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How could Miguel Indurain not have doped?

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How could Miguel Indurain not have doped?

Old 10-29-12, 02:13 AM
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Sincitycycler
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How could Miguel Indurain not have doped?

Big Mig was an above average domestique for Pedro Delgado then all of a sudden he starts dominating the TDF from 1991-1995 like he was riding a motorbike. I believe Indurain never lost atime trial in each of his 5 TDF wins!.

I think Miguel's quite personality and shunning the limelight after he was done racing is a big reason doping controls didn't target him ...every guy he beat was jacked up on stuff during that era...

Anybody else here think he must have been dirty to dominate like he did??
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Old 10-29-12, 09:13 AM
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Yes.
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Old 10-29-12, 10:38 AM
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Yes. As were the rest of them. Given the rash of dopers over the past... 100 years in the professional peloton, I think the War Against Lance Armstrong is more driven by the fact he's a bit of a prick. My belief is they (including Lance) all won pretty much fair and square, because the top racers were all at it.
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Old 10-29-12, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
My belief is they (including Lance) all won pretty much fair and square, because the top racers were all at it.
you need to catch up
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Old 10-29-12, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
My belief is they (including Lance) all won pretty much fair and square, because the top racers were all at it.
The top racers all had a powerful sob story that netted them enough money in endorsements to buy political connections and destroy anyone who spoke out against him by dragging them through court? The other racers all knew exactly what type and amount of drugs each other were using because they were all Dr. Ferrari's #1 client?

Okay.

You can use that "fair and square" story about Indurain, who by the way won the game of doping, not the sport of cycling, but Armstrong crossed the line into the game of tyranny.

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Old 10-29-12, 11:39 AM
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I don't know exactly what I'm getting at, but I find it interesting that he tends to be the other guy, including Lance and Lemond, who is mentioned when the topics of monster V02 Max numbers come up, as well as a crazy low resting heart rate.

Personally, I never understood why Big Mig, a big heavy guy who can slaughter everyone on the flats, didn't win Paris-Roubaix for at least five years in a row, as well as, or maybe instead of a bunch of grand tours.
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Old 10-29-12, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Kind of Blued View Post
I don't know exactly what I'm getting at, but I find it interesting that he tends to be the other guy, including Lance and Lemond, who is mentioned when the topics of monster V02 Max numbers come up, as well as a crazy low resting heart rate.

Personally, I never understood why Big Mig, a big heavy guy who can slaughter everyone on the flats, didn't win Paris-Roubaix for at least five years in a row, as well as, or maybe instead of a bunch of grand tours.
Because his ability was endurance not raw speed. Great TT rider does not always translate into a classics rider.
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Old 10-29-12, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Sincitycycler View Post
Big Mig was an above average domestique for Pedro Delgado then all of a sudden he starts dominating the TDF from 1991-1995 like he was riding a motorbike. I believe Indurain never lost atime trial in each of his 5 TDF wins!.

I think Miguel's quite personality and shunning the limelight after he was done racing is a big reason doping controls didn't target him ...every guy he beat was jacked up on stuff during that era...

Anybody else here think he must have been dirty to dominate like he did??
Before Mig got his chance to be a team leader he had excellent results. Finishing 10th or better is great if yuo are supporting someone else, even moreso if you are not a climber.

There are sound reasons to not put the teams chances on a TT rider who is unproven at best in the mountians. In today's world he might very well have started getting offeres from teams lacking a GC contender 3-4 years before he got his chance.
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Old 10-30-12, 02:10 PM
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I seem to remember a Giro a few years ago, the police raided the hotels where the riders were staying, there were syringes abd tablets flying out of hotel room windows, i know Indurain was not part of that race but it does show the extent of the problem and if Indurain beat all these cheaters five years in a row, could he have been clean, rather doubtful IMHO

