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Crappy tires or am I just doing something wrong?

Old 08-08-10, 07:41 PM
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rodeopunk_je87
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Crappy tires or am I just doing something wrong?

So I just got back into mountain biking and I bought an '09 Trek 4300...I took it to some trails and I like to ride particularly fast. Now, when going down hill on a turn, I notice I just don't get that good of traction. I even wiped out a couple of times where my back wheel went out. Are the stock tires any good? Should I upgrade tires or just accept that going downhill into a turn fast is just not gonna happen without my back end going out. Any recommended tires?
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Old 08-08-10, 07:50 PM
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you should be able to make turns, so it sounds like your tires are not the best, that happens. i ride continental rubber queen tires (https://www.conti-online.com/generato..._queen_en.html) and they are AWESOME, but they work for me where i live. it also depends on where you ride, what type of terrain you ride. what works for me here might not work for you where you are. ask your local bike shop what is the best tires to use where you are. good luck.
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Old 08-09-10, 01:18 AM
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Most stock tires are decent. One question to ask: what tire pressures are you using? The recommended PSI on the sides are usually too high on most tires. To gain traction, low pressure is your friend.
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Old 08-09-10, 08:40 AM
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You may be riding like a coarse brute and may be able to refine your technique to maximize tire performance, but there are many types of tires with different tread patterns that may be better suited to your style and trail conditions.

Without seeing how you ride, only you know if you need to work on technique and judgement, or if you need new rubber. That said, I'm sure you can find a new tire to perform better.
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Old 08-09-10, 09:06 AM
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I moved from road to mtn and have the same problem with the '10 Trek 4300 (same tires as the '09 I think). AFAIK these are not the best tires around and that combined with n00bishness on my part equals bad traction. I've reversed the tread on my rear tire, haven't done any serious trails since but I do seem to be getting better grip. Will be my first upgrade though, these seem very shreddy (for the lack of a better word).
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Old 08-09-10, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by pablosnazzy View Post
you should be able to make turns, so it sounds like your tires are not the best, that happens. i ride continental rubber queen tires (https://www.conti-online.com/generato..._queen_en.html) and they are AWESOME, but they work for me where i live. it also depends on where you ride, what type of terrain you ride. what works for me here might not work for you where you are. ask your local bike shop what is the best tires to use where you are. good luck.
Well, I live in Chicago so I do mostly single track with hard compact dirt, lots of tree roots and rocks and some gravel, and some moist areas. Don't do too much asphalt except for training near my house. Based on what I've read on the link you provided, that tire seems right on the money; soft, good for cornering and wet roots and rocks. I'm definitely gonna have to find a set of these....thanks!


Originally Posted by commo_soulja View Post
Most stock tires are decent. One question to ask: what tire pressures are you using? The recommended PSI on the sides are usually too high on most tires. To gain traction, low pressure is your friend.
Well the guy at the LBS told me to keep it at 65psi...is that high or low? What time pressure do you recommend for best traction but that's not too low that I will hit my rim on a hard root or rock?


Originally Posted by chaadster View Post
You may be riding like a coarse brute and may be able to refine your technique to maximize tire performance, but there are many types of tires with different tread patterns that may be better suited to your style and trail conditions.

Without seeing how you ride, only you know if you need to work on technique and judgement, or if you need new rubber. That said, I'm sure you can find a new tire to perform better.
Well, I tried a couple of different ways of taking the corner (although I'm no expert at techniques) but in all I found that I really need to slow down alot. I found that if I avoid standing up to high, I have a little better control. So I know I sorta need to crouch but when I lean and crouch, that's when my back tire wipes out.



Originally Posted by kitteh View Post
I moved from road to mtn and have the same problem with the '10 Trek 4300 (same tires as the '09 I think). AFAIK these are not the best tires around and that combined with n00bishness on my part equals bad traction. I've reversed the tread on my rear tire, haven't done any serious trails since but I do seem to be getting better grip. Will be my first upgrade though, these seem very shreddy (for the lack of a better word).
Hmmm...I never thought about reversing the tire...now please excuse my ignorance but when you reversed it, did you just take the rim and tire off the bike and turn it around or did you actually take the tire off the rim and turn that around? But yes, I'm almost certain we have the exact same tire.



