Hi Kaneko,

First I am flattered that Hermes thinks I'm an expert. :o

shovelhd would be correct about the number of races that you need for upgrading, but unfortunately, if the Carson races that you did were CBR then they don't count (but they will in 2012). Also, the Great Park races were series races and if I remember correctly, series races do not count individually for upgrade experience. Also, Great Park was under CBR last year too.

Given your goals for this year, I would recommend doing the 55+/60+ race when it's available. I think you will learn a lot more in those races rather than the Masters 4/5 races as there are more experienced racers who use better race tactics and have better bike handling skills. There is generally no category restriction for this age group. 50+ (when available) also does not generally have a category restriction in SoCal. However, 50+ races are noticeably faster than 55+/60+ races and Masters 4/5 races.

BTW, if you haven't already, go to http://www.scnca.org/. All of the SoCal race flyers eventually end up on that site. CBR and the folks that put on the Ontario races have consistent race day schedules from event to event. However, other promoters or clubs have different categories available though all promoters are supposed to have all of the SoCal Cup categories available at a minimum.

If I was fast, like shovelhd, I'd probably race "down" an age grade for my 'A' race. However, I'm not, so my 'A' race is the one that is closest to my current age category. This year I "age up" to 55+ and in criteriums, if that race is available, that will be my first and 'A' race for the day. If 50+ is available, that will be my second race for training. Depending on the length of the races I sometimes do a third race which will be 45+ or 40+ or (heaven forbid) Cat 3. To your point of back-to-back races, I don't like doing them but sometimes I do them for the training effect.

Hope this helps.

Hey, I don't really belong on this thread as I don't race or train for races, but I just want to delurk to tell you guys that this is by far the most interesting and informative thread on the 50+ board. I don't have anything to contribute, but I do read it regularly.

As you were....

That will vary from race to race. But it shouldn't stop you in any case...I did a lot of back to back races over the years. 99% of the time there's enough time between races to roll to your car for a bottle and have someone take car of your number. You're already warmed up and really a rest isn't needed and might be a negative depending on how long you sit.

Just pin the second race number on first, then pin the first race number to that. If it's a rush the person (or you) just has to yank the top set of pins out vs. repinning a new number on there.

Look me up and say howdy if you get a moment or if you have any questions.

Never dress down for a race. Loafers or dress shoes. Pumps if you're female.

Racer X, I must be OCD as I pin numbers on different jerseys and make the switch after the first race. I like your method of pinning the second number first.

Small variation on race number pinning: Pin both numbers (one on top of the other) with one set of safety pins as Racer Ex suggests and then have someone cut off the first number around the safety pins using scissors. A bit faster than unpinning and repinning, but it does require having someone with scissors hanging around the start-finish. Oh, and make sure that you tell the person with the scissors not to run.

I've done the stacked numbers, scissors thing and I prefer to have two jerseys. I'll bring my cooler to the pit or S/F with the second jersey inside. Swap jersey, swap bottles, line up.

And Cleave, fast is relative. :)

I am not a crit racer per se so I have not comment on the multiple numbers - layer or jersey swapping. At the track, we do multiple races where each race is a different event. I am as much an aero weenie as I am a weight weenie. I use the spray glue to glue my number on my skin suit and then per regulation put in 4 pins all aligned parallel with the direction of air flow. One jersey and one number is used for all races. In one day, I may do a team pursuit, individual pursuit, 500 meters and flying 200 meters. There is not a lot of distance but my legs are cooked at the end.

Trackies spend all our time between events trying to keep our legs from tightening up and regearing and configuring track bikes. Plus checking out what equipment and gearing others are planning to use.

Thank you all for answering my question. I really appreciate it.

shovelhd: I like your suggestion of the first race being the A race and using the second race for training.

