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khuon 09-09-06 12:58 PM


Originally Posted by Dogbait

Hmmm... Interesting. I'm not sure I like it. I think it may cause confusion. It essentially allows one form of vehicular travel to treat the traffic control signals as a yield while at the other time requiring others to treat them as full-stops. I never saw anything wrong with the laws that required cyclists to act like other motor vehicles at a stoplight or stopsign.

knary 09-09-06 06:25 PM

NE Portland, just off Alberta. I work at home, so no commutes. Mentoring the miniscule TNT team doing the Peach in a couple weeks.

capsicum 09-09-06 07:35 PM

Hmmm I like it. Most of the energy and time loss, in town, is stopping completely all the time. And bicycles don't always trigger lights, so that's cool too.

There are a lot of stop signs that should actually be yield signs(and vise versa) and plenty of lights that would be better as 4 way stops, of course that would require some drivers ed. and traffic enforcement other than the old revenue collecting speed trap.

donnamb 09-09-06 11:56 PM


Originally Posted by khuon
Hmmm... Interesting. I'm not sure I like it. I think it may cause confusion. It essentially allows one form of vehicular travel to treat the traffic control signals as a yield while at the other time requiring others to treat them as full-stops. I never saw anything wrong with the laws that required cyclists to act like other motor vehicles at a stoplight or stopsign.

Ah, but what about a state with a total population of about 1.5 million? The great thing about our federal system is that laws can be tailored to work in specific areas. I would like to see it tried in Oregon, but I suspect it would work very well in the less populated areas and perhaps less well in the larger cities.

dmotoguy 09-10-06 12:05 AM

I live in Idaho as you can see.. and the stop sign / stop light laws here are AWESOME... never seemed to cause any confussion with motorists or cyclists.. its pretty simple.. stop if you need to (cars w/ right of way) and dont stop if you dont need to ( no cars)

treating stoplights like four way stops is helpfull too.. sucks being caught at a light that wont change w/o that right.

The smoke finally cleared.. it was causing lots of people problems, we had the second worst air in the country for a few days because of it.

quatrecats 09-10-06 09:26 AM

That stop sign law--I think it engenders bad cycling habits--I already see so many cyclists who flaunt the rules of the road, causing enmity among auto drivers--and this just seems like another way to 'break the rules'. It could work with a great community education plan, but I have my doubts. [though there is one light in Moscow that just won't work for me on my bike, so I end up going across on the red--makes me feel somewhat criminal]. A pet peeve of mine is cyclists who cannot decide if they are pedestrians or motorists, and try to be both, but as a driver, I cannot read their minds and see when they make their choices..maybe this comes from living in one university town and working in another--that influx of students who don't seem to be aware of their surroundings...........

donnamb 09-10-06 12:27 PM


Originally Posted by quatrecats
maybe this comes from living in one university town and working in another--that influx of students who don't seem to be aware of their surroundings...........

I shudder at the bad cycling habits I picked up in college. I have no idea what was going on in my brain back then. I think that's a huge factor for you. I don't want to minimize your experiences where you live, but if people in other parts of ID see the new law as a success but not so in your university town, I'd be inclined to think the law is working out anyway.

I'm wondering if such a law would work in OR if cities above a certain population could choose to opt out of the red light aspect of the law, kind of like no right turn on red in NYC. In Portland, the stop sign part seems reasonable, but I'm not so sure about the red light part. However, riding in a small town in OR with small populations is another matter. There's the other issue in OR about the number of cyclists in Portland and some other cities increasing like never before. Just like when a minority group of any stripe increases, the majority feels threatened, and so there has been a lot of stuff going on. Tempers in both groups are running high and patience is thin. This may not be an ideal time to push such legislation even if it is reasonable - we may find the backlash is worse than the benefits of such a law.

I don't think our bicycle advocacy groups in OR have even decided if they want to support anything like this in the coming legislative session, so I'm just speculating here. I do appreciate reading about everyone's personal experiences with the ID law, though, and hope to read more. Thanks!

dmotoguy 09-10-06 03:13 PM

one thing about the red light part... i RARELY see it used, and almost never do so myself, but im always happy for it when i use it.

stringbreaker 09-10-06 08:37 PM

Hey East hill
Where is a good place to hit the Soos Creek trail? I'm in Sumner and want to try some different trails around other than the foothills and interurban. How is the trail? Is it paved or gravel or a little of both? Hows the terrain rolling hills, flat or a bit of both. Thanks

Gus Riley 09-10-06 09:33 PM


Originally Posted by norsehabanero
yakima wa middle of the state

I heard we lost Jim Pomeroy? He was a motocross icon back in the 70s and 80s. :(

Gus Riley 09-10-06 09:36 PM

I see a few locations that I am very familar with here. I grew up on Vashon Island, but lived in Manchester and Port Orchard for some time as well. All these are located in western Washington across the Puget Sound from Seattle or in Vashon's case across from Tacoma. Beautiful areas to cycle in.

jamesjems 09-10-06 11:13 PM

I hail from San Juan Island, Washington. No shoulders, 7/8th inch Chip-Sealed roads and some beautiful scenery. Nice rides, if you don't mind sharing the road w/cars who often mind sharing the road with us.


JimmyA 09-11-06 03:04 PM

Northgate area of Seattle - commute to first hill.


bertt 09-11-06 06:11 PM

I'm in Battleground about 10 miles northeast of Vancouver.

PedalMasher 09-11-06 09:31 PM

SW Pdx near Multnomah Village. Downtown 20 minutes/Wine Country 20 minutes....

