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Evans - serious personality disorder or...?

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Evans - serious personality disorder or...?

Old 07-29-08, 01:45 AM
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Oh they race, old men on bike paths for a 10 minute comute to work. If the weather suits that is, real hard men of the roads these experts, clearly.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:23 AM
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin
So, Cadel should attack uphill because it'd entertain you guys. Even though the dude isn't a pure climber. You don't like him cuz he's boring and a bit high strung after riding his ass off for 3 weeks.

How many of you race?
Thats pretty much true...

I dont like him because he is a whining arsehole who badmouths his team and slags off CSC because they have a better team ("3vs1... 3vs1...")

My favourite rider in the peloton is Jens - hes a character and he is great to watch - just because he wont win the TdF doesnt mean i cant like him as a rider. By the same token, it doesnt matter to me if Cadel is a GC contender or not - i think hes boring to watch and thus dont like him. A rider's position in the GC has no bearing on if i like them or not. I like Cav and he looked like a good contender for the lanterne rouge before he dropped out.

You spectacularly miss the point with the "How many of you race?" comment, both you and I are looking at the tour from a spectators point of view - unless your cat-2-meter really needs an update and you were riding in the tour - so wether I race or not is irrelevant (i do, but see above...)

I also watch Formula 1, i dont like Kimi Raikonnen - then again, i dont race F1 cars, so im not entitled to that view...
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Old 07-29-08, 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Parsnip
Thats pretty much true...

I dont like him because he is a whining arsehole who badmouths his team and slags off CSC because they have a better team ("3vs1... 3vs1...")

My favourite rider in the peloton is Jens - hes a character and he is great to watch - just because he wont win the TdF doesnt mean i cant like him as a rider. By the same token, it doesnt matter to me if Cadel is a GC contender or not - i think hes boring to watch and thus dont like him. A rider's position in the GC has no bearing on if i like them or not. I like Cav and he looked like a good contender for the lanterne rouge before he dropped out.

You spectacularly miss the point with the "How many of you race?" comment, both you and I are looking at the tour from a spectators point of view - unless your cat-2-meter really needs an update and you were riding in the tour - so wether I race or not is irrelevant (i do, but see above...)

I also watch Formula 1, i dont like Kimi Raikonnen - then again, i dont race F1 cars, so im not entitled to that view...
#1

By that other guy's reasoning, no one except 'real racers' would ever be able to comment on the tour or any other race. wtf. This is a discussion board, one of those places people go to read and post their opinions and thoughts, people aren't resticted because 'they don't race' themselves. And no, I don't race. I ride because I love riding. I watch the tour and other pro races becuase it's cool seeing just how good those guys are. I don't like Cadel because he does nothing but whine, he's an inverterate wheel sucker, and my opinion is he didn't win the tour because he didn't earn the win, while Sastre did (on Alp d'Huez).
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Old 07-29-08, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Parsnip
I also watch Formula 1, i dont like Kimi Raikonnen - then again, i dont race F1 cars, so im not entitled to that view...
ZING! Nice.

I love the "do you even race?" crowd. They act like their opinions are granted instant validity and they float on top of everyone else's suspended by their immense empirical knowledge of the sport. "If you don't race, you can't possibly understand the complex tactics and strategies!"
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Old 07-29-08, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by bac
You are correct - their strategy did not work.

However, almost every expert in the world expected this strategy to work given Cadel's ITT ability. You've got to play the odds - which SL did. They just got a below average TT out of Evans.

... Brad
Good post Brad. Very good.
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Old 07-29-08, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin
So, Cadel should attack uphill because it'd entertain you guys. Even though the dude isn't a pure climber. You don't like him cuz he's boring and a bit high strung after riding his ass off for 3 weeks.

How many of you race?
Apparently not many. And fewer watch more than this one race.
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Old 07-29-08, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Alekhine
ZING! Nice.

