Why African athletes haven't dominated our sport?
#151
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The first African team to join the World Tour will likely be Dimension Data. Their marquee riders are European, but the team is developing African cyclists (about half of the roster), some have had results already.
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I don't know about the rest of you but I don't want to see any one people to dominate any sport. Cycling is obviously a Euro sport and always has been. It would be a bummer to me if Africans started winning every race, but I wouldn't seeing some competition coming from that segment of the world. Only white people would ask such a question as "why don't blacks dominate cycling?" LOL. I doubt blacks sit around asking why Asians don't dominate the NBA! Seriously though, I think that cycling is quiet a bit different from marathons. Cycling is as much about strategy and planning as it is about outright endurance...
#153
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You need the endurance, and you need to plan and strategize your particular race, and you need to be able to execute and/or adjust your plan, in BOTH sports. Ask around, primarily the Kenyans...
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Says who?
I detect a little bit of "blacks don't make good quarterbacks" in that argument... but the fact that you state that running at the elite level doesn't involve (or not as much) strategy and planning (and tactics!) shows how much you know about running...
You need the endurance, and you need to plan and strategize your particular race, and you need to be able to execute and/or adjust your plan, in BOTH sports. Ask around, primarily the Kenyans...
I detect a little bit of "blacks don't make good quarterbacks" in that argument... but the fact that you state that running at the elite level doesn't involve (or not as much) strategy and planning (and tactics!) shows how much you know about running...
You need the endurance, and you need to plan and strategize your particular race, and you need to be able to execute and/or adjust your plan, in BOTH sports. Ask around, primarily the Kenyans...
#155
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Well, and how much do you? Unless you are a pro, your knowledge about about pro cycling is second hand, via reading up on the sport, and hearing what a friend of a friend of a friend of a pro said, forums, mags, etc., etc., pretty much like the rest of us here. So are you a pro? A semi-pro? No? Then you are a dedicated enthusiast at best like 99% of the rest of us here.
Good for you! So did I. You have friends in high-running-places? Great! So do I.
Many years ago a friend of mine (Olympian, 1984 Los Angeles, and member of the Panamanian national team) went to meet Tony Dees, who explained to us the concept of "floating" on a 400 meter race ("floating" would be akin to "coasting" in cycling) and a whole lot of strategy and race preparation concepts. Another friend of mine (ex-Olympian too) would always be telling me about how athletes "feel" one another on an endurance race... there are "tactics" involved, believe it or not. Is the course flat or hilly? Does my main opponent have a stronger kick than I on that last 100-200 meters? When should I attack him? When should I hold off and just match stride for stride? Watch a marathon race or you'll see the runners looking at each other, looking for signs of fatigue or other indicators to let them know when is the right moment to go. You'll see members of African nations sometimes talking to one another and cooking up strategies on the spot.
When the competition is weak, all the strongest runners have to do is go because no one will catch them, but when the field is more even there are a whole other factors involved than just "keeping pace".
I respectfully disagree. You may not have team cars with directors talking to the runners and all that stuff, but running does take much more preparation, planning and execution during a race than just moving one leg after the other and hoping to get to the finish line first.
Agreed, the two sports are not the same, one glaring difference being that pro-cycling is a "team" sport whereas running tends to be more individual and even then there are cases of one runner "rabbit-ing" for another or for a whole pack. But I don't think that is necessarily the point of this thread, but rather, since "African" athletes (or perhaps we should also include African-descendant athletes from other nations, like African-Americans) have excelled at many sports, marathons in particular, (also track and field, as well as baseball, basketball, football) what are or may be the factors keeping them from making their mark in cycling as well. I believe it is primarily a problem of "exposure" to the sport, or barriers of entry, like cost, culture, access to training, facilities, equipment, races, etc. When you play the numbers game, the fact that you don't see many "Africans" in the pro-peloton yet is because there is a very small percentage of racers from that "racial" group. Not every one makes it to the pro ranks, and then of those that do, not everyone rises to the "elite" level. So the more that "Africans" get into cycling the better the odds that some of them might rise to the level of a true GC contender one day.
The most important thing is whether or not they can develop the "engine"; the rest can be learned, and I have no doubt that they (African riders) can, or anyone else. But if they don't have the engine, in the words of "he who cannot be named"... "motivation can only take you so far if you don't have the legs".
I hope that pro-cycling becomes more of an international sport and not just primarily an "European" one. Imagine what it would do to the cycling industry/markets in Asia or worldwide if a "Chris-Yao" or "Alberto-Wung" or even Teklehaimanot all of a sudden started getting into the mix with the big dogs at the TdF!
So it's not that "Africans" can't make it in cycling, but rather that they haven't tried in sufficient numbers, and so here we are all asking why might that be, of course, only the white ones among us that is.
Many years ago a friend of mine (Olympian, 1984 Los Angeles, and member of the Panamanian national team) went to meet Tony Dees, who explained to us the concept of "floating" on a 400 meter race ("floating" would be akin to "coasting" in cycling) and a whole lot of strategy and race preparation concepts. Another friend of mine (ex-Olympian too) would always be telling me about how athletes "feel" one another on an endurance race... there are "tactics" involved, believe it or not. Is the course flat or hilly? Does my main opponent have a stronger kick than I on that last 100-200 meters? When should I attack him? When should I hold off and just match stride for stride? Watch a marathon race or you'll see the runners looking at each other, looking for signs of fatigue or other indicators to let them know when is the right moment to go. You'll see members of African nations sometimes talking to one another and cooking up strategies on the spot.
When the competition is weak, all the strongest runners have to do is go because no one will catch them, but when the field is more even there are a whole other factors involved than just "keeping pace".
It's nothing like cycling. I'm not saying that Africans can't or won't see any success in pro cycling. We've already seen some success from the likes of Teklehaimanot. I was simply saying that the Kenyan domination of the Marathon world doesn't automatically translate to success in cycling. Its a different ballgame. That's all.
The most important thing is whether or not they can develop the "engine"; the rest can be learned, and I have no doubt that they (African riders) can, or anyone else. But if they don't have the engine, in the words of "he who cannot be named"... "motivation can only take you so far if you don't have the legs".
I hope that pro-cycling becomes more of an international sport and not just primarily an "European" one. Imagine what it would do to the cycling industry/markets in Asia or worldwide if a "Chris-Yao" or "Alberto-Wung" or even Teklehaimanot all of a sudden started getting into the mix with the big dogs at the TdF!
So it's not that "Africans" can't make it in cycling, but rather that they haven't tried in sufficient numbers, and so here we are all asking why might that be, of course, only the white ones among us that is.
#156
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Genetic diversity gets less the further Humans got away from Africa.. where every one came from ..
#157
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This is just an idiotic thread, dripping of racism, classism...let it die.
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That was well worth being the first reply to a thread in more than 2 weeks. It's the off-season, these things will take time to fade from the first page. Start a thread about cyclocross if you must.
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I'll go back to my crankpants arena...
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If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
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