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Blood Clots / Deep Vein Thrombosis anyone?

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Blood Clots / Deep Vein Thrombosis anyone?

Old 01-20-14, 09:09 AM
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By the way, air travel per se isn't the problem, it's restricted movement. People can have DVT's after sitting at cramped desks (generally using computers) for hours without moving their legs enough to help keep blood from pooling in the veins.
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Old 01-20-14, 09:15 AM
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"He’s not doing the genetic test right now since there’s no history of blood clots either."

Not a wise conclusion. Most people with Factor V Leiden never develop clots.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-c...n/con-20032637
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Old 01-20-14, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by moth54
By the way, air travel per se isn't the problem, it's restricted movement. People can have DVT's after sitting at cramped desks (generally using computers) for hours without moving their legs enough to help keep blood from pooling in the veins.
Largely true. The effect that lengthy flights as opposed to sitting at a desk adds is dehydration. That can be a big factor though. Looking back, I used to do Toronto -Tel Aviv or Toronto- Istanbul flights (14-15 hours) without getting out of the chair. Holy dehydration batman!
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Old 01-20-14, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by moth54
"He’s not doing the genetic test right now since there’s no history of blood clots either."

Not a wise conclusion. Most people with Factor V Leiden never develop clots.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-c...n/con-20032637
I agree. If not for you, it may be beneficial for your children to know. It is in the genes..
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Old 01-20-14, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by JanMM
Current education for patients on warfarin in many US hospitals includes the advice to eat a consistent amount of vitamin K-containing foods (the leafy greens mentioned above).. Avoiding them is ok if done consistently. Sometimes simpler to just avoid them.

https://www.ahrq.gov/patients-consume...ls/btpills.pdf
https://www.stoptheclot.org/news/article197.htm
I was 42 and developed DVT in one leg while recovering from a broken shoulder blade. Blood clots caused by broken bones are fairly common. I ended up having the vein removed due to a damaged valve and it was the lesser of many evils....thus "one good leg". I still get Edema every once in a while, it's usually from sitting with my legs tucked behind me. It slows the circulation in the remaining veins when I do that.

My mother has also spent most of her life suffering from issues related to misdiagnosed DVT. She has a Thrombin III deficiency, I do not. She was one of the trial subjects when they were developing some of the precursors to Warfarin.

Professionally, I work in the Pharmacuetical industry in regulatory compliance.

I hate that there are so many doctors who are perfectly content to stick their patients on Warfarin, because it's easier for the doctor. After seeing all of the problems that my mother has had, despite some of the wonder drugs the pharma industry has developed over the years, I went a different route during my recovery and basically refused to stay on Warfarin long term. I sought out natural foods that would do the same thing, I specifically stick to foods that have a higher nutrient density. My primary care physician disputed that route, however the vascular specialist she referred me to didn't have an issue with it once he realized that I had done my homework on a diet plan. Since, I wasn't fully recovered from the broken shoulder blade, I had a lot of time on hands to do my research. Some of the foods they tell you to avoid while on Warfarin are some of the best foods for treating the condition and maintaining proper vascular health. Some remove/break down plaque in the vascular system, some help to keep the venal and arterial walls elastic and some are natural blood thinners. Warfarin only does one of those. It's not a solution or cure, it's a finger in the hole in the dam.

I eat very healthy and bike 26 miles a day as a full time commuter. It took along time for my leg to come back, the better part of 2 years, but it has recovered and I rarely have issues now, and all of those seem related to my having one less vein in my lower leg.

I'm not familiar with Clexane, but I have injected Lovenox. I was on it for a short time after I was released from the hospital. I'm not good with needles, especially into the stomach, which was the injection site.
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Old 01-20-14, 01:50 PM
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I have had pulmonary embolisms twice after surgeries which caused some loss of lung function. I had DVT's behind both knees the last time and was kept off the bike until I could walk without pulling an Oxygen tank. I am on anti-coagulants for life. Each time the pulmonologist and cardiologist let me back on the bike as soon as I was able. I am 71 and still coming back from the last episode. Fitness levels still suffer but are coming back. My Strava over 65+ times on segments with some downhill are approaching the leaders. I will no longer do criteriums due to the high probability of crashes/ internal bleeding and am not up to TT level yet. I will continue trying to get in 200 mi. weeks and doing hilly rides. Once there is no concern about traveling clots, there should be no riding restrictions. Incidentally I have an IVC (Inferior Vena Cava) filter installed in veins before the heart which will grab any clots I might produce (only a problem if going off those blood thinners for some kind of surgical procedure). Additionally see a Hematologist to be tested to see if you have a genetic proclivity to produce clots (factor V Liden). Start riding as soon as you are allowed. The longer you wait the more fitness you will lose and we all know how much those "comebacks" hurt.
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Old 01-20-14, 09:23 PM
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Maybe I'll ask my doctor about the genetic test in the near future. Right now I'm more concerned with getting the immediate blood clot problem under control and in remission/cured so it doesn't mushroom into something else. The genetic test can wait a while - I have no offspring, my siblings (all older than me by a few years) haven't had any issues, and no history of DVT in relatives. As for diet, post-college I've always just kept it pretty healthly with minimal junk food (doesn't everyone like a cheeseburger once in a while?) and I'm highly skeptical of all the self-proclaimed nutrition experts out there promoting breakthrough specialty diet plans.
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Old 01-20-14, 09:52 PM
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I had a similar experience to some of the posts above. After a long drive out east, I was playing racquetball while experiencing gut-wrenching pain in my right leg. The next morning, I came out of the shower and my R.N. wife took one look at my swollen leg and said you have a blood clot. The doctor later confirmed that. He tested me for the above mentioned "Factor V Leiden". The test returned positive. It's genetic and often shows up in the early 40's. Mine didn't appear until i was in my latter 40's - largely due to the cycling that I do - so said the doctor.