I love the "do you even race?" crowd. They act like their opinions are granted instant validity and they float on top of everyone else's suspended by their immense empirical knowledge of the sport. "If you don't race, you can't possibly understand the complex tactics and strategies!"
Incorrect.

These conclusions are drawn from what is posted.
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Old 07-29-08, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by roadwarrior
Incorrect.

These conclusions are drawn from what is posted.
It would depend on the poster, I should think. In any case, that little quoted part you're picking up on was the tongue-in-cheek bit. The point stands. One doesn't need to race to understand racing.
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Old 07-29-08, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Alekhine
It would depend on the poster, I should think. In any case, that little quoted part you're picking up on was the tongue-in-cheek bit. The point stands. One doesn't need to race to understand racing.
When doing tongue in cheek, if it's to be taken that way, usually a get's that point across.

One does not need understand racing. When one does not, usually one asks a question versus making a statement, then trying to defend it when shown that what one thought one observed was, indeed, incorrect.

From my perspective, I don't hang out on basketball websites arguing strategy because it's not a sport I played and understand. To me, it's ten guys running around until someone shoots the ball.

Some people come here and ask questions, because they want to learn. It's the ones that start out with, "What an idiot that DS is for doing..." Or, "That rider/team really sucks because...", or "So and so is a choke artist..." that are idiotic. They have no clue what's really going on.

As Sherlock Holmes said, "Everyone sees, but few perceive.
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Old 07-29-08, 12:28 PM
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Yes, Cadel is wimpy, and boring to watch ... that puts him in a class with about 95% of the rest of the tour riders. He may even make dumb comments, and appear ungrateful that he is on a team in the Tour in the first place.

BUT, 2nd place out of 145 riders, with NO team support ... I have to respect that performance.
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Old 07-29-08, 03:54 PM
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He's a poor sport, thats for sure. The peleton must have some good jokes.
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Old 07-29-08, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt888
I fnd it amusing that Cadel gets called boring, then in same breath critisised for speaking his mind (and the truth) to the media.
What you do on the bike and what you do in the press are two completely different things. Explosiveness is appreciated in only one of them.
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Old 07-29-08, 07:41 PM
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HI... +1 with the penguin. Cadel looks a boring racer but he didnt have a single person to help him (i believe he was #1 in professionals last year), what if he had joined forces with menchov and vdv to survive all together ? (just Dreaming) What I notice from old tours is that in the past time to time racers from other teams joined forces together, i remember lucho herrera (cafe de colombia) helping Hinault in the mountains because he couldnt get the pace in some attacks, well pretty much back in the day if you didnt want to help hinault your team was off the tour next year but thats another tale i guess.

Bad for cadel, bad for SL that knowing they had a GC winner they arrived with a team that really sucked, bad for mcewan Good for CSC anyways, i dont like sastre because he didnt do a single thing in my opinion but well thats life!! Hope next year gets better, I really miss the fighting and courage of older tours.

Thanks.
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Old 07-29-08, 07:55 PM
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"If you don't race, you can't possibly understand the complex tactics and strategies!" ???

well u can understand the whole picture if you dont race. But probably the point is how somebody that havent raced even to go running to the next 7-11 to buy diapers or beer, can't really understand the perspective of how hard it is to race and even win w/o the support of a team or even hung up from the wheel of somebody that is really talented in the mountains. I was a track sprinter, and darn... in the road i was hanging from the buggers when a big slope or a 2 km uphill was comming. Cadel for me is like an all arounder, he can do it all but in the mountains he was just in there hanging because he couldnt do any other thing. Regarding sucking wheel in the flat stages, what else u can do when u have a darn train going 55 km/h pacing?? U can't just go and attack, at those speeds u simply CAN'T do it. And sadly only people that have raced have the picture clear about what is going on or how fast these guys can go.

