Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Professional Cycling For the Fans
Reload this Page >

2021 Vuelta á España...straight, no chaser

Notices
Professional Cycling For the Fans Follow the Tour de France,the Giro de Italia, the Spring Classics, or other professional cycling races? Here's your home...

2021 Vuelta á España...straight, no chaser

Old 08-28-21, 12:36 PM
  #76  
surak
Senior Member
 
surak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,610

Bikes: Specialized Roubaix, Canyon Inflite AL SLX, Priority Continuum Onyx, Santana Vision, Kent Dual-Drive Tandem

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked 544 Times in 312 Posts
Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
Also, we've all had tons of sympathy for Jakobsen, coming back from his crash in Poland. But he burnt up some good will in that moment after the race.
Sprinters especially have to be singularly focused when they're tapped for a stage, and expect the team around them to deliver them to the last few hundred meters. ​​​​​​It makes them naturally not team players on the day. ​​​​​​I think it's pretty common for a sprinter to be upset when things don't go his way, especially since the team surely wants him to take the points jersey at this race. It would surprise me (and undoubtedly annoy Lefevre) if he were blase about getting dropped. Cav's explosion toward the team mechanic near the end of the TdF was worse, but emotions run high at grand tours especially with the effects of fatigue draining rational thinking, so I give them a pass as long as they regain their levelheadedness after some recovery.

I don't know his exact frame of mind, but Jakobsen surely doesn't want what happened yesterday to ever happen again, so he makes it a point to communicate what he saw as the mistake made. It's up to Senechal to decide if he's sincere and not bearing a grudge, because if it's his good will toward Jakobsen that's lost, then Fabio's damaged part of the leadout train he needs to not just make it to the end of the Vuelta, but potentially many more sprints in the future.
surak is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 12:57 PM
  #77  
MinnMan
Senior Member
 
MinnMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,435

Bikes: 2020 Salsa Warbird GRX 600, 2020 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX disc 9.0 Di2, 2020 Catrike Eola, 2016 Masi cxgr, 2011, Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3153 Post(s)
Liked 2,061 Times in 1,231 Posts
I rather liked what Alpecin-Fenix was doing early in the TdF, where Philipsen and Merlier were clearly trying to share the glory. Merlier won that sprint stage on Philipsen's lead out, even though Philipsen is surely the stronger sprinter.

I do recognize that that isn't normal, but if a guy wins a stage of the a grand tour, it's one of the highlights of his life. Give him props and then let him have it on the bus, out of sight of the public.
MinnMan is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 03:27 PM
  #78  
surak
Senior Member
 
surak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,610

Bikes: Specialized Roubaix, Canyon Inflite AL SLX, Priority Continuum Onyx, Santana Vision, Kent Dual-Drive Tandem

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked 544 Times in 312 Posts
Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
I rather liked what Alpecin-Fenix was doing early in the TdF, where Philipsen and Merlier were clearly trying to share the glory. Merlier won that sprint stage on Philipsen's lead out, even though Philipsen is surely the stronger sprinter.
The way I remember it, Merlier was widely considered to be faster on flatter stages, while Philipsen was more of a threat for the points jersey because he lacked the top speed but could get over the mountains. The pundits excoriated AF for trying too hard to spread the love because they wasted Merlier on leadout duty and missed out on more sprint wins. Unlike Merlier, Philipsen repeatedly showed that he could not beat Cavendish, and the points he got for consistently finishing behind Cav were all for nothing because DQT took full advantage of AF's waffling with their total commitment to Cav for sprints and the green jersey.
​​​​
surak is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 03:43 PM
  #79  
MinnMan
Senior Member
 
MinnMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,435

Bikes: 2020 Salsa Warbird GRX 600, 2020 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX disc 9.0 Di2, 2020 Catrike Eola, 2016 Masi cxgr, 2011, Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3153 Post(s)
Liked 2,061 Times in 1,231 Posts
Originally Posted by surak View Post
The way I remember it, Merlier was widely considered to be faster on flatter stages, while Philipsen was more of a threat for the points jersey because he lacked the top speed but could get over the mountains. The pundits excoriated AF for trying too hard to spread the love because they wasted Merlier on leadout duty and missed out on more sprint wins. Unlike Merlier, Philipsen repeatedly showed that he could not beat Cavendish, and the points he got for consistently finishing behind Cav were all for nothing because DQT took full advantage of AF's waffling with their total commitment to Cav for sprints and the green jersey.
​​​​
well, remember that Merlier left the tour after stage 9 from physical exhaustion. He left the Giro mid-way through for the same reason. You can't blame Alpecin Fenix for not betting on him as their main man.
MinnMan is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 04:07 PM
  #80  
surak
Senior Member
 
surak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,610

Bikes: Specialized Roubaix, Canyon Inflite AL SLX, Priority Continuum Onyx, Santana Vision, Kent Dual-Drive Tandem