East Hill 09-12-06 04:55 AM

Stringbreaker--you can put into Big Soos at quite a few places--the Lake Meridian end or the parking lot on 208th are the most popular. The paved trail itself is only approximately 4.5 miles one way (additional trail is being built as funds allow) with the topography being mostly flat with a few undulations and one steep, but short bit by the Lake Meridian end. If you park at the 208th parking lot it's possible to round out your road experience by going east up 208th--it ends at 148th SE--go south to SE 224th, east again at 224th, and continue on 224th until you hit Peter Grubb Road, head south on Peter Grubb Road, turns into SE 232nd. I usually head south on 196th SE, head back west on SE 240th, which takes you back to a spot where you can rejoin Big Soos Trail. This route garners you some rather steeper hills if you want to stay on the road (some stretches may be a bit narrow on the shoulder!). Going east on 208th will also run you into the Lake Youngs watershed, which has a nice, fairly tame doubletrack for mountain bikes going around the 9.5 miles odd reservoir loop. I have done a fairly comprehensive ride (on the mountain bike) by starting at home, down 208th to Lake Youngs, done the loop, headed back to 224th to Peter Grubb back to Big Soos, headed south on Big Soos to Lake Meridian, taken my life in my hands by heading west on Kent-Kangley (actually SE 272nd at Lake Meridian), heading south on 116th then going down the 277th Recreational Corridor [note: bicycles are NOT allowed on 277th. You must go up to the overpass for 277th, go left across the bridge, make immediate right down the Corridor], turn north on Green River Road, eventually connecting up with the Interurban Trail/Green River Trail--your choice. As noted on the RouteSlip map, the Green River choice adds a flush toilet. I go back to the East Hill usually heading east on 212th where it crosses either the Interurban or Green River Trail, north on 84th, east on 212th. 212th is very steep, winding, and narrow at this point. I normally turn left at 92nd Avenue South, which curves around to turn into South 200th Street. You can head north on "108th" (better known as Benson to the locals), then east on 192nd, south on 140th, and east one last time on 208th to get back to the parking lot at Big Soos Creek. This route has been immortalized on RouteSlip (

Big Soos itself has amenities such as water and a flush toilet at the 208th parking lot. There's also a small picnic area/child's playground at the 208th end. Most of the early morning pedestrians/joggers/dog walkers are relatively well trained to a "on your left". Mind the mums with the baby strollers! I can't speak for the afternoon crowd, but I suspect that's when you will also find the horse riders. The horse riders do not ride on the main MUP for the most part, but on a parallel trail.

East Hill

yonderboy 09-12-06 04:36 PM

I recently moved to the West Slope (about 3 miles from Downtown) from Vancouver. I'm liking the riding around Washington Park, but I miss riding up in Battleground and Yacolt. I'll probably hit up the NRR rides this winter over in Fisher's Landing. I think Team Oregon leads rides from somewhere in Hillsboro.

And I could have sworn the stop-sign law has always been that way in Idaho. At least, the one time I got pulled over in Moscow on a bike was for not slowing down enough before running a stop sign on the UofI campus. We'll see how the stop-light law works out for the few brakeless fixed gear riders I saw on the east side of town. :)

Dogbait 09-12-06 05:46 PM


a lot of THESE rides leave from either 235th and Evergreen in Hillsboro or NW Bethany Bl. just south of Laidlaw.... should be close to you. I have not been on any of these rides but they look interesting.

stringbreaker 09-13-06 09:06 PM

Lanky lass I used to live behind Lake youngs elementary school but that wasin the late 70's early 80's I know that area has changed a lot (ie) more traffic but I'd like to get up that way and ride one of these days. Have you ridden out near Lake Wilderness any? what is it like out there now

HardyWeinberg 09-14-06 05:30 PM

Olympia, commute to Lacey

East Hill 09-15-06 09:42 AM

Well stringbreaker, you are certainly familiar with the trail around the watershed, then! I don't think the road layout has changed much, but the amount of housing and the traffic have increased tremendously. I don't head over to Lake Wilderness much for that reason. I have ridden over to Maple Valley via SE 240th, but I don't care much for riding in Maple Valley as it's very, very busy nowadays. It's also a bit out of the way. It is possible to connect up with the Cedar River Trail though...

East Hill

indy 09-15-06 03:59 PM

I'm in Fairview, Oregon (North of Gresham, West of Troutdale). I've always ridden occasionally. I'm currently in the middle of a divorce though, so I'm riding a lot more now and plan on keeping up with it. Typically will ride about an hour each evening right after work, and a bit more on weekends maybe. I'll ride to work, which is only couple of miles but all up hill one way (x2 round trips because I go home for lunch), in the summer because I can get away with more casual wear then, but not so much during the school year. I work for a school district as a supervisor for their transportation department. My ride is an early 2000's Trek Navigator 3000 which suits my rides, some pavement, some off pavement, and rarely ride more than 20 miles at a time. I ride to feel fresh air and sun on my face, and to enjoy the beauty of the outdoors while getting some good exercise. I probably won't post much, but wanted to say hello and thank those with more knowledge than me who do post here.


tstartrekdude 09-16-06 11:36 AM

i live in richland wa and am a Junior

ollo_ollo 09-16-06 08:39 PM

I live in Olympia, WA about 4 miles North East of the Capitol Dome. Before I retired, I commuted to Lacey (small town right next to Oly). Previously, we lived in Kingston, off Point No Point Rd & commuted to Seattle via the Bainbridge ferry.

Bekologist 09-19-06 07:26 AM

transportational cycling Seattle and the Greater Puget Sound area for the last decade and a half. Currently work at Seattle's #1 family owned bike shop.

Range far and wide on the weekends, finding many, many 36-'er weekend rides to my liking door-to-door from the puget sound basin. you can get WAY OUT IN THE STICKS riding a bike from seattle in a day, trust me....

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