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Opinions on the Tour of Cali time change so far?

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Opinions on the Tour of Cali time change so far?

Old 05-20-10, 09:32 PM
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Opinions on the Tour of Cali time change so far?

Has the move to May been equal/better or worse than what you expected?

Weather is much better, course is much more scenic and I don't think the Euro pro quality has dropped off much if at all.
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Old 05-20-10, 11:13 PM
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There HAVE to be many fewer TdF Euro stage winners/contenders at ToC, with the Giro at the same time, but it's still a strong field here.

They didn't do as many mountain stages as I thought they might, in moving it to May, though I guess there is more climbing than previously in some of the later stages.

Too soon to say overall, until I see the SoCal stages this year.
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Old 05-21-10, 05:12 AM
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It's been OK, but I don't think it was the huge step up people were hoping for. Obviously the TV coverage has been terrible, which hasn't helped much.

If the Tour of Missouri goes under I think they should move to that time slot. Better to compete with the Vuelta and be a Worlds warmup. They could add a lot more climbs that way and I don't think as many people care about the Vuelta as they do the Giro. The only problem would be that a lot of guys don't race much that late in the season.
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Old 05-21-10, 10:40 AM
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IIRC, the weather for the February ToC was bad ONE year--last year. Prior to that, the other years were just fine. Spectacular, even. The move to May was a poor decision. The event does not compete well with the Giro for viewership or interest, and peloton content for both events is compromised.
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Old 05-21-10, 11:00 AM
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it's exactly the same except it's on in may instead of february.

- it's still raining
- still cant get tv pictures when it rains
- b teams sent to participate
- name brand riders disinterested or not on form aside from levi leipheimer, mich rogers, and dave zabriski
- still no mountain top finish (and please dont call todays stage which finishes on top of a mountain a mountain top finish when there's +10K of flat after the summit)

dont get me wrong, it's a good event, i'm enjoying it, but it's a long, long way from the giro in the quality of racing. if i have to make a choice on which to watch on tv, i'd watch re-runs of last saturdays giro stage over live coverage of toc.
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Old 05-21-10, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by simplify View Post
IIRC, the weather for the February ToC was bad ONE year--last year. Prior to that, the other years were just fine. Spectacular, even. The move to May was a poor decision. The event does not compete well with the Giro for viewership or interest, and peloton content for both events is compromised.
You recall incorrectly. Weather sucked in 2008 and 2009 and 7 of last year's top 10 on GC are back in Cali.
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Old 05-21-10, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by MDcatV View Post
it's exactly the same except it's on in may instead of february.

- it's still raining
- still cant get tv pictures when it rains
- b teams sent to participate
- name brand riders disinterested or not on form aside from levi leipheimer, mich rogers, and dave zabriski
- still no mountain top finish (and please dont call todays stage which finishes on top of a mountain a mountain top finish when there's +10K of flat after the summit)

dont get me wrong, it's a good event, i'm enjoying it, but it's a long, long way from the giro in the quality of racing. if i have to make a choice on which to watch on tv, i'd watch re-runs of last saturdays giro stage over live coverage of toc.
Andy Schleck is in a big break up front at the moment. Hincapie too (if you want to consider him a name brand rider). In general I agree though.
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Old 05-22-10, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Quel View Post
Andy Schleck is in a big break up front at the moment. Hincapie too (if you want to consider him a name brand rider). In general I agree though.
I was really excited to see Schleck and Cancellara in the lineup, but they both fell out of the GC early on and Schleck has been suffering in the mountains, They're clearly not in top form right now, which is too bad considering what amazing riders they are.
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Old 05-22-10, 02:40 PM
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It's May for chrissakes. Everyone in the peloton is in better shape than they would have been in February.

Last edited by Dubbayoo; 05-22-10 at 03:08 PM.
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Old 05-22-10, 04:00 PM
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in previous years the ATOC was a huge attraction because it was the first race of the year to feature many top riders. last year with the reigning TDF champ in attendance (sastre), as well as the return of LA, was the zenith for the ATOC. but the inevitable decline has begun and racers like armstrong and hincapie most likely will not be in attendance next year, nor will teams like saxo bank. i'd be surprised if the race exists in three years.

ed rader
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Old 05-22-10, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by erader View Post
in previous years the ATOC was a huge attraction because it was the first race of the year to feature many top riders. last year with the reigning TDF champ in attendance (sastre), as well as the return of LA, was the zenith for the ATOC. but the inevitable decline has begun and racers like armstrong and hincapie most likely will not be in attendance next year, nor will teams like saxo bank. i'd be surprised if the race exists in three years.

ed rader
Unfortunately, I think you're right, ed. It might survive, but without Armstrong, the sponsorship will probably drop off. Versus' coverage has been spotty. If LA retires, I wonder how much Versus will cover cycling. Amgen has a good thing going with the cancer research angle and Lance's foundation. Remove that and Amgen might think about where the money might be better spent. Next thing you know, the ToC is on life support like the Tour of Missouri.
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Old 05-22-10, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by erader View Post
in previous years the ATOC was a huge attraction because it was the first race of the year to feature many top riders. last year with the reigning TDF champ in attendance (sastre), as well as the return of LA, was the zenith for the ATOC. but the inevitable decline has begun and racers like armstrong and hincapie most likely will not be in attendance next year, nor will teams like saxo bank. i'd be surprised if the race exists in three years.

ed rader
i disagree. The crowds post-Armstrong-crash were just as big and just as enthusiastic. Cycling will survive just fine next year when he's gone.