Understand the strategies is the easy part, the hard part is to understand what the racer is passing thru some times and I'm sure cadel in the mountains suffered so much that i cant even described it. He looked boring i understand but at the oposite we have sastre, pure climber, he didnt do a single thing during the whole tour but just leave it all in the last 4 or 5 kms. Easy? well for a pure climber what he did is normal... well again, i dont like sastre but well, he won what else we can do about it.

THanks.
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Old 07-29-08, 08:35 PM
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Carlos Sastre

Cadel Evans
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Old 07-29-08, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ultraman6970
"If you don't race, you can't possibly understand the complex tactics and strategies!" ???

well u can understand the whole picture if you dont race. But probably the point is how somebody that havent raced even to go running to the next 7-11 to buy diapers or beer, can't really understand the perspective of how hard it is to race and even win w/o the support of a team or even hung up from the wheel of somebody that is really talented in the mountains. I was a track sprinter, and darn... in the road i was hanging from the buggers when a big slope or a 2 km uphill was comming. Cadel for me is like an all arounder, he can do it all but in the mountains he was just in there hanging because he couldnt do any other thing. Regarding sucking wheel in the flat stages, what else u can do when u have a darn train going 55 km/h pacing?? U can't just go and attack, at those speeds u simply CAN'T do it. And sadly only people that have raced have the picture clear about what is going on or how fast these guys can go.

Understand the strategies is the easy part, the hard part is to understand what the racer is passing thru some times and I'm sure cadel in the mountains suffered so much that i cant even described it. He looked boring i understand but at the oposite we have sastre, pure climber, he didnt do a single thing during the whole tour but just leave it all in the last 4 or 5 kms. Easy? well for a pure climber what he did is normal... well again, i dont like sastre but well, he won what else we can do about it.

THanks.
Yawn, someone else misses the point.

Im not questioning Cadel's ability as a rider - i can respect him for that. Does it mean I like him? No.

I dislike him because he never attacks and is a arse to the media and his team.

Example: Extremely talented footballer who is a dickhead, sits on the goal line and scores loads of goals - how many people are going to dislike him, not because of his ability, but because hes dull and comes across as an overly arrogant **** - his tactics make sense, as he is scoring goals, but he is boring to watch - remind you of a certain Aussie cyclist.

There is no excuse for rudeness. Ive been absolutley burnt out after hard races and long runs and have never threatened to cut someones head off or punched them for touching my stuffed animal (that sounds a bit dodgy ) and before someone says "bit u dint ride the tore de french" its relative, a hard century or a fast 60 mile RR probably tires me out as much as a TdF stage tires out Evans, being as he is a pro cyclist and im a engineer who happens to own a bike and a dodgy lycra wardrobe.

Last edited by Parsnip; 07-29-08 at 11:33 PM.
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Old 07-30-08, 04:13 AM
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it was a nine on one for the whole tour basicly..... cadel might not be able to handle the pressure of the press, i reckon that if cadel had support he would win the tour......i heard rumors that he was going 2 another team.....a russian team with a new name..
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Old 07-30-08, 04:18 AM
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sastre also used to help out cadel when he was strarting...buy getting him food and drinks for him
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Old 07-30-08, 04:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Parsnip
There is no excuse for rudeness. Ive been absolutley burnt out after hard races and long runs and have never threatened to cut someones head off or punched them for touching my stuffed animal (that sounds a bit dodgy ) and before someone says "bit u dint ride the tore de french" its relative, a hard century or a fast 60 mile RR probably tires me out as much as a TdF stage tires out Evans, being as he is a pro cyclist and im a engineer who happens to own a bike and a dodgy lycra wardrobe.
for starters The rudness was from the reporter who attempted to restrain cadel from walking away. Not to mention that there are other reasons high profile people need protection- like sabotage. If russell crow was there I'd bet he would have hit that guy with a phone!! Cadel boring- not anymore. Its the guys who get caught for drug cheating that are boring
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Old 07-30-08, 04:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Flak
McEwen gets a pass because, well, the dude backed up the talk. Guy was vicious in a sprint.
Being talented is no excuse for being an ***.
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Old 07-30-08, 04:36 AM
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I do think Evan's highly strung personality, extreme sensitivity and paper-thin mental toughness contributed to his poor time trial. These character traits burn up a lot of energy, and I think this may have proved the difference between him winning and finishing 2nd.

