Facanh

I never tought I might have trouble setting up a front derailleur...

I never tinkered with roadbike derailleurs before. This bike has a double chainset at the front, Tiagra 4500 STis and Tiagra 4500 front derailleur.

The shifters click 3 times on upshifts, 2 times on downshifts. I understand that this is for when you're in dumb gears you can set it up so the chain does't rub against the cage.

I have to set up the front derailleur from scratch, and I don't know on which click it should upshift.

Right now I adjusted it like this:

First click moves the derailleur slightly outwards, second click upshift to the big ring, third click the derailleur moves slightly outwards on the big ring.

This way I can get all the gears without the chain rubbing on the cage, however when I shift down from the big ring there should be two clicks, but right now I can only get one click. It shifts down to the small ring no problem, but doesn't matter what I do I can't get that second click on downshifts, only if I back off the cable tension, but then everything else won't work properly...


How should the trimming work?

Ajkollme

Youtube is your friend. Look for front derailleur installation or adjustment. It doesn't really matter if it is the specific front derailleur you have, they are all installed more or less the same.

ThermionicScott 

Always-always-always try to find and read the instructions if you don't know what you're doing: Front Derailleur Adjustment | Park Tool

Facanh

I'm not sure if you guys didn't read my whole post or I wasn't clear enough, but i'm having trouble with setting up the trimming.

I can set up a front derailleur and shifters without trimming no problem, but I never set up a road derailleur where I had to deal with trimming.

I tried reading the manual online, I checked out this article but I can't find any information about the correct trimming.

bmthom.gis

That's not really how trimming works.
1st position - small ring.
2nd position - big ring.
use the downshift from the big ring to trim (not a full push), then when you want to go back to 2nd position, that's when you want it to move out again.

Facanh

What I don't understand then is why are there 3 clicks (positions) on the upshift?

kc0bbq

If there's trimming there are half clicks (into the trimmed position), is that what you're seeing?

Facanh

Yes!

As I said, there are 3 clicks on the upshift, and two on the downshift, but it's a double crankset.

My questions is what should the front derailleur do on each click, because I can set it up so many ways, but I don't know which is the correct one.

It's possible to set it up so you can't even get the trimmed positions, or I can set it up so it upshifts on the first click, or the second click etc... I just don't know which is the correct one.

mcours2006

You cannot get the 'second click' on the downshift. The shifter is designed this way. The trim is only for the big ring. If you've set up the FD properly this should not even be an issue.

Ajkollme

Do you have shifters for a double and not a triple crankset?

When installing the cable, make sure that your shifter is in the lowest gear (ie all the cable has been let out). You should not have to adjust when the shifter moves the derailleur, they are designed so if you have the low level set appropriately the only adjustments you need to make are with the upper and lower limit screws.

Facanh

Well I can't really set up the FD properly if I don't know on which click it should upshift because I have absolutely no experience with trimming (this is my first roadbike), but now I know. Thanks for the info.

So that means the FD should shift up on the first click.

I can get two clicks on the downshift if the cable is looser, or if i'm really careful and slow.

Maelochs

I set mine following the Park Tools site ... which I have actually printed out; i keep it with my bikes. I have a Tiagra double and two triples .... if you think a Double is hard ....

As I understand it, if you set the high and low limits correctly, then adjust the cable properly, you don't have to worry about so much. It will shift when it should shift, if the high and low limit screws are correct.

I trust you have already consulted : https://www.shimano.com/media/techdoc...9830606982.pdf and https://www.shimano.com/media/techdoc...830607073.pdf?
I certainly hope you bothered to read these before coming to BF---because we are evil and will deliberately steer you wrong just for a laugh.

Well ... I will, anyway.

NILS14

https://www.shimano.com/media/techdoc...9830606969.pdf

Another vote for the manual.
Forget the clicks and read the instructions, they are very clear and easy to follow.

Essentially, you set the trim from the trim position by adjusting the cable tension until the inner plate is 0.5mm from the chain when in the large sprocket-big chainring. After you set the high limit and made sure you can shift to the big chainring without chainrub, make sure the derailleur sits against the low limit when in the small chainring, i.e. make sure there is no chainrub.

redlude97

since you have 3 clicks on the upshift. Two are half clicks and only one full click? And one full down click and one half?

Maelochs

Trim the small ring, shift to the big ring, trim the big ring, going up.

Drop to small ring, trim the small ring, going down.

Like I said, try it with a triple if you think a double is frustrating.

redlude97

That is correct if he has a double front shifter. That's what I'm trying to confirm. If he has a triple front shifter he's trying to use on a double crank, the setup is different and you have to lock out the extra shift, or put it on the low side so you end up with an extra click that does nothing.

Maelochs

Good point.

I have a triple Tiagra 10-speed brifter shifting a double ring on my Raleigh and did just that--used the limit screws to lock out the unnecessary shifts. Works great.

OP ... I hope I don't come off as an a$$. I have had so much trouble setting up the derailleurs on my bikes ... even with the freaking Park Tools manual pages printed out and sitting right next to my bikes. it is just fine adjustment .... and getting the limit screws and cable tension Just Right ... it sounds easy, but for folks like me ... nothing is easy about bike repair/maintenance.

Iv'e got them all working now though ... it Can be done.

NILS14

For what it's worth, when I built my bike, the front derailleur gave me the most trouble, by far.

Raiden

Maybe a little redundant here with everyone else's posts, but yeah, that should be a triple OR double shifter (as in one shifter, built for a double or triple crank). I'm assumin'g it is upshifting once normally, then the second upshift pushes against the high limit (trying to shift to a phantom third chainring)- then when you downshift off that third position, it releases with a SNAP. You need to block that limit off with your limit screw and barrel adjusters. Pre-compress the absolute heck out of that housing (pre-stretch the cable), or some time a month or two from now, the rider (if not you) will be able to accidentally shift it up into that gear and will have to SNAP it back out of the phantom gear and re adjust your barrel adjusters.

mcours2006

I wasn't sure myself until I went home and check some of the shifters in my parts bin. A triple would click 3 times going up and twice going down. A double would click twice going up and once coming down.

So OP, you have a triple. Not a double.

robert schlatte

It is so much simpler if front shifters are friction so you can trim perfectly.

mcours2006

Yeah, but he doesn't have friction shifters.

Maelochs

If the OP has the paperwork, he can check if it is a 4503 STI .... which is the triple.

redlude97

its also triple printed on the top

mcours2006

Yes, I have a 4600 double and 4500 triple, and it says 'Double' and 'Triple' right on the shifter indicator.