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Ghetto Tubeless Help

Old 10-23-16, 03:26 PM
  #1  
Jixr
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Ghetto Tubeless Help

I picked up a new to me MTB and after reading all about the praise of tubeless I decided to give the ghetto way a try.


First I tried the gorilla tape method, and after two layers my tire is still pretty loose on the wheel, Seems most people don't have to add several layers to create a seasl, so not sure if i should keep adding layers.


I was going to do the bmx tube way, but my rim valve hole is too small for schrader.



Should i just keep adding layers of tape to the rim until the wheel sits on there snug?
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Old 10-23-16, 05:05 PM
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You can get bmx tubes with presta valves. On the other hand I don't think a few more wraps of tape would hurt either. Trial and error.
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Old 10-23-16, 05:09 PM
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I just wrapped a few more layers of gorilla tape, and one finishing layer of electrical and that seems to have sealed it.
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Old 10-25-16, 12:40 PM
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When I do tubeless, I always use the 1" Gorilla tape, clean the rim of all previous tape, wrap the tape once around the wheel (I don't trim the tape or do anything special), insert the presta valve, throw the tire on, add 2oz of sealant, inflate.

Works every time. I've done two mtbs (stans arch rims, sun ringle inferno 25) this way and two road bikes (enve 3.4, dt swiss r24 spline) this way.

For the rims that were tubeless ready, I ripped out the stans tape and the dt swiss tape - had issues with both leaking around the valve, the Gorilla tape never has this issue.

The gorilla tape works so great, I'm going to try to setup the rest of my nontubeless wheels up with it.
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Old 10-25-16, 07:50 PM
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When it leaks air repeatedly and you give up try the split tube method using 20" Continental or Qtubes with removable valve cores. Trim the sides so they come all the way up to the rim bead hooks. You're not saving any weight using Gorilla tape because more than half of the tube is discarded, and the usable section is stretched thin. This method of 'ghetto' is superior to rim strips because it's a custom fit.

Last edited by Clem von Jones; 10-25-16 at 08:30 PM.
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Old 10-25-16, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Jixr View Post
I picked up a new to me MTB and after reading all about the praise of tubeless I decided to give the ghetto way a try.


First I tried the gorilla tape method, and after two layers my tire is still pretty loose on the wheel, Seems most people don't have to add several layers to create a seasl, so not sure if i should keep adding layers.


I was going to do the bmx tube way, but my rim valve hole is too small for schrader.



Should i just keep adding layers of tape to the rim until the wheel sits on there snug?
I might be a little confused but isn't the tape there merely to seal the spoke holes and not there to fit the wheel more snuggly? If your tire is 'loose' then that might be an issue with the rim itself or the tire not being as compatible as it could be with your rims.

Are your rims tubeless compatible? Tires too? Is more tape supposed to get the tire to seal better while pumping up the tire?

I just went tubeless on my 2016 Trance 2 that came with tubeless compatible rims and Knobby Nics which are not supposed to be tubeless compatible (I think) but the task was really easy and I put it down to the rims being ready to go tubeless.

I think if both tires and rims are tubeless ready you shouldn't need many layers of tape Gorilla or otherwise.
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Old 10-25-16, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by LHawes View Post
I might be a little confused but isn't the tape there merely to seal the spoke holes and not there to fit the wheel more snuggly? If your tire is 'loose' then that might be an issue with the rim itself or the tire not being as compatible as it could be with your rims.

Are your rims tubeless compatible? Tires too? Is more tape supposed to get the tire to seal better while pumping up the tire?

I just went tubeless on my 2016 Trance 2 that came with tubeless compatible rims and Knobby Nics which are not supposed to be tubeless compatible (I think) but the task was really easy and I put it down to the rims being ready to go tubeless.

I think if both tires and rims are tubeless ready you shouldn't need many layers of tape Gorilla or otherwise.
The Schwalbe Performance line (made for use with tubes) usually work great tubeless. DANGER- If the tires aren't tight at the bead-rim junction before inflation don't use them tubeless on your front wheel! On the front it's critical your tire doesn't burp air. The beads on the Schwalbe Performance line have fully rubberized beads identical to the Evo Tubeless line, no leaky bare thread carcass as seen on some other brands.

Last edited by Clem von Jones; 10-25-16 at 08:33 PM.
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Old 10-25-16, 08:46 PM
  #8  
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Originally Posted by Clem von Jones View Post
The Schwalbe Performance line (made for use with tubes) usually work great tubeless.
They work, they don't work well. I've got a Hans Dampf EVO and Performance. The Performance uses 3x the sealant, looses air significantly faster, and won't stay seated if the pressure drops.
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Old 11-07-16, 08:58 PM
  #9  
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Not staying seated if the pressure drops is a serious flaw that should not be ignored. Can you get it re-seated on the trail after a puncture? Probably not. Well, maybe so. If you are a cowboy, maybe.

What I do is cut my Gorilla tape narrow and build up the center of the rim bed, leaving space between the rim edge for the tire's bead to sit. Then I'll cover the whole thing in slick tubeless tape. Yes, it makes putting on tubeless tires hard. But the bead is then locked in, and I will never burp. Also it makes seating tires very easy.
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Old 11-07-16, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Not staying seated if the pressure drops is a serious flaw that should not be ignored. Can you get it re-seated on the trail after a puncture? Probably not. Well, maybe so. If you are a cowboy, maybe.

What I do is cut my Gorilla tape narrow and build up the center of the rim bed, leaving space between the rim edge for the tire's bead to sit. Then I'll cover the whole thing in slick tubeless tape. Yes, it makes putting on tubeless tires hard. But the bead is then locked in, and I will never burp. Also it makes seating tires very easy.

