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-   -   Wheels and tyres for 200km mountainous audax (https://www.bikeforums.net/long-distance-competition-ultracycling-randonneuring-endurance-cycling/843736-wheels-tyres-200km-mountainous-audax.html)

 merlinextraligh 01-15-13 02:26 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by mander (Post 14688135) If you miss the time cut on this ride it won't be because your wheels were too heavy or because your tires werent cushy enough. these things make a difference but not the hours and hours difference it will take to fill thirteen hours on a 200k.
The difference between say a 23mm Michelon Pro Race 3, (205 grams and very low rolling resistance) and SPecialized Borough CX sport 32 mm (which is spec'd on the OP's bike, and is likely well over 500 grams, and much higher rolling resistance is going to be noticeable.)

For starters, every time you astart or accelerate, you're accelerating close to an additional 2lbs. You are going to feel that, and it will add up over 120 miles.

Next, the rolling resistance will make a difference in time. Assume the rolling resistance makes a speed difference from 13mph to 13.5 mph, (and I think that's a conservative assumption, the Kruezotter calculator puts the difference at almost 1mph) the time difference is 20 minutes.

Then, climbing over 30 miles around 5% grade, the 2lb weight penality is going to cost you 5 minutes or so.

All considered, I think it's very reasonable to assume that the OP would be at least 15 minutes, and maybe 30 or more minutes slower over 120 miles on wide touring tires, than he would be on racing tires.

If you're at the edge of making the time cutoff, that 15 minutes could be critical.

Thus, if I were the OP, I'd both train, and make smart equipment choices.

 stevage 01-22-13 04:31 PM

>The difference between say a 23mm Michelon Pro Race 3, (205 grams and very low rolling resistance) and SPecialized Borough CX sport 32 mm (which is spec'd on the OP's bike, and is likely well over 500 grams, and much higher rolling resistance is going to be noticeable.)

The actual comparison is between 23mm Rubino Pro II (240g) and Vittoria Randonneur Cross Pro (450g). But the difference in wheel weight is much more - Mavic A719 etc vs Shimano R501.

For fun, I just weighed the heavy wheels. With tyres, cassette, and skewers, they're 1659g and 2388g. Just over 4 kilos of rotating mass :) I'll have to remember to weigh the new ones next time I have them off.

>
Thus, if I were the OP, I'd both train, and make smart equipment choices.

I'm happy to report I've spent much more time and effort on the training than the equipment. Kilometres ridden in Nov-Dec-Jan: 658, 1282, 917. Now fingers crossed that the event will actually take place this Sunday - bushfires are burning 50km away.

 trescojones 01-23-13 06:11 AM

Isnt the 200k classic course(buffalo, tawonga, falls ck) closer to 4000m of climbing?
The roads are good, I used to live there and rode up those places on 23mm and 25mm frequently. Personally I would avoid the weight unless you were going somewhere rougher.Apart from the inhabited places and checkpoints, the motorbikes provide water and if you carry a bottle with electrolyte concentrate, you can just squirt a bit into the bottles they give you.
Can reccomend schwalbe durano

 Rowan 01-23-13 07:15 AM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by stevage (Post 15186592) >The difference between say a 23mm Michelon Pro Race 3, (205 grams and very low rolling resistance) and SPecialized Borough CX sport 32 mm (which is spec'd on the OP's bike, and is likely well over 500 grams, and much higher rolling resistance is going to be noticeable.) The actual comparison is between 23mm Rubino Pro II (240g) and Vittoria Randonneur Cross Pro (450g). But the difference in wheel weight is much more - Mavic A719 etc vs Shimano R501. For fun, I just weighed the heavy wheels. With tyres, cassette, and skewers, they're 1659g and 2388g. Just over 4 kilos of rotating mass :) I'll have to remember to weigh the new ones next time I have them off. >Thus, if I were the OP, I'd both train, and make smart equipment choices. I'm happy to report I've spent much more time and effort on the training than the equipment. Kilometres ridden in Nov-Dec-Jan: 658, 1282, 917. Now fingers crossed that the event will actually take place this Sunday - bushfires are burning 50km away.
Good luck with the event, both in terms of it running, and your own performance. It looks like you've been putting in a mighty effort to train for it, and I'd suggest you are more than ready for the challenge.

