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"Secret Race" - what do you think?

Old 10-03-12, 09:59 AM
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"Secret Race" - what do you think?

Anyone else read it yet? Thoughts?
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Old 10-03-12, 11:05 AM
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an excellent read. not much whining, just lays it bare, here's what i did and here's how it came about.
I think one would have to have quite the imagination to make up such detail. i for one believe him.
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Old 10-03-12, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by stonyrover View Post
an excellent read. not much whining, just lays it bare, here's what i did and here's how it came about.
I think one would have to have quite the imagination to make up such detail. i for one believe him.
Agreed.
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Old 10-03-12, 10:26 PM
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I read it in three days. It was that good. Makes me hopeful for the future, but it's a tempered hope. Cycling definitely has a long way to go.
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Old 10-04-12, 03:23 AM
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A few things really stood out for me.

One is his statement about how no one starts out in pro cycling planning to dope, and the "1000 day to dope" standard (ie, face the fork in year 3).

The other thing is those few people who chose to retire rather than dope, and how they've faded into obscurity - Bassons being one, but a few others as well. I wonder what I would have done in that situation - and I know the answer. I'd have doped as well. I've played another sport at the elite level and had it merely been prevalent doping that separated me from being a top pro, I'd have jumped on that in a heartbeat. Thankfully, I never had to make that choice but I find it hard to revile all the athletes that did dope in order to keep up and maintain their livelihood and position in the sport they loved.

What was completely new to me was the fact that the 1999 Tour was one where a few teams/riders were doping but most of the riders were actually riding without EPO. Makes sense, given post-Festina. But completely destroys the level playing field point.

And yeah, I liked Coyle's steadying hand on the book. Facts backing up some of the claims, and a relatively simple "this is what happened", without too much soap-boxing in general, except on a personal level, which Tyler is entitled to.

As a member of the Brotherhood of Golden Retriever Owners, I am happy that Tyler is going to end up with atleast one TdF title after this
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Old 10-04-12, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by guadzilla View Post
As a member of the Brotherhood of Golden Retriever Owners, I am happy that Tyler is going to end up with atleast one TdF title after this
How?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oth...ce-titles.html

Is Tyler somewhere down the list behind all the doppers and himself dope-free?
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Old 10-04-12, 02:02 PM
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I thought it was a great book. I have no insider info whatsoever so whether or not it's entirely factual, I don't know. I did enjoy the book though.
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Old 10-04-12, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by tnvol123 View Post
I thought it was a great book. I have no insider info whatsoever so whether or not it's entirely factual, I don't know. I did enjoy the book though.
Given the detail in the accounts; Daniel Coyle's integrity as a journalist; his statement that only things that could be independently corroborated were included in the book; Coyle's defamation liability exposure if he can't back it up; the fact that it's consistent with the statements of at least 10 people claiming to have personal knowledge of Armstrong's use of PEDs; USADA's charges, and a whole bunch of facts that are all consistent with the accounts of the books make it highly likely that at least the basic allegations of the book are true.

Anyone who wants to not believe this has their head buried deeply in the sand.
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Old 10-04-12, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
Given the detail in the accounts; Daniel Coyle's integrity as a journalist; his statement that only things that could be independently corroborated were included in the book; Coyle's defamation liability exposure if he can't back it up; the fact that it's consistent with the statements of at least 10 people claiming to have personal knowledge of Armstrong's use of PEDs; USADA's charges, and a whole bunch of facts that are all consistent with the accounts of the books make it highly likely that at least the basic allegations of the book are true.

Anyone who wants to not believe this has their head buried deeply in the sand.
I got a big chuckle out of Carmichael being described by Hamilton as "more of a cheerleader than a coach", and by Landis as "a beard for Armstrong".
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Old 10-05-12, 03:10 AM
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Originally Posted by bikerjp View Post
I thought he was 2nd in 2002? If so, statute of limitations for 2002 being over, he'd have gotten the title.

However, it seems I screwed up, and he was 2nd in the Giro that year, not the Tour. Nevermind. The IBGRO recuses itself from this
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Old 10-05-12, 08:06 AM
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[QUOTE=guadzilla;14805167
The other thing is those few people who chose to retire rather than dope, and how they've faded into obscurity - Bassons being one, but a few others as well. I wonder what I would have done in that situation - and I know the answer. I'd have doped as well. I've played another sport at the elite level and had it merely been prevalent doping that separated me from being a top pro, I'd have jumped on that in a heartbeat. Thankfully, I never had to make that choice but I find it hard to revile all the athletes that did dope in order to keep up and maintain their livelihood and position in the sport they loved. [/QUOTE]

This was the great thing for me. It was so good to see some of those guys recognized for the tough choice they made. I'm sure that there are others, but Bassons, Hampsten, Mercier and the like got the recognition they deserved for making a hard choice.
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Old 10-05-12, 10:36 AM
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I hear you and I agree. I wasn't trying to defend anyone with my statements. I was just saying that I don't know anything other than what I've read. Some fans act as if they know these people and have first hand knowledge of events. Not pointing fingers at anyone here, just clarifying what I meant.

Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
Given the detail in the accounts; Daniel Coyle's integrity as a journalist; his statement that only things that could be independently corroborated were included in the book; Coyle's defamation liability exposure if he can't back it up; the fact that it's consistent with the statements of at least 10 people claiming to have personal knowledge of Armstrong's use of PEDs; USADA's charges, and a whole bunch of facts that are all consistent with the accounts of the books make it highly likely that at least the basic allegations of the book are true.

Anyone who wants to not believe this has their head buried deeply in the sand.
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Old 10-05-12, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by guadzilla View Post
Anyone else read it yet? Thoughts?
A good read. I was stunned on many levels even though I had thought I had heard it all. Narrative is very detailed and does not seem to have an agenda to hurt anyone in particular lending it greater credibility. I think the 3d detailed memory of all these events would be too hard to fake. If I had to rate it from 1-10 on the truth or false scale I would have to give it a 9.5. Where a 10 is the most truth revealing document that I can think of.
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Old 10-10-12, 11:45 AM
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There was a great sentence in there about "an inferno of suffering that stands between you and your performance limits". What a beautifully evocative line!

Suitcases of pain are out. Infernos of suffering are in!
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