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Whoa ... Froome is actually stronger than his "leader"

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Whoa ... Froome is actually stronger than his "leader"

Old 07-13-12, 04:53 PM
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gsteinb
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did you see the way Froome looked back? It was a 'huh, I had no idea I did that' look. I have no doubt Wiggins could have matched the shift in tempo, but the plan at that point was steady to conserve energy for later in the race. Froome misread something and got called back. It's a non story.
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Old 07-13-12, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
did you see the way Froome looked back? It was a 'huh, I had no idea I did that' look. I have no doubt Wiggins could have matched the shift in tempo, but the plan at that point was steady to conserve energy for later in the race. Froome misread something and got called back. It's a non story.
Sorry, but hahahahahahaha!

"I had no idea I did that"??? Seriously? Right, because you get out of the saddle and race past everybody for 20 seconds in a total blackout. Tempo, tempo, tempo BANG ATTACK RAAAAAAWWWWWRRRRRRR tempo tempo tempo...what just happened to me? Happens all the time, I know. Reality is that look was a direct result of Sean Yates screaming in his earpiece to slow down and wait for Wiggins.

Plus, I have no doubt Wiggins could NOT have matched the tempo, because he was left in the dust. He himself admits he can't ride like that, so unless you know something Wiggins doesn't, your statement is incorrect. Clearly Froome is stronger and could very well win this race if he was "allowed". His loss in any TT would easily be padded by the crushing he would put on any other GC rider, especially Wiggins, on a KOM finish.

Last edited by cthenn; 07-13-12 at 05:40 PM.
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Old 07-13-12, 05:42 PM
  #28  
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Yeah, again. As I said, you're wrong. He clearly thought Wiggins was with him. If you think he deliberately attacked Wiggins you're missing the entire narrative. Sky is about Wiggins winning the tour. End of discussion.
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Old 07-13-12, 05:48 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
No, he punctured too late to be able to get back on. The crash in the subsequent stage wasn't a problem, it was within the last 3km.
My bad on crash. By early I meant early in the Tour not early in a stage (which I think you would have infered if we were talking face to face and could keep people straight better).
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Old 07-13-12, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
Yeah, again. As I said, you're wrong. He clearly thought Wiggins was with him. If you think he deliberately attacked Wiggins you're missing the entire narrative. Sky is about Wiggins winning the tour. End of discussion.
Or he thought others would chase him and Wiggins could catch their wheels while others worked harder. If a team can get that to happen it serves them far better than setting tempo and all the team leaders sitting on wheels.
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Old 07-15-12, 12:09 PM
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If Froome has the mental strength of a Leader, he hasn't shown it yet, if today's L'Equipe interview is to be taken anywhere near face value.......
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Old 07-15-12, 12:31 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post
If Froome has the mental strength of a Leader, he hasn't shown it yet, if today's L'Equipe interview is to be taken anywhere near face value.......
Does this story have the gist of that interview?
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Old 07-15-12, 03:53 PM
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1. I have no doubt Froome knew he was leaving everyone behind, including Wiggins.
2. Froome seems to think Wiggins will pay him back by supporting him next year. Fat chance. I see no reason to think Sky will support someone other than the defending champion next year, assuming Wiggins wins.
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Old 07-15-12, 04:28 PM
  #34  
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I wouldn't have said this a day or two ago, but: Froome knew exactly what he was doing when he took off, though I'm sure he would not have done it if he believed it would jeopardize Wiggin's position.

With actions like leaving a slightly weakened Wiggins in the dust on a huge mountain, and statements like those in today's press, Froome is obviously gunning to be a GC rider next year.

If Sky signals to Froome that they won't back him as a GC rider in the next week, then I'm sure some other team will give him a chance. Other teams will also certainly be making offers to Boasson Hagen and Rogers soon.

Wiggins is going to have a very tough time fending off Contador, the Schlecks, Hesjedal, Nibali, LL Sanchez and Froome next year. Maybe Wiggo ought to swallow his pride next year and work for Froome instead....
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Old 07-15-12, 06:27 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
I wouldn't have said this a day or two ago, but: Froome knew exactly what he was doing when he took off, though I'm sure he would not have done it if he believed it would jeopardize Wiggin's position.

With actions like leaving a slightly weakened Wiggins in the dust on a huge mountain, and statements like those in today's press, Froome is obviously gunning to be a GC rider next year.

If Sky signals to Froome that they won't back him as a GC rider in the next week, then I'm sure some other team will give him a chance. Other teams will also certainly be making offers to Boasson Hagen and Rogers soon.

Wiggins is going to have a very tough time fending off Contador, the Schlecks, Hesjedal, Nibali, LL Sanchez and Froome next year. Maybe Wiggo ought to swallow his pride next year and work for Froome instead....

Is this possible with Froome's contract with Sky?

I am fairly new to watching the Pro scene. Is it typical for a team to defend the champ at next years TDF or go for the stronger rider assuming there is one?
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Old 07-15-12, 06:57 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by thechemist View Post
Is this possible with Froome's contract with Sky?

I am fairly new to watching the Pro scene. Is it typical for a team to defend the champ at next years TDF or go for the stronger rider assuming there is one?
The defending champion is supposed to defend the yellow. It's part of its mystique. However if the defense falls apart as the tour unfolds then it would be OK to switch to a stronger rider.

