ShortLegCyclist

Sounds like an internal gear solution.

If you could give me a Pinion or Rohloff that weighed no more than a derailleur system, I would take that on all my bikes.

cthenn

Alright, I'm not going to do the maths, but what is the weight savings for a 1x with an 11-40 in back? If it's 3-400 grams (which I'm sure it's not), then maybe it's worth the hassle, only if your primary concern is building the lightest thing you can. But, I've seen more than one non-weird 1x, normal 2x road bike that weigh under 12lb at the bike shop I frequent (other people's bikes, not stock stuff).

RoadLight

Hi cthenn,

I can say the same thing about shifting and trimming a front derailleur with a friction shifter. But there's another issue that I forgot to mention: Dropping a chain off the small chainring. Why do many pros use chain guards below their front derailleurs? Because even a properly adjusted front derailleur can, when the bike is being ridden hard, drop a chain on the inside of the small chainring during shifting. This isn't unique to index shifting---it is just as serious of a problem with friction shifting---but it is almost never a concern for road cyclists with 1x setups. I've seen the bottom bracket shells of many composite carbon frames scared and some ruined by this.


I agree. Cross-chaining from the large chainring of a 2x setup to the large sprocket of the cassette is problematic. As I explained, my 2x setup was a 34-50t x 11-26t ---I didn't switch to a 11-28t cassette until I converted to 1x. And I avoided cross-chaining from big chainring to big sprocket with my 2x setup except when I was testing the gear ratio to see if a 1x setup would work for me.


1x drivelines are less severe than 2x drivelines
Another benefit of a 1x drivetrain is a centered chainring. A single chainring in the center of the driveline will have a LESS severe angle when the chain is crossed to either end of the cassette compared to a 2x chainring setup. In a 2x setup, the fact that the large chainring is off-center to the outside of the driveline means that crossing from the big chainring to the biggest sprocket is MORE severe than a 1x setup. The same is true when crossing the small chainring to the small sprocket because the small chainring is off-center to the inside of the driveline. A 1x setup reduces the severity of cross-chaining, making it more usable.

I use a lot of geometry in my work and the driveline geometry was one of my top concerns before I converted to a 1x setup. I wanted to be certain that converting a 2x crank for 1x use would place the chainring near the center of the driveline. Fortunately, it worked very well with the SRAM X-Sync chainring. If I remember correctly, SRAM recommends placing the 1x chainring a millimeter or two to the outside of the driveline. Even in this position, the angle from the chainring to the large sprocket is less than a comparable 2x setup.

Kind regards, RoadLight

RoadLight

Hi Jiggle,

I can see why you'd think that. But you're forgetting that I also wrote "... as my cycling improved and I trained to a higher cadence ...". Yes, to increase the cadence you shift down to a smaller chainring or a larger sprocket. But as I improved my hill-climbing, I found that I no longer needed to shift down to such a small gear ratio in order sustain a good cadence.

I'll share part of my progression: For many years, I would usually get out of the saddle when I climbed. As I began to work on increasing my cadence, I found it better to stay in the saddle. When I did this, I discovered that it was easy to pull the pedals as I climbed in a seated position. This was a "revelation" to me. I'd been told for decades that a superior pedal stroke will have the cyclist applying power for the largest possible arc. But I never felt comfortable pulling the pedal up no matter how long I trained at it. It still doesn't feel comfortable when riding on level roads or down hills.

When I started working on hill-climbing from a seated position, I discovered that pulling the pedals up on the back of the stroke (from 6 to 12 o'clock) not only enabled me to apply more power for a greater portion of the pedaling arc, but it also reduced the stress on my quads and I benefited from increased endurance. Today, climbing is one of my favorite and most powerful parts of cycling and I rarely ever need the three biggest sprockets (22, 25, 28t) unless I'm battling a very stiff headwind. Now, during the winter months when I train indoors, I'll use HIIT drills and practice pulling.

Kind regards, RoadLight

softreset

I put 1x on my commuter because the frame didn't have a braze-on FD mount.

In all seriousness, I just wanted to try it. I did a Force group with an 11-42 Apex cassette so I didn't have to worry about the XD driver body for my Hope hubs.

I have bikes in the garage with Di2, eTap and EPS, as well as several mechanical group sets ranging from current to the mid-80s and I just wanted to try it.

I'm 100% road (don't even own a MTB), a buddy works for SRAM and putting together a group set was about the same as cost as a Tiagra/105 build.

I kept the standard 42t chainring and I can't complain on form and function (regarding the gaps). The bike it's on will never see a race, will most likely never see a group ride (unless commuting in a non-paceline format with other people is considered that). Someday it might be used to do a tour, I specifically built the bike to be about comfort/endurance.

I didn't care about weight, heck the cassette is something like 530g alone. With loaded panniers, the bike exceeds 33 pounds anyway.

For me, it really came to having something 'different' and I like riding conversation pieces.

RoadLight

Hi joejack951,

No, that's no typo and 11 mph is about right. That seems incredibly slow to me when I'm spinning uphill at 80 rpm or higher while moving less than 12 mph. It's harder to hold a straight line because it feels like I've lost a big part of my balance on the bike when I lost the forward momentum that I usually have on lesser grades. So it's difficult for me to imagine using a gear ratio lower than 50x28t. I'll probably feel differently when I have the opportunity to climb steeper and longer hills (which is why I'm planning for an 11x32t or 11x36t cassette down the road).

