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Less Barry Bonds

Old 05-18-15, 02:24 PM
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Less Barry Bonds

In response to Barry Bonds The Cyclist,

Barry Bonds uses money and resources to support women's cycling

Did anyone else read this and not immediately contemplate the position of Mr. Bonds?

I understand PEDs are an obvious question, but I found that by the end of the article, I didn't care about Barry Bonds or his record, but I was so irritated by the disparities between the Mens and Womens cycling leagues that I have trouble sitting still! The inequality in the sport is awful. I guess I never thought about it before.

Did anyone else feel this way after the article? Also, does anyone know how a nobody (yours truly) could get involved in fixing the situation?
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Old 05-18-15, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
In response to Barry Bonds The Cyclist,

Barry Bonds uses money and resources to support women's cycling

Did anyone else read this and not immediately contemplate the position of Mr. Bonds?

I understand PEDs are an obvious question, but I found that by the end of the article, I didn't care about Barry Bonds or his record, but I was so irritated by the disparities between the Mens and Womens cycling leagues that I have trouble sitting still! The inequality in the sport is awful. I guess I never thought about it before.

Did anyone else feel this way after the article? Also, does anyone know how a nobody (yours truly) could get involved in fixing the situation?
Sure but is that any different than any other sport? The money that is put into all sports is relative to the amount of money that is generated. The amount that is generated is based on fans/consumers. At the risk of sounding sexist, most people don't care about women's sports from a fan/spectator standpoint. Even most female sports fans I know are only interested in watching men's sports. For female athletes to generate interest they have to be doing something otherworldy. Ronda Rousey is the only female athlete I ever remember that has been able to transcend her sport and become more popular than male counterparts.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:33 PM
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He's a swell guy, ask anyone, he has his own posse of women racers ....
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Old 05-18-15, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by rms13 View Post
Ronda Rousey is the only female athlete I ever remember that has been able to transcend her sport and become more popular than male counterparts.
...and I don't even know who Ronda Rousey is.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:35 PM
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Rhonda is a pissed off scantly clad chick that likes to break arms, don't post a pic, she's usually half naked.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by rms13 View Post
Sure but is that any different than any other sport? The money that is put into all sports is relative to the amount of money that is generated. The amount that is generated is based on fans/consumers. At the risk of sounding sexist, most people don't care about women's sports from a fan/spectator standpoint. Even most female sports fans I know are only interested in watching men's sports. For female athletes to generate interest they have to be doing something otherworldy. Ronda Rousey is the only female athlete I ever remember that has been able to transcend her sport and become more popular than male counterparts.
I do agree with that to an extent, but I've never been any less entertained watching a Women's game than a Men's. I get the feeling that it's an institutionalized sexism that we're just used to and it would take a significant (probably capital) investment to elevate. But, I would think that once elevated, Women's sports could attract equal fanbases. I just want to be the generation that does it.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by rms13 View Post
Ronda Rousey is the only female athlete I ever remember that has been able to transcend her sport and become more popular than male counterparts.
Serena Williams and Maria Sharapova do OK. And I'd certainly rather watch Michelle Wie than any male golfer (and golf itself is the least compelling aspect of it). Lindsay Vonn is probably better known in the U.S. than any current male skier.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by D1andonlyDman View Post
Lindsay Vonn is probably better known in the U.S. than any current male skier.
That also has a lot to do with her ex-boyfriend.

And that's exactly the problem I think the OP is pointing at.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:44 PM
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Vonn isn't relevant with wasted knees, should have got Tiger for 2.2B

Think he saw it coming ...

I played golf with a Doctor, he said he knew 15 years ago that Tiger would self destruct from the sheer velocity of his swing.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post

I understand PEDs are an obvious question, but I found that by the end of the article, I didn't care about Barry Bonds or his record, but I was so irritated by the disparities between the Mens and Womens cycling leagues that I have trouble sitting still! The inequality in the sport is awful. I guess I never thought about it before.

Did anyone else feel this way after the article? Also, does anyone know how a nobody (yours truly) could get involved in fixing the situation?
lol, there is nothing to fix. Their respective sizes are driven by demand. Simple as that.

Have you ever considered the inequality in demographic representation of middle aged black men at Taylor Swift concerts? omg, what can you do to fix THAT situation? Something must be done.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
I do agree with that to an extent, but I've never been any less entertained watching a Women's game than a Men's. I get the feeling that it's an institutionalized sexism
Just stop it with the War On Women moonbat BS. Stop. It's like the WNBA. They will never attract a fraction of the interest of the NBA. It it because everyone hates females? No I don't think so. You sound ridiculous.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
lol, there is nothing to fix. Their respective sizes are driven by demand. Simple as that.