Thank you all, again, for all your help!
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Old 08-09-10, 10:17 AM
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I suggest you go to a place where mountain bikers congregate and ask them what types of tires they like. You'll probably get several answers, but if you find someone who sounds sensible and who actually asks about you as a rider, go with their recommendation. You may need to try several different tires before you develop a sense of what works for you.

I've found that every time I ask for advice about equipment I get lots of different answers. The best way to answer my question is to try several of them and learn. It's expensive, but fun.
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Old 08-09-10, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by rodeopunk_je87 View Post
...............
Well the guy at the LBS told me to keep it at 65psi...is that high or low? What time pressure do you recommend for best traction but that's not too low that I will hit my rim on a hard root or rock?
.......
65psi?!??!!? wow, that seems pretty high. do your tires bounce all over? i would say try 50 psi, but it also depends on how much you weigh and such.
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Old 08-09-10, 11:05 PM
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You can't actually flip the wheel, the cassette needs to stay on the right side, right? You need to pull it off the rim and change direction. There's a little arrow on the sidewalls pointing towards the correct direction, if you're confused at any point.
I think BigBlueToe is very correct, you should speak to experienced local riders since tire choice is very surface dependant and they'd know much better.
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Old 08-09-10, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by rodeopunk_je87 View Post
Well the guy at the LBS told me to keep it at 65psi...is that high or low? What time pressure do you recommend for best traction but that's not too low that I will hit my rim on a hard root or rock?!
Way too high, start at ~45psi. Slowly work your way down by 2psi increments until traction is no longer improved, it feels mushy while turning, or you start hitting the rim or getting pinch flats.
YMMV. I weigh 250, run at ~35psi with no issues. I've seen posts where people weigh 170, and pinch out at >40. I believe that is due to riding style.
Keep at it. You'll get it.
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Old 08-11-10, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by BigBlueToe View Post
I suggest you go to a place where mountain bikers congregate and ask them what types of tires they like. You'll probably get several answers, but if you find someone who sounds sensible and who actually asks about you as a rider, go with their recommendation. You may need to try several different tires before you develop a sense of what works for you.

I've found that every time I ask for advice about equipment I get lots of different answers. The best way to answer my question is to try several of them and learn. It's expensive, but fun.
If only money wasn't an issue lol....I know they get together a lot on the weekends, so I'll probably have to swing by and ask.....Thanks



Originally Posted by pablosnazzy View Post
65psi?!??!!? wow, that seems pretty high. do your tires bounce all over? i would say try 50 psi, but it also depends on how much you weigh and such.
You know, I thought 65psi was a little high...I mean, I know they're completely different things but my main hobby is racing cars in Autocross and even then, when my tires are hot I run max 41-43 psi....I just thought 65 seemed too much but how can I argue with an expert, right? I weigh 162.




Originally Posted by kitteh View Post
You can't actually flip the wheel, the cassette needs to stay on the right side, right? You need to pull it off the rim and change direction. There's a little arrow on the sidewalls pointing towards the correct direction, if you're confused at any point.
I think BigBlueToe is very correct, you should speak to experienced local riders since tire choice is very surface dependant and they'd know much better.
lol....can you totally tell I'm a noob?....you're right. I think I'm gonna give this a try while I save some cash for the tires Pablosnazzy recommended.


Originally Posted by Scrockern8r View Post
Way too high, start at ~45psi. Slowly work your way down by 2psi increments until traction is no longer improved, it feels mushy while turning, or you start hitting the rim or getting pinch flats.
YMMV. I weigh 250, run at ~35psi with no issues. I've seen posts where people weigh 170, and pinch out at >40. I believe that is due to riding style.
Keep at it. You'll get it.
Well, I do definitely ride hard so I'll start around 45 psi...