I'm not sure if my being a "quite different cyclist" is good or bad. Most of the time, when I climb the two biggest hills in my area with 12.5% grades, I power up in 50x19t at 16-17 mph while holding a power of 370-420 watts. On one of the shorter hills with about the same grade I typically race up in 50x14t at 19-21 mph. Again, this latter example is a short hill and I only have to hold my power at 520-570 watts for about 20-30 seconds before the grade starts to reduce. (I use a Stages power meter on one of their new composite carbon crank arms to match my SRAM Red crank.)

Look, I don't pretend to represent "all" cyclists---not even an "average" cyclist. But I am trying to answer the OP by providing one cyclist's perspective on the switch to a 1x drivetrain. My posts tend to be wordy because I try to write so beginners can benefit from them. (I remember what it's like to be the new guy trying to learn the lingo and inside tricks.) So I try to spell things out, avoid too many acronyms and provide explanations and examples.

Obviously, that causes trouble when other members disagree over the details. And that's fine---we each have our own perspective on cycling. But I am amazed at the apparent dislike of 1x. I was happy with a 2x6 drivetrain for many years. But I love what index-shifting has done for the rear derailleur! And today's 1x11 drivetrains only have one less gear combination than the 2x6 on my vintage bike (which I still have).

Kind regards, RoadLight

digibud

The flatter it is the more you want the 2nd chainring. I have a 1x11 on my fat bike but that's because I want the extreme dependability in extreme conditions and I'm willing to give up the close spacing. On hills the change needed from one gear to the next is not as critical as on the road when a breeze comes up or a 1% grade comes up and you want to just change your gearing a tiny bit to keep that perfect cadence. Even changing from a closely spaced 11 cog to a 12 cog makes for a significant difference in cadence and that's no big deal if, for instance, you'r'e about to hit a 3% grade but if you just hit a bit of a minor headwind and want to maintain a comfortable 90rpm (you put in the comfortable number) then having closely spaced gearing is, IMHO, a HUGE positive and I would NEVER put a 1x11 system on a typical road bike. If I were the ruler of the universe it would be illegal !

redfooj

1x is ugly
Itty bitty mtb chainring and a Pizza pie in the back

alexdi

After trying 1x on the mountain bike, I wanted the same for road. Then I realized how often I find myself between gears on long stretches with my 50/34 11-30 9-speed setup. Until we have CVTs, my FD isn't going anywhere.

Bike Gremlin

I'd never consider 1x drivetrain.

Even with a 1x12, I'd still have to compromise either gearing range, or get larger steps between gears. Plus have more cross chaining when climbing and stressing the chain.

Triple, or a 28-46 double are better for me. Extra weight - not a problem. Chain dropping - can't remember last time that happened when using correct FD, RD and chain length. A few times when doing some incompatible mix-matching in between drivetrain changes. But even then very, very seldom.

PepeM

Guess I'm lucky that a 5rpm cadence chance doesn't ruin my day.

Jarrett2

Love it

SpeshulEd 

+1

I didn't realize people changed gears or watched their cadence this closely.

noodle soup

I haven't paid any attention to my cadence for almost 5 years, because my Garmin speed/cadence sensor broke in 2011. Before that I noticed my average cadence was consistently 89-96 depending on the type of terrain.

Last fall I demoed a Stages PM for a month, and my average cadence was consistently 89-93.

I have no need to pay any attention to my cadence, because it's it's naturally right about where it should be.

Smithson1

I'm with RoadLight on this one. I love the 1x11 speed set-up and I think it's perfect if you don't ride many hills. I've got a 52x11-28t and I do probably 99% of my riding in 52x21 or 52x19. I'm going to swap to a 12-25 cassette next year to add an 18 ring. I'd love to get a 20 as well.

If I moved to the mountains, I would probably reconsider.

Jarrett2

This prompted me to go back and look at the actual numbers. I've ridden my 1x road bike 13 times now since the switch. Here's what I found:

My average cadence on the last 13 rides on 1x: 81
My average cadence on the previous 13 ride before 1x: 77

Apparently, 1x has increased my cadence. I thought I noticed it on rides, but now I see the data to back it up.

up on two

I don't ride much road and didn't read all 4 pages of replies but my next mtb will be a 1x11. For the trails that I ride on, technical and slow with mots of climbs, a 1x11 is just right. No need to worry about the front drive rings or the chain coming off from a hard bump, just pedal and worry about the trail with the comfort of knowing that I have a wide range of gears available to me on the cassette.

Sometimes more isn't better, just redundant. On a road bike, with not much of a need for rapid and drastic changes in gear ratios, I would think the standard compact is near ideal.

69chevy

Ummm.


16mph up a 12% grade would require about 800w give or take, depending on your weight.

digibud

16mph up a 12% grade should get a contract with Sky and a shot at the Tour. Maybe I'm off on that. Maybe only the Vuelta....

SpeshulEd 

Happens in Zwift all the time.

I watched a guy do the entire climb (2000' / 10 miles) at 6.5w/kg last week. His nickname was advertising a coaching service, which I found a bit comical.

Bike Gremlin

. ?

cthenn

Strava or it didn't happen. People crushing 15% grades at 15+ mph happens all the time on the internet. 😉

Jiggle

For 30 seconds. Not going to get a pro contract with that.

My last road bike had the smallest gear 42x25, which suited me fine sitting on 12% and standing on short 20%. I can see a 1x with a 50t front ring work ok....but with no macroshift I wouldn't want it. With modern smooth action front deraillers, you guys need to start viewing your front shift as just as useful as your rear.

DXchulo

Aerodynamics? I'm sure the difference is tiny, but they always claim that the dumbest little things will save you 30 seconds.

joejack951

It is almost comical but that is the best claim they made. Everything else might be problems that SRAM users have gotten used to (dropped chains, noisy drivetrains, and chainrings wearing out) but are all non-issues with any bike I have ever owned.