Have you ever considered the inequality in demographic representation of middle aged black men at Taylor Swift concerts? omg, what can you do to fix THAT situation? Something must be done.
See my more recent post. Also for Taylor Swift.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Lazyass View Post
Just stop it with the War On Women moonbat BS. Stop. It's like the WNBA. They will never attract a fraction of the interest of the NBA. It it because everyone hates females? No I don't think so. You sound ridiculous.
Just so we're on the same page, "Institutionalized sexism (or racism, etc)" doesn't mean that I'm accusing you of hating women, it means that society is still - largely by antiquity - set up to praise men before women and it's really difficult to break old habits.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
I do agree with that to an extent, but I've never been any less entertained watching a Women's game than a Men's. I get the feeling that it's an institutionalized sexism that we're just used to and it would take a significant (probably capital) investment to elevate. But, I would think that once elevated, Women's sports could attract equal fanbases. I just want to be the generation that does it.
Why? Why is this important? Why this "cause" and not another?

It sounds like you have a case of what is called pathological altruism.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
lol, there is nothing to fix. Their respective sizes are driven by demand. Simple as that.

Have you ever considered the inequality in demographic representation of middle aged black men at Taylor Swift concerts? omg, what can you do to fix THAT situation? Something must be done.
Well according to a recent Time Magazine, Kanye West is a major opinion leader in that Demographic - and he's on record as NOT being a big fan of hers.
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Old 05-18-15, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by D1andonlyDman View Post
Serena Williams and Maria Sharapova do OK. And I'd certainly rather watch Michelle Wie than any male golfer (and golf itself is the least compelling aspect of it). Lindsay Vonn is probably better known in the U.S. than any current male skier.
...and I'd much rather watch Anna Kournikova play tennis than a Williams sister. Yes, I totally understand that I'm part of the problem.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Why? Why is this important? Why this "cause" and not another?

It sounds like you have a case of what is called pathological altruism.
Well, reasonable or not, peoples tend to follow their idols. Ours are often sports teams or athletes. Seems like this would be a step in the right direction. If that's not your point, then it sounds like you're asking me why not do all of the other things? Which would invalidate addressing any particular thing, so I don't think I follow you there.

Pathological altruism? I guess I feel obligated to make some improvement on society. Shouldn't we all feel that way?
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Old 05-18-15, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
Also, does anyone know how a nobody (yours truly) could get involved in fixing the situation?
Sure. Grow up and take an economics class...
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Old 05-18-15, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by D1andonlyDman View Post
Well according to a recent Time Magazine, Kanye West is a major opinion leader in that Demographic - and he's on record as NOT being a big fan of hers.
I'm sure Kanye considers himself a major opinion leader in every area he has an opinion.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:01 PM
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professional sports is not a sport for the sponsors, it is an investment... returns are expected and if the returns are not there, the sponsorship goes away...
as an ordinary "joe" there is nothing you can do...if you have money to lose, invest in women's sports... feeling good about yourself is worth something.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
Well, reasonable or not, peoples tend to follow their idols. Ours are often sports teams or athletes. Seems like this would be a step in the right direction. If that's not your point, then it sounds like you're asking me why not do all of the other things? Which would invalidate addressing any particular thing, so I don't think I follow you there.

Pathological altruism? I guess I feel obligated to make some improvement on society. Shouldn't we all feel that way?
Yes, pathological altruism. You feel a need to take up a "cause" but lack the ability to rationally articulate why it is worth it. It is worth it to you, for purely personal reasons. You are not improving society in any way.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
Just so we're on the same page, "Institutionalized sexism (or racism, etc)" doesn't mean that I'm accusing you of hating women, it means that society is still - largely by antiquity - set up to praise men before women and it's really difficult to break old habits.
Stop lecturing about your perceived "institutionalized sexism" BS. If women were genetically as strong and athletic as men, which they aren't, perhaps they would generate similar interest. But that's not the case. Would people rather see a professional cyclist climb the Alpe at 13+mph as Pantani did or 8mph? 13 is a little more exciting. Would I rather see a basketball player do a backwards dunk or a lay up? I'd rather see the dunk.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jiggle View Post
Yes, pathological altruism. You feel a need to take up a "cause" but lack the ability to rationally articulate why it is worth it. It is worth it to you, for purely personal reasons. You are not improving society in any way.
I think I've articulated it pretty well and rationally so far. I don't know what you think I'm lacking.

How do my reasons apply any more to me than to you?
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Old 05-18-15, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by dtrain View Post
...and I'd much rather watch Anna Kournikova play tennis than a Williams sister. Yes, I totally understand that I'm part of the problem.
I actually wouldn't because it was crystal clear to me that Kournikova never really aspired to be a champion, And Serena is a transformatiional athlete, at a level that no female tennis player has been since Steffi Graf.

That being said, I would not turn down a chance to watch Maria Kirilenko play Ana Ivanovic, even as I know full well that neither of them is going to get through the semifinals of any major.
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Old 05-18-15, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by PiLigand View Post
I think I've articulated it pretty well and rationally so far. I don't know what you think I'm lacking.

How do my reasons apply any more to me than to you?
I have carefully read each of your posts. You have stated that you think there is a problem - inequality of fan bases and "institutionalized sexism". You have said nothing about why this is worth fixing....assuming these are real problems and not just misinterpreted basic economics of demand.

There's a trend these days to label anyone who acknowledges that men and women are different as "sexism". It's a vacuous term. A cliche.
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