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Steel production frames

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Steel production frames

Old 06-29-15, 09:18 AM
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Steel production frames

So, I've wandered over from the C&V forum and am looking at a modern steel racing frame. I'm trying to get a handle on the various steel production frames out there, and looking for a few recommendations.

What I'm looking for:
-High end modern steel -- Columbus Spirit, Life, Reynolds 853, True Temper OX, etc.
-Racing geometry
-TIG welded (or fillet brazed, but cost is a consideration)
-Carbon fork
-Ideally a level top tube, but that's not a deal breaker

What I'm not interested in:
-A bunch of reasons why carbon/aluminum/ti is better. Consider my mind made up.
-A custom frame. I know that this is an option, but I'm asking about production right now.
-Reasons why I should just get a vintage steel frame -- I have those already
-An endurance/club riding frame -- I have that already
-The Somas/Surlys/All Citys of the world. Nothing wrong this with these, just looking for something nicer.

So far I've looked at Wraith, Independent Fabrications, Gunnar, Breadwinner, Stinner, Speedvagen, and some others. I really like the price point on the Wraith frame. What else is out there that I haven't seen?
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Old 06-29-15, 09:41 AM
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I bought a Marinoni Piuma recently. It's Spirit, I like it. This isn't the first time I've recommended these guys - no affiliation, just a happy customer.

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Old 06-29-15, 09:45 AM
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I was looking at the Wraith. Love the idea of it but didn't like the limited 4 sizes that seem to make a lot of sacrifices in geometry to try to fit everyone with those 4 sizes. Also didn't like the lead time of a custom frame when its not a custom frame. I ended up with a Smoothie. Boring maybe, but ride is awesome and my build is around 18lbs with 5800. Hard for me to justify spending 2x, 3x or 4x on a frame just for the brand name of the tubeset
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Old 06-29-15, 09:52 AM
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Old 06-29-15, 09:56 AM
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Ritchey Road Logic. Sweet riding. Not a name brand modern steel, but Ritchey's tubing is very highly regarded. Also the weight is quite respectable suggesting a good steel made into fairly thin gauge tubing.

Remember bike tubing brands and models represent not only the metallurgy of the tubes (like CrMo or MnMo, but also the strengthening treatment those tubes get as well as their dimensions (butting, gauges, etc.). It is more important to be able to trust the producer than to match up the chemistry to a preconceived notion.
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Old 06-29-15, 10:00 AM
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I have a Jamis 853 bike and dig it much. These new ones look pretty good as well:

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Old 06-29-15, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by rpenmanparker
Ritchey Road Logic. Sweet riding. Not a name brand modern steel, but Ritchey's tubing is very highly regarded. Also the weight is quite respectable suggesting a good steel made into fairly thin gauge tubing.
Seconded (as you might expect). A fantastic frame that is often overlooked, as far as I can tell, because of people's issue with the provenance of the tubing. I can tell you this, the tubing is as good as any steel frame I've ever ridden.

Also if you shop around you can get them for around $900, which includes carbon fork (individually priced at $350) and headset.
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Old 06-29-15, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by rpenmanparker
Ritchey Road Logic. Sweet riding. Not a name brand modern steel, but Ritchey's tubing is very highly regarded. Also the weight is quite respectable suggesting a good steel made into fairly thin gauge tubing.

Remember bike tubing brands and models represent not only the metallurgy of the tubes (like CrMo or MnMo, but also the strengthening treatment those tubes get as well as their dimensions (butting, gauges, etc.). It is more important to be able to trust the producer than to match up the chemistry to a preconceived notion.
Tubing Article ? Nothing is better than a bike that fits
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Old 06-29-15, 10:20 AM
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Also I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better deal than this:

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Old 06-29-15, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by dr_lha
Seconded (as you might expect). A fantastic frame that is often overlooked, as far as I can tell, because of people's issue with the provenance of the tubing. I can tell you this, the tubing is as good as any steel frame I've ever ridden.

