... or the seat too high.

I bought a new B17 and began breaking it in. At first is was very hard and uncomfortable. I put it on my trainer and started working on the position: forward-back, nose up-down, etc and through the 1st 600-700 miles was still an a** hatchet. I talked to the inventor of selle anatomica and he recommended keeping it overnight in a very damp towel and then riding for several hours the next day. I remembered Mascka's comment about riding in the rain to break in a new B17. I soaked it over-night and rode it two hours the next day and now it is the most comfortable long distance saddle I have, though if I spend any time in the drops I feel some perineal pressure. I have two selle anatomica saddles and they are both very comfortable, right out of the box, but for any distance over 40 miles (2+ hours) I prefer the Brooks.

My issue has been perineal pressure. 24 hours of numbness in the nether region after a 400 km brevet was a bit concerning, and made me glad that I already had three children and was not planning on having any more. I had been riding on a Fizzik Arrone. It is a great saddle for anything up to a century for me. I switched to a Selle Anatomica before my first 600 km last year and had great success with no pain. I will say this. In less than 3000 miles of riding I have nearly extended the tensioning bolt to its limit. The seat is comfortable, but I think there is a loss of energy transfer because of the movement of the anatomica. It is just not as stable of a platform. Does that make sense? I have ridden a Brooks Team Pro in the past. I still have it, but it has cracked at the rear rivets. I thought about getting a new one, but then decided to try the Anatomica.

Any opinions on the loss of efficiency?

BlueJay
2005 Jamis Eclipse.

It's almost axiomatic: The softer the saddle, the less energy transferred to the work. A Brooks gives the best of both characteristics needed for a long distance saddle, those being: 1) Firm, but flexible structure, and 2) slick but wicking surface for moisture transfer away from the rider. I'd try a new Pro with the following caveat:

All saddles have their limits as to comfort and I believe it is directly correlated to individual rider tolerance. Perineal pressure is a function of doing something that is not natural - riding a bike. Working out a decent setup for centuries may not be helpfull on rides longer than that, and certainly possibly not on back-to back centuries.

That's a tough assignment for any rider or saddle.

I have a Team Professional that has been a perfect fit from the first time I sat on it. It cradles my sit bones absolutely perfectly. I am building up a long distance bike and am thinking that an Imperial might be a good idea. Does the standard or narrow correlate to the build of the Team pro?

Thanks jcm...good advice. I think I will get another Pro and try it out (break it in) and see how it performs on those longer than a century rides...

Based on the posts in the PBP 2011 thread I may not want to go all that fast anyway. I will want to be comfortable and be able to enjoy the views of all my rides!!

BlueJay66

The Imperial is a modified B-17 Standard. It has a thinner blank and a flatter cross-sectional arch than a Team Pro. 17's are wider and longer than Pro's. Time will tell, but I believe that the edges of the cut-out will actually form somewhat of a radius which should increase the comfort factor on long trips. The lacing will be necessary to keep that saddle from collapsing. I would use nothing on that saddle except some clear boot polish now and again. No "softeners" or "conditioners" of any kind - including Brooks' Proofide.