Or you can build up good rims and use tubeless-ready tires and not have to McIver your setup with multiple layers of tape of different widths.

KISS.
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Old 11-07-16, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by pholuvr View Post
Or you can build up good rims and use tubeless-ready tires and not have to McIver your setup with multiple layers of tape of different widths.

KISS.
Or why spend $150 on new rims and spokes when you could just make the ones you have work for $15 and an hour of labor?

ECONOMICS.
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Old 11-07-16, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Or why spend $150 on new rims and spokes when you could just make the ones you have work for $15 and an hour of labor?

ECONOMICS.
I would never spend $150 on new rims and spokes. That's crazy. They would get destroyed and be less fun.

Instead, I buy the right rim the first time around, like 5 years ago, so I don't have to kludge together a wonky tubeless setup.

PLANNING.
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Old 11-08-16, 12:04 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Not staying seated if the pressure drops is a serious flaw that should not be ignored. Can you get it re-seated on the trail after a puncture? Probably not. Well, maybe so. If you are a cowboy, maybe.

What I do is cut my Gorilla tape narrow and build up the center of the rim bed, leaving space between the rim edge for the tire's bead to sit. Then I'll cover the whole thing in slick tubeless tape. Yes, it makes putting on tubeless tires hard. But the bead is then locked in, and I will never burp. Also it makes seating tires very easy.
Meh. If the tire gets cut sufficiently badly that it looses all pressure and un-seats, you're going to installing a tube.

I'd love to get tubeless rims, but I bought the bike used, and getting a similar quality wheelset would be $500+ which just isn't worth it for 26in rims.
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Old 11-08-16, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by pholuvr View Post
I would never spend $150 on new rims and spokes. That's crazy. They would get destroyed and be less fun.

Instead, I buy the right rim the first time around, like 5 years ago, so I don't have to kludge together a wonky tubeless setup.

PLANNING.
Oooh, ok. You can spend a brazillion dollars if it makes you happy. But this is mountain biking, not an important sport like road riding, so why spend where you don't have to?

PRIORITIES.

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Old 11-08-16, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Oooh, ok. You can spend a brazillion dollars if it makes you happy.
Again, it's about having more fun than I can have on $150 rims.

SIMPLE.
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Old 11-11-16, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Oooh, ok. You can spend a brazillion dollars if it makes you happy. But this is mountain biking, not an important sport like road riding, so why spend where you don't have to?

PRIORITIES.

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Old 12-08-16, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Not staying seated if the pressure drops is a serious flaw that should not be ignored. Can you get it re-seated on the trail after a puncture? Probably not. Well, maybe so. If you are a cowboy, maybe.

What I do is cut my Gorilla tape narrow and build up the center of the rim bed, leaving space between the rim edge for the tire's bead to sit. Then I'll cover the whole thing in slick tubeless tape. Yes, it makes putting on tubeless tires hard. But the bead is then locked in, and I will never burp. Also it makes seating tires very easy.
By the time you have added THAT much tape (weight), what's the point? All that hassle to lose literally a few grams of rotational weight.

Choose the correct rim/tire setup and do it right. Just my opinion
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Old 12-10-16, 10:47 AM
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Its like 20 grams.
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Old 12-14-16, 04:23 PM
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Buy tubes, I always go back to tubes.
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Old 12-18-16, 12:22 AM
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What's with all this 'multiple layers of tape/split tube up the rim sides' business? Has anyone looked at what comes on Stan's kits? A roll of tape to cover the spoke holes, and a rubber strip only slightly wider than a standard rim strip.
A couple layers of electrical tape to cover the rim bed where the strip goes, and whatever method works for you to install a valve. You can buy presta valve inserts, Stan's strips, or adapt a tube.
Use automotive fix-a-flat to coat the inside of the tire. Spray it in, roll the tire around so the nasty-smelling stuff coats the inner casing, let dry.
I'm also betting you could use the fix-a-flat instead of Stan's solution or caffeelatex.
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Old 12-18-16, 12:49 AM
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Stan's is here in town, so on a ride I got to listen to one of the Stan's guys go on and on about how Ghetto tubeless is dangerous. Which is pretty funny, since that's how Stan's got their start.

I don't like the tern Ghetto tubeless, and it's just another example of Central Pennsylvanians blaming their own intellectual shortcomings on other people.

I have to say at this point there is no reason not to run tubeless ready tires and rims. I know people have run non-tubeless tire/rim combos tubeless without incident, but a significant number of people have had problems.

Originally Posted by Currmudge View Post
I'm also betting you could use the fix-a-flat instead of Stan's solution or caffeelatex.
there are a lot of home sealant recipes out there. I like the Bontrager sealant though. Doesn't seem to make squids as bad as Stans does and it has mica flakes in it for better flat sealing.

Last edited by unterhausen; 12-18-16 at 12:53 AM.
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Old 12-18-16, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Currmudge View Post
A couple layers of electrical tape to cover the rim bed where the strip goes, and whatever method works for you to install a valve. You can buy presta valve inserts, Stan's strips, or adapt a tube..
Continental Race 28 tubes from Ribble, $26 for 10. Cut it down to make a tubeless valve. $2.60 per valve vs $8 for Stans.
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Old 12-18-16, 03:50 PM
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I did a totally different way of going "tubeless". Instead of tape and a separate valve, I cut a tube the long way down the middle, kept it towards the spoke side of the rim, reseated the tire, added sealant and inflated.
So far, no issues at all after about 8 rides. I'm going to do this again with my fat bike but I read that they recommend applying a layer of foam (construction sill sealer type foam) first, then the split tube and mount the tire. Cut away and excess tube that protrudes. This method may not save much weight but it does assure a good seal and reduce the chance of a pinch flat.
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