 corwin1968 01-23-13 12:05 PM

I'm not a long-distance rider but in my experience, lighter AND higher quality tires make a significant difference in ride quality. I've ridden Specialed Nimbus Armadillos (38mm), Schwalbe Duremes (40mm) and Vittoria Hyper Randonneur (32mm). The Hypers are lighter and higher quality (120 tpi) and I highly recommend them. They've made a world of difference in perceived speed and handling for my bicycle.

 stevage 01-28-13 06:32 AM

Thought I'd report back with how it went: success! The event turned out to be a bit controversial, as the organisers had to re-route it due to a bushfire threat which had then subsided before the actual event. So instead of Bright-Falls Creek-Bright-Buffalo, they made it Bright-Bufflao three times. Since I hadn't registered yet, I just decided (with Andrew, a friend who had registered) to just run the original route anyway, self-supported, and under normal Audax conditions (starting at the normal time and place, and setting a maximum time of 13.5 hours, no outside assistance).

So I carried quite a lot of water (4-5 bottles at a time), 4 bananas (in a special banana holder hanging from the handlebars), muesli bars, sunscreen etc. Felt good up to Falls Creek, though a tiny bit slower than I hoped. Disappointed to find no convenient eating options at the top (we'd hoped to munch a sausage roll on the way down), had to grab one at the bottom instead.

The sun started to bite on the climb back up to Bright. I could feel the early stages of heatstroke, so I stopped for a few minutes at a spring to completely cool down - cold water running down your neck is amazing! Andrew was starting to lag behind me a bit by this stage, so it was a good place to regroup. We were still being very disciplined on our stops, counting the minutes and not wasting any time.

For the final climb, Mt Buffalo, we were now sharing the road with the official event. We saw a couple of our friends heading the other direction, then later bumped into one much higher up the road. Again, I was getting heat stressed so stopped at another spring to completely cool down. I was still feeling great, and started overtaking people. By this stage Andrew was slowing down, so I told him I'd see him at the top.

I was a bit under-informed on this climb, and didn't realise that towards the top, it goes over a ridge, down into a kind of crater, then keeps climbing again. By that stage I was starting to run out of energy - I'd taken a gamble on food and had fallen a bit short. The only food I had left were chocolate bars that had completely melted and weren't appealing. I started really slowing down and grinding. My guts were starting to feel weird, and for once I couldn't really tell what my body wanted - more liquid? less? more food? etc.

Anyway, I finally ground my way to the top, got a proper feed, regrouped, and we had an awesome descent. By the time we were on the valley floor, I felt amazing - completely fresh, not a hint of tiredness in my legs. I averaged over 28kph over the last 8km of slight uphill. Final time: 12 hours 8 minutes. (Although I think our route may have missed out on a one or two kilometre loop in Bright.) Diving straight into the Ovens river after finishing the event was a fantastic way to celebrate :)

Overall it was a great experience, although I'm not sure whether I really enjoyed the time pressure. It was also interesting to see the mayhem of a massive Audax event - I'm not really a crowds person, so I think I'll probably stick to self-supported rides in future, though I might follow some of the Audax routes. And I really pitied the people who'd paid their entry fee, and were obliged to follow the new route.

Oh, and the tires and wheels worked out fine :) Definitely didn't have any comfort issues from the thin tyres, even over 11 hours in the saddle. Amazingly, none of the niggles I'd had during training (sore wrist, sore knee, tight hamstrings) played up.

My Strava ride is here.

 Rowan 01-28-13 07:17 AM

Congratulations, Steve. A great effort under any circumstances.

 LWaB 01-28-13 01:02 PM

Most Audax Oz brevets don't reach 30 riders. Don't judge any other brevets by the Alpine Classic.

 trescojones 01-28-13 02:13 PM

congrats, bright buffalo 3 times is a repetitve

 dwmckee 02-01-13 10:35 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by DaHaMac (Post 14686257) I'll be switching to the Vittoria Randonneur Hyper.
You will LOVE the Vittoria Hypers. We currently ride 32s on our tandem and now I NEVER even have a thought about tires. With Panaracers, Contis and Schwalbes I was always thinking they were either too fragile, did not ride that well, were slow, etc. The Hypers are the best overall (in my opinion at least). I will be replacing tires on other bikes with Hypers when they wear out now...

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