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Sagan was completely exonerated

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Old 12-07-17, 10:55 AM
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kcblair
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Sagan was completely exonerated

ROADBIKERIDER has the news release. "All parties agreed that "the crash was an unfortunate and unintentional race incident and that the UCI Commissaires made their decision based on their best judgment in the circumstances."KB
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Old 12-07-17, 11:04 AM
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not in cycling's best interest to make a villain out of Sagan. he blocked with his elbow as a reaction to Cavendish's pass attempt. again, imo it was a reaction not a conscious action

they can say what they want, you don't throw your elbow out like that when racing in close quarters

still hate that he didn't get to finish the tour
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Old 12-07-17, 11:10 AM
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Old 12-07-17, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
not in cycling's best interest to make a villain out of Sagan. he blocked with his elbow as a reaction to Cavendish's pass attempt. again, imo it was a reaction not a conscious action

they can say what they want, you don't throw your elbow out like that when racing in close quarters

still hate that he didn't get to finish the tour



Perhaps you haven't watched some of the hours of youtube slo-mo analysis.
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Old 12-07-17, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
not in cycling's best interest to make a villain out of Sagan. he blocked with his elbow as a reaction to Cavendish's pass attempt. again, imo it was a reaction not a conscious action

they can say what they want, you don't throw your elbow out like that when racing in close quarters

still hate that he didn't get to finish the tour
I'm guessing you didn't see the entire footage starting long before the famous last seconds and Cavendish's crash (and thar footage taken from in front). This started with Sagan on the French rider's wheel almost at the center of the wide finishiing stretch. That fottage was taken from the left side of the road. You can just barely see Cavendish next to the far right barriers even with Sagan but several bike lengths to the right. The French rider with Sagan on his wheel came way, way over to box Cavendish in.

Yes, Sagan did nothing intentional to harm Cavendish but: Cavendish has established his lane long before and Sagan did not remotely hold his line. Cavendish established his lane maybe half a minute before and Sagan moved over 15 feet or more. Yes Sagan was ahead of Cavendish but they were overlapped the entire time. That space belonged to Cavendish and he was under no obligation to yield. (And Cavendish being as fierce a competitor as he is and basically a feral cat, he didn't and instead pushed Sagan as hard as he could to keep from crashing. Sadly for Cavendish, Saga was a little bigger, stronger and didn't move.)

Sagan was disqualified for not holding his line and causing real injury to another rider, knocking that rider out of the Tour. We can argue the penalty but DSQ is not unreasonable. Sagan served his DSQ. This latest does not exonerate him. All it does is put this to bed.

Ben
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Old 12-07-17, 11:56 AM
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Old 12-07-17, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by woodcraft View Post
Perhaps you haven't watched some of the hours of youtube slo-mo analysis.
Now would be a good time to link to the best.
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Old 12-07-17, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Bat56 View Post
Now would be a good time to link to the best.




Disagree with 79pmooney- Cavendish was not overlapped w/ Sagan the whole time. He came from behind. It makes no difference what line he established 30 seconds before & 5 bike lengths behind.

After moving right, Sagan doesn't get closer to barriers until Cavendish pushes into him.

Last edited by woodcraft; 12-07-17 at 03:40 PM.
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Old 12-07-17, 04:57 PM
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I don't need the UCI to tell me what I saw with my own eyes.
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Old 12-07-17, 06:00 PM
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First time I've seen that breakdown. Why couldn't UCI do this prior to taking action ? Sad. KB
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Old 12-07-17, 06:05 PM
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It is a little late for saying "oops".

Had they given him a penalty of an hour or something, then he would have been able to continue riding, sprint finishes might still have become more cordial, and they could have argued while the race was still on whether or not it was an accident, there was intent, or if Sagan even elbowed Cavendish. Perhaps scheduled a mini hearing during the following rest day.

Two riders plunged into a single hole. The lead rider on the road side came out, the following rider on the wall side didn't. If I remember right, it wasn't as much that Sagan was moving right, but the whole field was moving right, and if anybody should be criticized for not holding the lane, it would have been the left most rider of the whole pack (oh, and one rider that madly cut left to avoid the whole thing, cutting across several others).
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Old 12-07-17, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
It is a little late for saying "oops".

Had they given him a penalty of an hour or something, then he would have been able to continue riding, sprint finishes might still have become more cordial, and they could have argued while the race was still on whether or not it was an accident, there was intent, or if Sagan even elbowed Cavendish. Perhaps scheduled a mini hearing during the following rest day.

Two riders plunged into a single hole. The lead rider on the road side came out, the following rider on the wall side didn't. If I remember right, it wasn't as much that Sagan was moving right, but the whole field was moving right, and if anybody should be criticized for not holding the lane, it would have been the left most rider of the whole pack (oh, and one rider that madly cut left to avoid the whole thing, cutting across several others).
Not to rehash again but Cav tried to squeeze into a hole he left open in the first place and continued to butt his way up, doesn't matter if only sagan moved right, he was ahead.
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Old 12-07-17, 08:03 PM
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Didn't we already have this argument? Viewing all the shots and angles, I find the conclusion that Sagan was wholly innocent to be inescapable. It was a bad call.
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Old 12-07-17, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by jon c. View Post
Didn't we already have this argument? Viewing all the shots and angles, I find the conclusion that Sagan was wholly innocent to be inescapable. It was a bad call.
yup
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Old 12-08-17, 06:31 AM
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Sagan is going to kick some ass next year
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Old 12-11-17, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by jon c. View Post
Didn't we already have this argument? Viewing all the shots and angles, I find the conclusion that Sagan was wholly innocent to be inescapable. It was a bad call.


Yes, we did. And so did the UCI. They made the statement as a way to "fix" their error which was pretty clear when viewing from all angles. Reading Sagan's statement, sounds to me that the UCI wrote that for him. PC crap.


I'm not a Sagan fan, and what I've found is there are three reasons people still think he did something wrong.


1. The hate Sagan
2. They didn't watch all of the videos and that they have slow eyes, i.e they cannot see that Cav was already wrecking and out of control and Sagan's elbow was a result of Cav ****ing up next to him...not blocking.
3. Go back to 1.
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Old 12-12-17, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
not in cycling's best interest to make a villain out of Sagan. he blocked with his elbow as a reaction to Cavendish's pass attempt. again, imo it was a reaction not a conscious action

they can say what they want, you don't throw your elbow out like that when racing in close quarters

still hate that he didn't get to finish the tour
This is also what I have to say whenever they say Sagan's elbow was intentional.
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Old 12-18-17, 05:43 PM
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The punishment didn't fit the crime and obviously too late to fix now. What should have happened is he get docked enough points to make it impossible for him to have won the green jersey but allowed him to remain in the race and fine the hell out of him.
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Old 12-18-17, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by gpsblake View Post
The punishment didn't fit the crime and obviously too late to fix now. What should have happened is he get docked enough points to make it impossible for him to have won the green jersey but allowed him to remain in the race and fine the hell out of him.
What should have happened was nothing. A crazed competor dove for a closing hole, lost control, and crashed into Sagan, and nearly hooked Sagan off his bike with his shifter .... why should Sagan get penalized?
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Old 12-22-17, 01:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
What should have happened was nothing. A crazed competor dove for a closing hole, lost control, and crashed into Sagan, and nearly hooked Sagan off his bike with his shifter .... why should Sagan get penalized?
That's about it. Any fair viewing of the evidence would have sent Cav some flowers and moved on without penalty to Sagan. Unfortunately, there were clearly some folks who wanted to stop Sagan's run of green at almost any cost, and not all of them pinned on numbers.
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