Herms: I will definitely try to race twice in a day. The first time I raced last year, I actually felt stronger in the second race (there was a 40 min break between the two races I entered.:))

Cleave: You probably don't remember.....but I actually met you once at the Greatpark race in Irvine last year. I believe that "OC Rider" introduced me to you.... I will follow your suggestion of racing 55+ as my "A" race and 50+ for training. If I am pressed for time, I may try 55+ and 30 4/5 back to back.

Racer X: I will definitely look for you and ask more questions when I have the honor of meeting you in person:)

2:30 minute ride over lunch. I left my house and rode to my wife's office. We climbed Mount San Bruno 20 minute + climb and did z4 with out of the saddle z5 ever 2 to 2:30 minutes for 30 seconds. That was hard and it is definitely not the way to score a fast climb time.

This does not happen very often in the bay area but I had a very slight tail wind on the way out and and brisk tail wind on the way home. It was a beautiful day with temps in the mid 60s.

I've always been able to use the same number when riding two races, but would definitely go the second jersey route. I'd hate to feel rushed, or need to have someone there to help.

Just finished a Met Test, and my numbers are much improved. No change in my power at LT (240w), but my LT HR is higher, my VO2Max (52) and AT VO2 (37.8) are up, and I'm about 5 points lower in RER at comparable efforts compared to last test. Definitely more efficient metabolically due to all the base miles. What I need to read up on, or ask about, is how LT power correlates to FTP. I thought they were pretty much two perspectives on the same thing, but I'm certain my FTP is well above 240w. It's possible it's due to the 'steps' used in the Met Test, which jumps from 240w to 270w, with only 3 minutes at each level.

Nice lunch, Hermes!

Hi Kaneko,

Now that you related the story, yes, I remember you. My teammate was impressed that people knew of me from the internet. ;)

Hello All,

Back to the track tonight to see how much better I feel after a day off the bike. I am prepared to go easy again tonight if I am still tired. I want to ride through this recovery period rather than get off the bike for a few days.

I am glad that you remember me. It still amazes me how the internet connects people nowadays.:D

Once again, thank you for you suggestion and I will probably see you somewhere in Carson/Ontario/Santiago Canyon in March:thumb:

Rode the fixie outside in the dark tonight for 36 miles. It was a pleasant 36 degrees, with dry roads, but there was a 12 mph wind that I had to deal with including one stretch of 6 miles directly into the wind. The ride was supposed to be a WU then 1.5 hrs of Z3. Everything went well until I reached down to get my first drink about 30 minutes into the ride and discovered that I left my bottles at home. I probably had some fatigue in the muscles from last night's trainer class and lack of fluids on the ride and ended with cramps in both calves about 4 miles from finishing. I was able to make it home as long as I was unclipped and only pushed down on the pedals. After working up a good sweat the last few very easy miles had me really getting cold.

I've actually done better the other way around, but we don't always get to choose.

My first USAC win was the second race.

My first NRC/USA Crits win was the second race.

I also had a better result on the second race, but this result was probably irrelevant since I didn't ( and still don't) know exactly how to warm up properly for the first race.:lol:

At this point. I am just hoping that I can finish both races with the main pack. I will be happy as long as I don't get dropped.:o

AZT, Was the Met test done in a lab and was it on your Trek with your Quarq PM?

AJ. I thought you were retired or semi retired. Why are you riding in the dark?

Cleave, I am sure your track session went well. BTW, last week when I was at HDC, I rode behind Roger Young for one of the sessions. He looks like he might be a good draft but when he is in the aero position, it was typical for any rider. However, he does ride very smooth and right on the black line. It was good team pursuit practice.

After my ride yesterday, I went to the gym for a leg, upper body and core workout plus a long foam roller and stretching routine. This AM, I am a little cooked but today is a rest day.

I am retired then rehired to work 3 days/week, on Tue, Wed and Thur. I love the 4 day weekends and my coach usually schedules recovery or easy rides on Fri and Mondays. That works very nicely with traveling or fishing. If the weather is decent I would rather suffer outside and save the indoor rides for really bad days.