After 10 days of Lovelox and a few weeks of Cumedin, I was back on the bike. Thankfully, I am off the statins now and take a full-sized aspirin every day. Skidder & others, the Factor V Leiden test may be worthwhile.
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Old 01-20-14, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by moth54
"He’s not doing the genetic test right now since there’s no history of blood clots either."

Not a wise conclusion. Most people with Factor V Leiden never develop clots.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-c...n/con-20032637
Right. Until two individuals with one mutation marry, and both pass on a copy of that mutation to a son/daughter. That's what happened with me. I have two copies of both the Factor 5 Leiden and MTHFR genes. My problems started with superficial clots in my lower legs that the docs didn't think were serious. Then I wound up with a large clot in my lung and that finally got the testing done. I'm on Warfarin for life, but I don't seem to have any serious adverse effects from the Warfarin. It makes your skin thinner and easier to bruise or tear but I don't have any fatigue from it.
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Old 01-21-14, 02:32 AM
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Mine is the MTHFR gene.

And it wasn't until I was hospitalised, that I found out that all sorts of relatives on both sides of the family had blood clots. I suspect my parents are both have one copy of the gene ... and lucky me got both!
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Old 01-21-14, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Machka
Mine is the MTHFR gene.

And it wasn't until I was hospitalised, that I found out that all sorts of relatives on both sides of the family had blood clots. I suspect my parents are both have one copy of the gene ... and lucky me got both!
Sounds like we have a fair number of the gene issues covered. In my case, double F5 Leiden (homozygous) and Lupus Inhibitors.
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Old 01-22-14, 02:45 PM
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Here are a few notes about my experience with DVT:

- Extremely painful for about a week after warfarin treatment began. The pain subsided quite slowly after that. Mine was in my left leg, multiple blockages.

- The only side effect I noticed from the warfarin was that it made my skin more fragile, more susceptible to cutting and tearing.

- After 4 1/2 months on warfarin, and still taking it, I talked my Dr into clearing me to ride. I rode 140 miles that week. I continued to take the warfarin for another 3 1/2 month and rode lots.

- I have become convinced, and even more so after reading accounts in this thread, that lack of proper hydration is a factor in causing and/or recovery from DVT.
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Old 01-22-14, 07:05 PM
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Hope all you folks on anticoagulants are wearing medic alert bracelets riding.
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Old 01-23-14, 02:06 AM
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Originally Posted by jdon
Hope all you folks on anticoagulants are wearing medic alert bracelets riding.
I had one ... I've still got it somewhere ...
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Old 01-23-14, 08:16 AM
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Originally Posted by jdon
Hope all you folks on anticoagulants are wearing medic alert bracelets riding.