Also if you shop around you can get them for around $900, which includes carbon fork (individually priced at $350) and headset.
Do they do whole bikes or just frames? I like yours, but not sure if I can buy a whole bike or have to do a build.
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Old 06-29-15, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Jarrett2
Do they do whole bikes or just frames? I like yours, but not sure if I can buy a whole bike or have to do a build.
Ritchey themselves don't do builds. The only place that I know online that do is Adrenaline Bikes, but I'm sure that there are others.

https://www.adrenalinebikes.com/stor...oductid=132753
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Old 06-29-15, 11:12 AM
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Cool, thanks.
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Old 06-29-15, 11:28 AM
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As long as we're on the subject, what about stainless frames? I'd love to have a steel bike that I don't have to worry about.
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Old 06-29-15, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by icepick_trotsky
So far I've looked at Wraith, Independent Fabrications, Gunnar, Breadwinner, Stinner, Speedvagen, and some others. I really like the price point on the Wraith frame. What else is out there that I haven't seen?
There is a very wide price range for the builders listed here ($500 to over $2500), do you have a target price?
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Old 06-29-15, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Wingsprint
There is a very wide price range for the builders listed here ($500 to over $2500), do you have a target price?
A little amorphous right now, as I'm just trying to see what's out there. Most likely $1500-$2000 for the frameset.
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Old 06-29-15, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by rpenmanparker
Ritchey Road Logic. Sweet riding. Not a name brand modern steel, but Ritchey's tubing is very highly regarded. Also the weight is quite respectable suggesting a good steel made into fairly thin gauge tubing.

Remember bike tubing brands and models represent not only the metallurgy of the tubes (like CrMo or MnMo, but also the strengthening treatment those tubes get as well as their dimensions (butting, gauges, etc.). It is more important to be able to trust the producer than to match up the chemistry to a preconceived notion.
I don't have a Road Logic but I do have a Swiss Cross. Ritchey frames are reputed to have very supple rides, and the Swiss Cross certainly bears that out. I would guess that the Road Logic doesn't ride exactly the same. The head tube design is very cool, as well. As production steel frames go, they're quite good. Worth checking out. The problem in this category is that you're unlikely to be able to test ride most of the options.
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Old 06-29-15, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by icepick_trotsky
A little amorphous right now, as I'm just trying to see what's out there. Most likely $1500-$2000 for the frameset.
Got ya. I strongly recommend you take a close look at the Gunnar Roadie. Hard to beat the build quality and finish for the price.
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Old 06-29-15, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Wingsprint
Got ya. I strongly recommend you take a close look at the Gunnar Roadie. Hard to beat the build quality and finish for the price.
Tough to beat a Waterford frame, no doubt. Somewhat lacking in the visual panache department, however.
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Old 06-29-15, 01:31 PM
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Old 06-29-15, 05:35 PM
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My Guru Sidero is Columbus Spirit and I like it a lot. Not sure what your budget is but the frame is $2250 I think. Mine came with SRAM Rival but I upgraded the crankset and derailleurs to Red.
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Old 06-29-15, 05:44 PM
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Jeff Lyons is a local guy i have to rep. He has a couple lines of frames from production to full custom. I recently saw one of his L'avecaise "production" bikes in person and it was one of the nicest bikes i have ever seen, held its own next to a Pegoretti. can't imagine how nice the Full Jeff Lyon treatment would be.
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Him and Keith Anderson could sort you out. Keith is helping me build up the Berthoud frame I found. These guys are super solid guys, and I have been able to see the work in person and I'm very impressed. Keith's paint is insane, and his fillet brazing work was shockingly good. he commented on the amazing fillet braze work on the Berthoud, and I think he really appreciates that clean look as well as the lugged look. He is advertising himself as American Constructeur, so they are willing to integrate things as well into your build.

I have no affiliation other than having met them a few times recently. Its not every day you meet small business people you want to go out of your way to support.

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Old 06-29-15, 05:46 PM
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That being said, it would be hard not to have a very good look at the Wraith again, i have been reading nothing but stories of happy riders on those.
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Old 06-29-15, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by MZilliox
That being said, it would be hard not to have a very good look at the Wraith again, i have been reading nothing but stories of happy riders on those.
It does seem hard to beat for $1350 for a 3.1 lb frame and high quality name brand full carbon fork. I wish they had at least two more sizes, specifically one in between M and M/L
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Old 06-29-15, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by dr_lha
Also I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better deal than this:

2012 Breezer Venturi Frameset Blue/White Bikewagon
i bought the frameset. once i get the handlebar shifters, it will be done (and 16lb with clincher wheels)
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Old 06-29-15, 07:05 PM
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Cinelli XCR. Horribly expensive, but retail is for goyim.
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