Last edited by funaki; 10-30-12 at 02:12 PM. Reason: A sriously meisleading typo
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Old 10-30-12, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Sincitycycler View Post
Anybody else here think he must have been dirty to dominate like he did??
No. It's plausible that his domination was due to things you can't get through a needle...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_...cal_advantages
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Old 10-30-12, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Kind of Blued View Post
Personally, I never understood why Big Mig, a big heavy guy who can slaughter everyone on the flats, didn't win Paris-Roubaix for at least five years in a row, as well as, or maybe instead of a bunch of grand tours.
Maybe riding in the cold, getting beat to hell by cobbles and being caked in dirt and sweat for 6+ hrs is just not his thing.
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Old 10-31-12, 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
I think the War Against Lance Armstrong is more driven by the fact he's a bit of a prick. My belief is they (including Lance) all won pretty much fair and square, because the top racers were all at it.
Exactly
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Old 10-31-12, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by sprince View Post
No. It's plausible that his domination was due to things you can't get through a needle...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_...cal_advantages
that's exactly what they said about LA.

google 'lance armstrong physiology'

ETA: my favorite: https://www.discoveryeducation.com/te...-armstrong.cfm

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Old 10-31-12, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by MDfive21 View Post
that's exactly what they said about LA.

google 'lance armstrong physiology'

ETA: my favorite: https://www.discoveryeducation.com/te...-armstrong.cfm
Yea, but that's all been debunked. Mig seems to be the real deal. I'm not saying he's clean, but there is at least some reason to believe so.
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Old 10-31-12, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by colombo357 View Post
The top racers all had a powerful sob story that netted them enough money in endorsements to buy political connections and destroy anyone who spoke out against him by dragging them through court? The other racers all knew exactly what type and amount of drugs each other were using because they were all Dr. Ferrari's #1 client?

Okay.

You can use that "fair and square" story about Indurain, who by the way won the game of doping, not the sport of cycling, but Armstrong crossed the line into the game of tyranny.
You're right, Lance was a prick, but so what? So are lots of athletes, and other people. I've no doubt that Riis, Ulrich, Contador, Vinokourov and Rasmussen are equally ill mannered. I think Lance's recovery from cancer is remarkable, but never thought it justified his subsequent sainthood. If you were fooled then that's not my problem, mate.

As for Indurain winning the game of doping, if you really believe that then why are you even following cycling? Stop putting up with the outrage and go watch a clean sport like NFL.
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Old 10-31-12, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Commodus View Post
Yea, but that's all been debunked. Mig seems to be the real deal. I'm not saying he's clean, but there is at least some reason to believe so.
I remember seeing some data at a sports center in the UK once, and looking at a British rower (my old sport) who had an enormous heart, like 2 1/2 times the average size. Apparently the only similar data on record was Indurain's, who had a similarly large heart. The tester told me that it was a very rare trait, and meant that a lot more oxygenated blood could flow through to the muscles, much like a bigger engine can produce more power. It doesn't prove or disprove anything about Indurain's cleanliness but it does go a long way towards explaining his dominance.
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Old 10-31-12, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
and go watch a clean sport like NFL.
Can you warn me before you do that? I was drinking and sprayed it all over my keyboard.
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Old 10-31-12, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
You're right, Lance was a prick, but so what?
Paying off the UCI to bury positive tests = corruption and goes far beyond being "a prick".

Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
As for Indurain winning the game of doping, if you really believe that then why are you even following cycling?
Because it's not 1995, mate.
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Old 11-02-12, 03:04 PM
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Hey, I like Big Mig; the Extraterrestrial!
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Old 11-19-12, 10:31 PM
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Lots of riders of that period doped and never get caught. It's altogether plausible that Indurain did dope, but I'd rather think about his class as a rider--a truly gracious and generous patron.
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Old 11-20-12, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordy748 View Post
You're right, Lance was a prick, but so what? So are lots of athletes, and other people. I've no doubt that Riis, Ulrich, Contador, Vinokourov and Rasmussen are equally ill mannered.
There's ill mannered, then there's tyrannical, dictatorial prick. Any of us (I know I can) can be ill mannered. Lance was playing on a whole different level of pricktitude than the rest of us.
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