I'm planning on hitting the trail this week or next week so I'll keep you guys posted! Thanks again!
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Old 08-11-10, 10:15 AM
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Tires are like women. Some you can hop on and ride long and hard right away. Some you need to go easy with and coax performance from them. Sounds like you have the latter. Try working with the pressure. I run 40-45 psi, ride similar terrain and weigh a little more than you. Good traction, few pinch flats.
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Old 08-11-10, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by junkyard View Post
Tires are like women.
Originally Posted by junkyard View Post
I run 40-45 psi
Sounds oddly like a blow up doll.
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Old 08-12-10, 10:36 AM
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Nah, 40-45 psi would never work.
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Old 08-12-10, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by pablosnazzy View Post
65psi?!??!!? wow, that seems pretty high. do your tires bounce all over? i would say try 50 psi, but it also depends on how much you weigh and such.
As I was reading this thread my first thought was tire pressure. I ride with mine at 35 - 40psi. If you are pumping them up much higher than the wheels are going to bounce around. I'm assuming your trails are smooth and hard packed. If there are any rocks, sand, roots, soft stuff, you really need to drop the tire pressure.
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Old 08-12-10, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by junkyard View Post
Tires are like women. Some you can hop on and ride long and hard right away. Some you need to go easy with and coax performance from them. Sounds like you have the latter. Try working with the pressure. I run 40-45 psi, ride similar terrain and weigh a little more than you. Good traction, few pinch flats.
The second one sounds like a pain in the ass...lol



Originally Posted by Pamestique View Post
As I was reading this thread my first thought was tire pressure. I ride with mine at 35 - 40psi. If you are pumping them up much higher than the wheels are going to bounce around. I'm assuming your trails are smooth and hard packed. If there are any rocks, sand, roots, soft stuff, you really need to drop the tire pressure.
Yeah, trails are really hard packed.
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Old 08-12-10, 06:45 PM
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So which tires are on there now?
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Old 08-18-10, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by electrik View Post
So which tires are on there now?
I'll have to check. But it's the tire that comes with the 2009 Trek 4300.




So I dropped my tire pressure down to about 38 and it definitely helped but now I'm certain the tires I'm using are more for an easy rider who rides his bike at the local park. I took my bike to a very technical trail today and confirmed that I just need a set of hardcore tires. I'm probably gonna go with the Rubber Queen but I'm gonna wait a month or so and put some heavy use on the ones I have right now (no sense in letting them go to waste, right?)

By the way, just bought the dang bike and my rear derailleur is already getting some heavy wear. Just not shifting like it did when I bought the bike a couple of weeks ago.

Thanks for all the input guys!
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Old 08-18-10, 11:16 PM
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I think that's about some stretching. Either the cables or chain. Experiencing the same thing here. Heading to the LBS this Saturday possibly. I've worked with RDs so if it's just that I need to fiddle around with I'll do it myself. Ideas please?
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Old 08-19-10, 08:03 AM
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How wide are your tires?. I'm guessing 2.1's. Try to fit 2.3s for more traction and grip.
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Old 08-19-10, 01:30 PM
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Personally I think wider tires are a pain but for awhile I rode with WTB VelociRaptors 2.3's - they were definitely "grippy" and could ride over just about anything... not the fastest tires around, but grippy. I now ride with Kenda Nevegal 2.1 and love them! Tire still grips but more responsive.
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Old 08-19-10, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Pamestique View Post
Personally I think wider tires are a pain but for awhile I rode with WTB VelociRaptors 2.3's - they were definitely "grippy" and could ride over just about anything... not the fastest tires around, but grippy. I now ride with Kenda Nevegal 2.1 and love them! Tire still grips but more responsive.
From what I've read, I hear VelociRaptors are best for very hot climates because it's a pretty hard tire. I see you live in Cali so would you recommend it for the midwest? Our trails don't get as hot and we have Fall season coming up.
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Old 08-19-10, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by rodeopunk_je87 View Post
From what I've read, I hear VelociRaptors are best for very hot climates because it's a pretty hard tire. I see you live in Cali so would you recommend it for the midwest? Our trails don't get as hot and we have Fall season coming up.
As stated by earlier posts in this thread...talk to local shops and riders to see what tires the locals prefer. People half the country away aren't going to be able to give you a good recommendation.
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Old 08-19-10, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by kitteh View Post
I think that's about some stretching. Either the cables or chain. Experiencing the same thing here. Heading to the LBS this Saturday possibly. I've worked with RDs so if it's just that I need to fiddle around with I'll do it myself. Ideas please?
You just need to turn the barrel adjuster CCW to take out some cable slack.
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Old 08-19-10, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by never View Post
People half the country away aren't going to be able to give you a good recommendation.
Oh, shucks, I do it all the time .

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