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked 544 Times in 312 Posts
Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
well, remember that Merlier left the tour after stage 9 from physical exhaustion. He left the Giro mid-way through for the same reason. You can't blame Alpecin Fenix for not betting on him as their main man.
There were 2 bunch sprints before Merlier bowed out that AF wasted thinking they could spread the wins Oprah-style ("you get a stage win, and you get a stage win, and you get a stage win!"). They also wasted their advantage of not needing him to save energy for a full campaign, which MvdP showed could be quite a significant one. I don't think it was ever in the cards for Merlier to slog up many climbs, but if in the unlikeliest of cases they expected him to reach Paris, it wouldn't have made any sense to have him burn his matches on lead-out duty. Cav was able to reach Paris in green through a total teamwide commitment to helping him conserve his energy, carrying everything for him up the mountains, hydrating and feeding him, and making it so all he had to think about was pedaling to make the time cut. Contrast to that, Jakobsen was hung out to dry and do his own work before the Vuelta had even hit the big mountains.
surak is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 04:35 PM
  #81  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
Nice find, surak , of the hot wash in the post-race control zone.

Here's another one where Jakobsen is all "didn't have the legs" vs. wah wah mechanical. From extremely limited forensics, that "mechanical" thing does seem to be conjecture from various commentators looking for something to say rather than a story that was floated by the real players.

I haven't caught up to today's stage yet so nothing new here, and I won't belabor the prior day any more.
slcbob is offline  
Old 08-28-21, 10:03 PM
  #82  
MinnMan
Senior Member
 
MinnMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,435

Bikes: 2020 Salsa Warbird GRX 600, 2020 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX disc 9.0 Di2, 2020 Catrike Eola, 2016 Masi cxgr, 2011, Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3153 Post(s)
Liked 2,061 Times in 1,231 Posts
Originally Posted by surak View Post

Back to today's stage- Jay Vine continues to impress. I wonder how much of his immediate splash at the World Tour level is due to being an unknown quantity that helps him keep a low-profile and get into situations where he's a real threat. For sure, the rest of the pros will now know that he has immense ability and isn't just a virtual cycling sideshow act. Showing off that level of being right up there at the end of hard stages is bringing him well-deserved attention.
Yeah, Jay Vine wowed everybody. His crash against his team director's car was kind of a rookie self-own, but after cutting himself up he made his way back to the action - that took strength and guts.

By definition, the Zwift Acad. deal was a 1 year contract. I wonder if he'll stay with Alpecin Fenix?

(Edit: Just read that he's signed a 2 year extension.)

I just found out he's from Canberra- my old stomping grounds. Surely he cut his cycling teeth doing hill repeats on Black Mountain.

Last edited by MinnMan; 08-28-21 at 10:23 PM.
MinnMan is offline  
Old 08-29-21, 08:50 AM
  #83  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
Originally Posted by ooga-booga View Post
it's a jazz thing that predates the coachella valley band by approx four decades. and no, not a fan. queen? yes. stones? yes. qotsa? no.
slcbob is offline  
Likes For slcbob:
Old 08-31-21, 01:03 PM
  #84  
MinnMan
Senior Member
 
MinnMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,435

Bikes: 2020 Salsa Warbird GRX 600, 2020 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX disc 9.0 Di2, 2020 Catrike Eola, 2016 Masi cxgr, 2011, Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3153 Post(s)
Liked 2,061 Times in 1,231 Posts
I'm not going to start a separate thread, but is anyone also keeping an eye on the Benelux tour? Lots of talent there, and some drama too.