I drove the entire route every single day. Talked to a LOT of fans. Observed a lot of hard-core cycling fans in every corner of the state of California.
We came through a small town yesterday and saw signs in the storefronts for Spartacus. You think Lance still matters?

I also saw a lot more sponsorship interaction ("activation") in every town like never before. I think they finally "get it" and see the opportunities.

Three years from now? Let's wait and see.
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Old 05-23-10, 03:37 PM
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Maybe because this year's Giro has been some of the best racing in years, but the concurrent schedule with the TOC really puts the TOC to shame. The February TOC was always engaging because it was the only game on -- a whetting of the appetite for road racing after CX Worlds. Now it's just a training ride in California -- the really interesting stuff is happening in Italy.

I'm still watching it, but I care a lot less than I did in years past.
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Old 05-23-10, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Doctor Who View Post
The February TOC was always engaging because it was the only game on -- a whetting of the appetite for road racing after CX Worlds.
If having three guys within 25 seconds of each other duking it out on the final climb of the final stage isn't engaging, I don't know what the word means.

And I don't see how a road stage race in February is any kind of whetting of an appetite for CX Worlds.

Being the only thing on TV doesn't make it engaging. It makes it "the only thing on" which is why "Everybody Loves Raymond" was popular.
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Old 05-23-10, 07:22 PM
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The final stage was exciting. But I've been watching the Giro day in and day out. The Giro has been a much better race. The Giro has beenThe ToC seems like an alternate race for the guys who don't want to do the Giro or a specifically setting up for the TdF. I got the impression that there were three guys really going all out to win it. I think moving it up against one of the spring classic races would be a better fit.
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Old 05-23-10, 08:44 PM
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I think the comparison to the Giro is unfair.

May Tour of California is better than February Tour of California. Everyone is in better shape, more guys with GC aspirations, better courses allowed because it's not "too early in the season."
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Old 05-23-10, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by efficiency View Post
I think the comparison to the Giro is unfair.

May Tour of California is better than February Tour of California. Everyone is in better shape, more guys with GC aspirations, better courses allowed because it's not "too early in the season."
The ToC runs right in the middle of the Giro now. Something that had to be considered when the organizers moved the ToC to May. Its relevant to whether or not moving the race to May was better or worse for the ToC. Versus hyped the ToC as the biggest race in the U.S. and one of the biggest in the world. The Giro IS one of the biggest in the world and runs at the same time. So I don't think its unfair.
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Old 05-23-10, 09:03 PM
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The race turned out better in May, even though it runs at the same time as the Giro. The time change made it better.
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Old 05-24-10, 09:58 AM
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I thought the change would bring better weather to help encourage me to run down the road and catch the KOM at the top of Tunitas Creek and then run back towards home and catch them again at the top of 84....but it was just as wet and cold (well maybe a bit warmer) as last year so I didn't.
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Old 05-24-10, 10:33 PM
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May ToC better than Feb ToC...overall better weather and the field is more competitive further into the racing calendar.


Not all teams choose to compete in the Giro, and not all teams are invited to the Giro. If you're focused on the TdF, then those riders and teams would rather race warm-up events, which is what the ToC is (Dauphine Libere and Tour de Suisse are other shorter stage races on the UCI calendar that are used to build up to the TdF). There's always a second-level event or two opposite the grand tours that quality teams ride in.

May ToC fits into the secondary role nicely, starting at least a week after the Tour of Romandie and ending at least a week before the Tour de Suisse...and AEG has made friends with ASO (for better or worse) so there's some benefit there in planning ahead for scheduling so it avoids confilct with the other 2nd tier events. ASO's involvement also gives some greater weight to the ToC....remember that since Radioshack wasn't going to the Giro, they weren't even invited to the other races put on by that organization (Milan-San Remo and Tirreno-Adriatico to name a few).

Sure the racing at the Giro is better...its a Grand Tour in a cycling country, and each one tries to up the ante over the others...that's why Sunday's stage used a road with pitches over 20% and the route profile for this year has been described as "brutal" at best with the second half pretty much eliminating the sprinters who didn't crash into the road furniture in the Netherlands.
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Old 05-25-10, 05:16 AM
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Originally Posted by deitman View Post
May ToC fits into the secondary role nicely
I agree, but nobody seems to be happy with that. People want something that rivals grand tours, which isn't realistic at all.

My biggest problem was that they moved the race to a later date, but they still weren't able to include a true summit finish. I hope they can pull that off next year.
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Old 05-25-10, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by DXchulo View Post
I agree, but nobody seems to be happy with that. People want something that rivals grand tours, which isn't realistic at all.
That's exactly why I said it's unfair to compare the ToC to the Giro.
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Old 05-25-10, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Dubbayoo View Post
Has the move to May been equal/better or worse than what you expected?

Weather is much better, course is much more scenic and I don't think the Euro pro quality has dropped off much if at all.
I think it is still one of the most boring races out there.
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Old 05-25-10, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by efficiency View Post
That's exactly why I said it's unfair to compare the ToC to the Giro.
Well, speak to the idjoits/cheerleaders on VS: they say the ToC is the 4th grand tour....
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Old 05-25-10, 10:00 AM
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you can't just throw money at something-trump style-and declare it the best.
the toc needs more of a history of epic stages and outstanding performances.
it doesn't happen in a year though and the organizers gotta find some true
mountaintop finishes to assist the cause. the giro-except for basso's
"extraterrestrial" year in 2006, has been the best gt since and including 2005.
this year looks to be no different. i don't see the racing at the vuelta or tdf
topping what we've seen so far this year at the giro-and we've still got 4
potentially decisive stages left!
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