I swear by my roadid bracelet. Lets me keep all medical info up to date as it changes.
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Old 01-24-14, 01:01 PM
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Been there done them 3 times. They found that I have ?Linden factor 4? I think it is called. Otherwise known as "predisposition to early death" syndrome. I'm on Warfarin now and will be on some kind of blood thinner forever. Also have the vena cava filter. Follow Drs advice and ride when you can. Personally, I think bike riding is very helpful. It makes my legs feel great and has diminished my varicose veins; which BTW are great places to birth a clot.
In the grand scheme of things the clotting is not too bad to deal with. I've met people without any legs at all.
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Old 01-24-14, 02:27 PM
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Pain in the calf-for no good reason- in a middle aged person .
But bike riders-and everyone else-will "think back" to some EXTREMELY MINOR injury- and ascribe it to that
so they wait until it gets worse
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Old 01-25-14, 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted by LongKayak
I swear by my roadid bracelet. Lets me keep all medical info up to date as it changes.
Assuming you need the info in an area with good internet and they folks there have time to use it....... RoadID has good marketing. Not so sure actual performance under critical circumstances matches.
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Old 01-25-14, 07:13 PM
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For the 23 years I've spent working in the hospital, blood clots have been a constant problem especially in patients who spend most of their time being inactive. Some patients have no choice but to sit or lay most of the time due to other debilitating illnesses which limit movement. The truth is, clots originate deep in the large veins of the lower legs. Here, the clots that are formed rarely pose any problems because the veins which contain the clot(s) are large. The reason for concern is if they begin to migrate upwards. You see, the diameter of the veins at the area of the lower legs are approximately the size of your thumb allowing the clot to move easily however when the clot reaches the lungs the pulmonary vein decreases in size that closely measures the size of a pinhead. Once the clot lodges inside the series of pinhead vessels, all of the vascularity up stream is immediately deprived of blood and oxygen which almost always ends in instant death. Although common prescribed medications such as Warfarin, Lovenox, Vitamin k, etc... is available, I prefer a once a day 81 mg. aspirin. Although there has been a recent study suggesting aspirin may not prevent a heart attack, it will thin the blood if properly taken. Also keep in mind that most prescription blood thinners are prescribed based on the status of the clot so they are usually given based on preventing a clot versus treating a clot that has already formed and is moving.( A venous Doppler study can be ordered to confirm location and movement ) Those who are currently suffering with clots and who continue to exercise regularly should consider having a filter implanted. Filters catch clots when they reach a particular region of the body that are considered adverse to its movement and will in fact help to "melt" the clot so that further migration, or potential damage that can occur are arrested. Your pulmonologist can give you the latest information on blood clots and the available treatment for them. Always remember to talk to your doctor first before attempting any plans to self medicate with any medication, vitamins, or remedies as these can potentially adversely react with each other causing further problems.
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Old 01-25-14, 07:21 PM
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For the 23 years I've spent working in the hospital, blood clots have been a constant problem especially in patients who spend most of their time being inactive. Some patients have no choice but to sit or lay most of the time due to other debilitating illnesses which limit movement. The truth is, clots originate deep in the large veins of the lower legs. Here, the clots that are formed rarely pose any problems because the veins which contain the clot(s) are large. The reason for concern is if they begin to migrate upwards. You see, the diameter of the veins at the area of the lower legs are approximately the size of your thumb allowing the clot to move easily however when the clot reaches the lungs the pulmonary vein decreases in size that closely measures the size of a pinhead. Once the clot lodges inside the series of pinhead vessels, all of the vascularity up stream is immediately deprived of blood and oxygen which almost always ends in instant death. Although common prescribed medications such as Warfarin, Lovenox, Vitamin k, etc... is available, I prefer a once a day 81 mg. aspirin. Although there has been a recent study suggesting aspirin may not prevent a heart attack, it will thin the blood if properly taken. Also keep in mind that most prescription blood thinners are prescribed based on the status of the clot so they are usually given based on preventing a clot versus treating a clot that has already formed and is moving.( A venous Doppler study can be ordered to confirm location and movement ) Those who are currently suffering with clots and who continue to exercise regularly should consider having a filter implanted. Filters catch clots when they reach a particular region of the body that are considered adverse to its movement and will in fact help to "melt" the clot so that further migration, or potential damage that can occur are arrested. Your pulmonologist can give you the latest information on blood clots and the available treatment for them. Always remember to talk to your doctor first before attempting any plans to self medicate with any medication, vitamins, or remedies as these can potentially adversely react with each other causing further problems.
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Old 01-25-14, 07:24 PM
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According to the speciialist that Machka consulted, aspirin is pointless if you have any predisposition to DVT. This was in reply to a very direct question about it, because I have been taking aspirin since a heart issue more than 15 years ago (I was invited by the specialist to sit in on the consultation).

Largish doses of folate are the preferred course of action in cases similar to Machka's.
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Old 01-25-14, 07:37 PM
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Aspirin has recently been added to the list of recommended VTE (DVT and PE) prophylaxis measures for some orthopedic procedures in US hospitals (primarily total hip and knee replacements) but not for other surgeries or for other hospitalized patients.
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Old 01-25-14, 07:59 PM
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Juzos 20-30 mmHg. Don't leave home without them.

Anyone wear compression stockings when they ride?
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Old 01-26-14, 12:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Dudelsack
Anyone wear compression stockings when they ride?
No ... too hot and itchy.
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Old 01-26-14, 03:23 AM
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One of the things that emerged from our treatment options for Machka was that you have to discuss your needs for compression stockings with someone who actually does know what is required and is prepared to do the footwork, so to speak, to get what is required.

I didn't know that compressions stocking should have a differential compression pressure between various parts of the leg. These are not generally available off the rack, and may have to be specially ordered... and can cost a small fortune.

For example, the first pharmacist Machka discussed this with handed her a pair of standard compression stockings, and virtually ridiculed her in a quite nasty way when she suggested that differential compression stockings were what she required.
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