Is Evenpoel just having a bad year or should we relinquish all those great expectations? Maybe he's not fully recovered from that crash, or maybe he won't ever....
MinnMan is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 12:12 AM
  #85  
ooga-booga
lead on, macduff!
Thread Starter
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: insane diego, california
Posts: 6,752

Bikes: 85 pinarello treviso steel, 88 nishiki olympic steel. 95 look kg 131 carbon, 11 trek madone 5.2 carbon

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1149 Post(s)
Liked 1,597 Times in 879 Posts
covadonga time + two ascents of llomena. ain't no picnic. let's go with miggylo.
ooga-booga is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 12:24 AM
  #86  
ooga-booga
lead on, macduff!
Thread Starter
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: insane diego, california
Posts: 6,752

Bikes: 85 pinarello treviso steel, 88 nishiki olympic steel. 95 look kg 131 carbon, 11 trek madone 5.2 carbon

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1149 Post(s)
Liked 1,597 Times in 879 Posts
Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
I'm not going to start a separate thread, but is anyone also keeping an eye on the Benelux tour? Lots of talent there, and some drama too.

Is Evenpoel just having a bad year or should we relinquish all those great expectations? Maybe he's not fully recovered from that crash, or maybe he won't ever....
yes but couldn't be bothered to scope out the various stages. just kinda done/cooked at this point. maybe recover for the worlds? maybe not.
last few stages of the vuelta taking up what little energy/attention is available. nice little end of season tour tho.
ooga-booga is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 04:58 AM
  #87  
Shadco
Resident PIA
 
Shadco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: City of Oaks, NC
Posts: 360

Bikes: Litespeed Arenberg, Huffy Strider, Trek 4700, Gunnar Roadie

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Anyone else catch the chick waving her norks at Maxim Van Gil near the top of the first cat 1 climb of stage 15? Just after he got dropped by Aru, and Maijka.

.

Last edited by Shadco; 09-01-21 at 08:15 AM.
Shadco is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 07:49 AM
  #88  
Maelochs
Senior Member
 
Maelochs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 13,504

Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE

Mentioned: 143 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6538 Post(s)
Liked 1,646 Times in 903 Posts
16 is a killer .... tough climbs, dangerous descents, rain ...... bodies bouncing like bowling pins.

Considering how fast they are really going versus how fast it looks like they are going ...... and it is scary even when they look slow. Those guys are nuts.

I wonder if a couple of contenders are wasting their legs getting a gap before a long flat section? I hope they have enough left for the final climb or the race could go sideways for a lot of riders.
Maelochs is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 08:47 AM
  #89  
MinnMan
Senior Member
 
MinnMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,435

Bikes: 2020 Salsa Warbird GRX 600, 2020 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX disc 9.0 Di2, 2020 Catrike Eola, 2016 Masi cxgr, 2011, Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3153 Post(s)
Liked 2,061 Times in 1,231 Posts
Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
I'm not going to start a separate thread, but is anyone also keeping an eye on the Benelux tour? Lots of talent there, and some drama too.

Is Evenpoel just having a bad year or should we relinquish all those great expectations? Maybe he's not fully recovered from that crash, or maybe he won't ever....
Well, I had missed this

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/r...n-one-day-race

so I had an inaccurate perspective.

Weird stuff- a solo attack interrupted by 15 minutes of neutralization, and then resumed with everybody rested.
MinnMan is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 02:42 PM
  #90  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
Good for Egan for giving it a shot today. Pretty surprising that Roglic took the pulls he did, but oh well.

Maybe our Adam will flail at it tomorrow. For a 1-2 punch from Ineos. Well, a mild slap.
slcbob is offline  
Old 09-01-21, 03:10 PM
  #91  
Eric F
Habitual User
 
Eric F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Altadena, CA
Posts: 1,950

Bikes: 2018 Storck Fascenario.3 Platinum, 2003 Time VX Special Pro, 2001 Colnago VIP, 1999 Trek 9900 singlespeed, 1977 Nishiki ONP

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1071 Post(s)
Liked 1,852 Times in 888 Posts
I enjoyed watching Roglic make it very clear that he's undeniably the best.
Eric F is offline  
Likes For Eric F:
Old 09-01-21, 06:09 PM
  #92  
surak
Senior Member
 
surak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,610

Bikes: Specialized Roubaix, Canyon Inflite AL SLX, Priority Continuum Onyx, Santana Vision, Kent Dual-Drive Tandem

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked 544 Times in 312 Posts
I expected the stage to finish later, tuned in and it was already over. I rewound my stream a bit, saw Roglic was already ahead of Bernal. Rewound some more, same. Surprised how early he attacked, even more surprised when I found out how early Bernal struck out and Roglic went with him.