However, much of his behaviour is simply inexcusable. He is not a youngster, but a veteran approaching the end of his career and should know better. I also agree with others about his motorhome, bodyguard and entourage - it's a shame his results don't match his ego. In my opinion he is a spoilt 3 year old in a squeaky voiced man's body.
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Old 07-30-08, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by epobuster
I do think Evan's highly strung personality, extreme sensitivity and paper-thin mental toughness contributed to his poor time trial. These character traits burn up a lot of energy, and I think this may have proved the difference between him winning and finishing 2nd.
Thank you for those valuable insights Dr Freud.
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Old 07-30-08, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by epobuster
I do think Evan's highly strung personality, extreme sensitivity and paper-thin mental toughness contributed to his poor time trial. These character traits burn up a lot of energy, and I think this may have proved the difference between him winning and finishing 2nd.

However, much of his behaviour is simply inexcusable. He is not a youngster, but a veteran approaching the end of his career and should know better. I also agree with others about his motorhome, bodyguard and entourage - it's a shame his results don't match his ego. In my opinion he is a spoilt 3 year old in a squeaky voiced man's body.
Paper thin mental toughness?? That's laughable! 4 tours, top ten in all of them and second in 2. Yeah, no capacity to perform as an athlete there?? I wouldn't exactly call him at the end of his career, he'll ride another 4 tour's easily. He's only just hit his stride as a cyclist in the last couple of years. You need to watch all his interviews, then you would realise that he's hardly egotistical.
Having a motorhome and bodyguard that are suplied by your team (the entourage you speak of, some refer to them as family and friends, but I guess you don't know much about, sucks to be you I guess) not yourself (you can garrantee it wasn't his idea), just means your team want you to focus on the task at hand. Its all good and well for you to comment on someones mental resolve from your PC on a forum, but to call a twice runner up, 4 time top 10 finisher of the biggest annual sporting event in the world "a spoilt 3 year old" and then comment on the pitch of his voice as if that means anything says alot more about you and your intilectual deficiencies as a cyclist and person than it could ever reflect on him.
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Old 07-30-08, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt888
Paper thin mental toughness?? That's laughable! 4 tours, top ten in all of them and second in 2. Yeah, no capacity to perform as an athlete there?? I wouldn't exactly call him at the end of his career, he'll ride another 4 tour's easily. He's only just hit his stride as a cyclist in the last couple of years. You need to watch all his interviews, then you would realise that he's hardly egotistical. Having a motorhome and bodyguard that are suplied by your team (the entourage you speak of, some refer to them as family and friends, but I guess you don't know much about, sucks to be you I guess) not yourself (you can garrantee it wasn't his idea), just means your team want you to focus on the task at hand. Its all good and well for you to comment on someones mental resolve from your PC on a forum, but to call a twice runner up, 4 time top 10 finisher of the biggest annual sporting event in the world "a spoilt 3 year old" and then comment on the pitch of his voice as if that means anything says alot more about you and your intilectual deficiencies as a cyclist and person than it could ever reflect on him.
Why don't we all just end the discussion once and for all by asking Cadel himself whether he's satisfied with his performance, and whether he feels that he showed up when he needed to.* Matt and Rusty, look up his number in your rolodex and give him a ring.* Let us know the answer.
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Old 07-30-08, 05:36 PM
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I'm pretty sure Evans is clean (because of his suck hind tit performance). Nice effort, anyway. The other guy, well, super human performance for sure. Oh, and nice job not being in yellow until the last week. Fewer drug tests that way.
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