I dunno, I kinda hope Froome jumps ship. It'd be a great tour Froome vs Wiggins vs Contador vs Ryder vs Nibali.
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Old 07-15-12, 07:07 PM
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Let's not forget, when Lance a lot of people had a cow over the prospect of Astana supporting him over defending champ Contador.
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Old 07-15-12, 07:24 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Dubbayoo View Post
Let's not forget, when Lance a lot of people had a cow over the prospect of Astana supporting him over defending champ Contador.
Contador wasn't defending champion. That was Carlos Sastre. Contador won 2007.
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Old 07-15-12, 10:57 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by seanthebear View Post

I dunno, I kinda hope Froome jumps ship. It'd be a great tour Froome vs Wiggins vs Contador vs Ryder vs Nibali.
Me too. That would be awesome, but unless the route has a bunch of TT's, Wiggins is in 4th or 5th of that group.

Here's the cyclingnews article quoting L'Equipe:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/froo...-win-this-tour
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Old 07-15-12, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by cthenn View Post
Me too. That would be awesome, but unless the route has a bunch of TT's, Wiggins is in 4th or 5th of that group.

Here's the cyclingnews article quoting L'Equipe:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/froo...-win-this-tour
Word is the 100th edition of the tour is going to be old school...all the big climbs will be included. Maybe only one ITT.
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Old 07-16-12, 10:50 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by thechemist View Post
Is this possible with Froome's contract with Sky?

I am fairly new to watching the Pro scene. Is it typical for a team to defend the champ at next years TDF or go for the stronger rider assuming there is one?
Generally teams go with the best and most conservative chance.

Smart teams can switch the plan if a rider is not performing well.

Miguel Indurain in 1991 and Jan Ulrich in 1997 did not start the Tour as their team leaders.
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Old 07-16-12, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by seanthebear View Post
Word is the 100th edition of the tour is going to be old school...all the big climbs will be included. Maybe only one ITT.
If they really wanted to go old school, they'd do 2500km in 6 stages with no mountains, fixed gear steel bikes, no teams, make riders carry their own repair gear, and bar riders from receiving any assistance. Actually, that could make for a good race...
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Old 07-16-12, 12:31 PM
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I still don't think Froome could beat Wiggins head to head this year, but clearly he thinks he could.
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Old 07-16-12, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
I still don't think Froome could beat Wiggins head to head this year, but clearly he thinks he could.
Correct, but he is the one climber that comes close enough to Wiggins in the TT.
It would be a tight battle for sure.
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Old 07-16-12, 02:14 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
If they really wanted to go old school, they'd do 2500km in 6 stages with no mountains, fixed gear steel bikes, no teams, make riders carry their own repair gear, and bar riders from receiving any assistance. Actually, that could make for a good race...
And I believe that drafting was considered a form of support.

As far as TTs go it was more common ot have more than 2 than to have less. I wonder how today's riders woul dhave viewed multiple stages in a day.
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Old 07-16-12, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by seanthebear View Post
Word is the 100th edition of the tour is going to be old school...all the big climbs will be included. Maybe only one ITT.
Well, then according to Froome, Wiggins et al will be "at his service". Let's see how that works out for him.
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Old 07-16-12, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
I still don't think Froome could beat Wiggins head to head this year, but clearly he thinks he could.
You're in the vast minority who thinks he could NOT beat Wiggins. It's so plainly obvious he could. I'm just hoping for that one little crack in Wiggins' climbing, and BANG, over. Only 2 more days to see it though...he may hang on.
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Old 07-16-12, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by cthenn View Post
You're in the vast minority who thinks he could NOT beat Wiggins. It's so plainly obvious he could. I'm just hoping for that one little crack in Wiggins' climbing, and BANG, over. Only 2 more days to see it though...he may hang on.
It certainly isn't "plainly obvious". So far, Wiggins has looked in no difficulty at any time. He didn't respond to Froome's "attack"", no. But he hasn't responded to any of the others, either, except by marginally increasing his cadence and reeling them back in over a few hundred metres or so. We'll never know whether he could have done that to Froome, but my guess is that he probably could - at least to the extent of limiting his losses to less than he would be likely to gain in the TTs.Wiggo has been in awesome form all year, and looks better than ever at the moment. It's by no means clear that Froome could take him.
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Old 07-16-12, 03:28 PM
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plainly obvious?

This from a guy who thinks that if the team leader of the strongest team in the race shows 'one little crack' a LT is going to be allowed to ride away and make up a 2+ minute gap for the win.

All right before a TT that plays in the leader's strengths.

yeah, ok.
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Old 07-16-12, 04:01 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
plainly obvious?

This from a guy who thinks that if the team leader of the strongest team in the race shows 'one little crack' a LT is going to be allowed to ride away and make up a 2+ minute gap for the win.

All right before a TT that plays in the leader's strengths.

yeah, ok.
I recall someone talking abotu Froome riding tempo and doing a lot of work and then afterwards recovering and coming back to the group. And thsi was evidence that Froome was stronger than Wiggins.

That and a couple of displays of speed.

Now if does show Froome is strong. But to me what this shows is the other side of the coin of respect.

If Evans or Wiggnas has a mechanical in the vast majority of siutuations the other will wait. Actually at this point Froome will likely get that respect also. But Froome and Tejay do not have the flip side of respect. If Wiggans or Evans show any weakness others will attack and keep going. Not so for Froome and Tejay. If they show weakness there will be no reaction. It is others that are the main concern. (Actually Froome may be getting the filp side of respect now. If he is weak others may attack, but I'll bet not as quickly as they would Wiggans).
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