Then I thought Roglic might have targeted the stage, but in the post-stage interview he said he didn't have a plan, only decided spur of the moment to go when Bernal went. And Bernal wasn't following a plan either.
surak is offline  
Likes For surak:
Old 09-02-21, 06:26 AM
  #93  
Snotrub
Senior Member
 
Snotrub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Texas
Posts: 147

Bikes: 2012 Cannondale Carbon Flash 2; 2017 Cannondale CAADX 105; 2021 Trek Domane SL6; 2021 Trek Top Fuel 9.7

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked 72 Times in 42 Posts
Unbelievable stage yesterday. How in the heck does the peloton let Bernal AND Roglic up the road like that. Roglic is amazing.
Snotrub is offline  
Old 09-02-21, 07:07 AM
  #94  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
Originally Posted by Snotrub View Post
Unbelievable stage yesterday. How in the heck does the peloton let Bernal AND Roglic up the road like that. Roglic is amazing.
That's a good question. Maybe a harder one to answer is "how the heck do they stop them?"
slcbob is offline  
Likes For slcbob:
Old 09-02-21, 12:53 PM
  #95  
ooga-booga
lead on, macduff!
Thread Starter
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: insane diego, california
Posts: 6,752

Bikes: 85 pinarello treviso steel, 88 nishiki olympic steel. 95 look kg 131 carbon, 11 trek madone 5.2 carbon

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1149 Post(s)
Liked 1,597 Times in 879 Posts
Originally Posted by ooga-booga View Post
covadonga time + two ascents of llomena. ain't no picnic. let's go with miggylo.
a day/stage early but nice to see miggylo didn't pack it in and got a stage win.
ooga-booga is offline  
Likes For ooga-booga:
Old 09-02-21, 01:39 PM
  #96  
Eric F
Habitual User
 
Eric F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Altadena, CA
Posts: 1,950

Bikes: 2018 Storck Fascenario.3 Platinum, 2003 Time VX Special Pro, 2001 Colnago VIP, 1999 Trek 9900 singlespeed, 1977 Nishiki ONP

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1071 Post(s)
Liked 1,852 Times in 888 Posts
I never fail to be surprised/amused at the goat-tracks the Vuelta organizers think are suitable for racing. It's part of the Vuelta character, I suppose. Today's finishing climb was ridiculous...and epic.
Eric F is offline  
Likes For Eric F:
Old 09-03-21, 03:19 AM
  #97  
ooga-booga
lead on, macduff!
Thread Starter
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: insane diego, california
Posts: 6,752

Bikes: 85 pinarello treviso steel, 88 nishiki olympic steel. 95 look kg 131 carbon, 11 trek madone 5.2 carbon

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1149 Post(s)
Liked 1,597 Times in 879 Posts
Originally Posted by Eric F View Post
I never fail to be surprised/amused at the goat-tracks the Vuelta organizers think are suitable for racing. It's part of the Vuelta character, I suppose. Today's finishing climb was ridiculous...and epic.
vuelta organizers guilty as charged. giro organizers always seem to involve plenty of railroad/light railway tracks within the finishing dozen or so km's and
an ambitious mountain stage or two that get truncated. tdf always seems to include a few questionable finishes within 3km's.
ooga-booga is offline  
Likes For ooga-booga:
Old 09-03-21, 04:07 AM
  #98  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
A pink lining to a dark cloud? With global warming, maybe we'll get more full Giros.
slcbob is offline  
Old 09-05-21, 04:22 AM
  #99  
ooga-booga
lead on, macduff!
Thread Starter
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: insane diego, california
Posts: 6,752

Bikes: 85 pinarello treviso steel, 88 nishiki olympic steel. 95 look kg 131 carbon, 11 trek madone 5.2 carbon

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1149 Post(s)
Liked 1,597 Times in 879 Posts
Originally Posted by ooga-booga View Post
a day/stage early but nice to see miggylo didn't pack it in and got a stage win.
¿too soon?
ooga-booga is offline  
Likes For ooga-booga:
Old 09-05-21, 05:49 PM
  #100  
slcbob
bored of "Senior Member"
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MD / metro DC
Posts: 2,185

Bikes: Cross-Check/Nexus commuter. Several others for various forms of play.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 433 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 187 Posts
Originally Posted by ooga-booga View Post
¿too soon?
Nope. Just in time.
slcbob is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.