Originally Posted by astrodust (Post 19792063)

The other day for the first time I was passed pretty easily by a young woman.

Can anyone relate?

Originally Posted by Campag4life (Post 19795627)

Yeah, that's fast. I often ask myself, if my life depended on it, could I ride 10 miles in calm air at 25mph. I don't think so. Maybe at my best years ago.

Fitness and talent can be unexpected like you say. I have met riders like yourself who are remarkably fast. Wouldn't pick them out of a line up. There is one guy who rides with our club who can only be described as fat. Most guys in our group are fit looking skinny guys even though many of us are old. He by contrast is seriously fat. But he is so fast on a bike. Honestly, I think he could drop me on the flat if he tried hard enough. Maybe not in the hills though. He is so flexible. He lays his fat body flat to the top tube and just flies mile after mile. His pulls in front are some of the strongest in the group. A real outlier.

I grew up swimming competitively too many years ago. This past winter at the pool...I swim about everyday....I met a young champion swimmer and we became friends. Once we started talking about stroke mechanics, I learned this young man knew more than me. Honestly I was astounded and eventually asked him to coach me...and I have always been the coach in the pool. We raced all kind of races and handicaps...he is 18 years old and off to swim for his college in the fall. He could beat me at every stroke and sometimes giving up a substantial spot. He is just so fast and has amazing form. Unexpectedly, he taught me so much about mechanics and I have taught hundreds how to swim different strokes. He is being coached with the latest techniques and was a talented swimmer at age 8 and I didn't start being coached until I was 12.

He knew I was a cyclist and he likes cycling but never rides...does a bit of BMX like other young kids...but as a butterflyer he has great cardio and is very strong throughout his body. He wanted to ride with me and I believe drop me like he can in the pool as I am over 3 x's his age. So I set him up on my back up roadbike and off we went for a 30 mile ride with some other cycling friends in tow for evidence. I silently was pretty sure I was going to drop this kid as I have so many college age kids on bikes, but was going to be interesting because this young man is so fit. As you suggest Doge, cycling fit is a bit different. I could literally ride away from him. At first he was going to try to drop me right off the bat, and he sped up to 25mph where the other guys were falling back and I held his wheel and he went anaerobic and then I simply rode away from him. We had several races throughout our ride once he caught his breath. It wasn't close. So there is being fit and there is being cycling fit and most here on the forum know. The miles and speed in the pool this young man does, I couldn't have done in my prime as a swimmer. He is so fast, fit and strong. But on the bike is a completely different matter. But I am sure with training he would drop me on the bike...well maybe. ;)

To me this whole passed thing is way over blown. To take this seriously and honestly I don't get it but I have been at this a long time. I have met some good riders getting caught and then I ride with them trying to keep up. I get bored on the road and so meeting new riders...boy or girl and then riding along and even speeding up is no affront anybody. I like to see if I can keep up with different riders. Sometimes I can and on occasion I get dropped. I admit to being a bit of a sand bagger on a bike. I normally don't train that fast and if riders like to up the pace, I simply try to match their pace. I have had riders even attack me on the road which I always have fun with. I have had guys jump out of the saddle and try to drop me and when I speed up and match their speed, I normally pull up and make a joke because its so silly.

Originally Posted by seypat (Post 19798340)

As for getting passed, unless you are #1 on the Earth in whatever you do, there will always be someone stronger, faster, better looking, richer, etc.

Originally Posted by kbarch (Post 19798108)

The original post seemed as honest as any to me. What particular statement was petty - and since when were 50 year-old folks not that way? Seems to me that introspection and questioning are par for the course when a mature person starts getting serious about some endeavor or pastime.

Originally Posted by f4rrest (Post 19798348)

I really enjoyed this post.

Thanks!

Originally Posted by seypat (Post 19798340)

Well, it is cycling related after all. No reason to kill it or move it to Foo yet.

Originally Posted by Maelochs (Post 19795222)

...Further, women cyclists are much more likely to be training and riding with men, because except at the competitive levels there simply aren’t enough women involved to have a separate category (I have yet to hear of a bike shop Sunday morning ride with a women’s category ... it is done by speed.)
...

Originally Posted by Dan333SP (Post 19798099)

...I think it's awesome and it's fun to see her mixing it with the cat1/2 dudes in local races.

Originally Posted by seypat (Post 19798340)

...
As for getting passed, unless you are #1 on the Earth in whatever you do, there will always be someone stronger, ...

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 19798559)

This is how races should be done too IMO until there is a significant sized (30 riders?) group. As posted above many groups are similar speeds.

I've watched a lot of fields of 1-4 riders (seen them start, they are beyond boring to watch). The Valley of the Sun stage race 2015 had 1 rider in category. It costs the promoters way too much money to host a race where few show. Then there is pressure for promoters to pay purses (I don't like money in amateur races, I'd rather see more races) equal in men and women's races even if the fields are half the size, and races shorter and fees lower. The age divisions also have issues. I won't wax on, but, yea - I like the speed divisions the most.

If everyone just raced according to speed and your group was based on your speed/results many issues would go away. As in fondos the promoter can have hard awards for 1st junior, 1st woman, first whatever, and if there is no class that fits you, you can just lookup the results as you were all racing together.

In the cloud/social media/GPS/Strava world this also cleans up the popular arm chair Monday morning QB comparisons if everyone races together. I am constantly reading some Facebook post or comment about so-and-so's Strava time from a race compared to another race - which is silly, but done too often. When you put everyone together by speed, comparing time is the same as comparing placing, and it does mean something.

Originally Posted by indyfabz (Post 19798317)

Would you all please let this inanity die of natural causes? After all, they shoot horses, don't they?

Originally Posted by indyfabz (Post 19798451)

A. It's a load of horse puckey.


B. :deadhorse:

Originally Posted by datlas (Post 19798840)

Oh, ****.

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 19798569)

What race?

Originally Posted by Dan333SP (Post 19798866)

She does our Tuesday night training race series. I tend to get dropped halfway through the A races, she finishes with the group. Also got to watch her race at the UCI TTT race here in 2015 when she was on a team called Pepper Palace, that was cool.

Originally Posted by Trsnrtr (Post 19798818)

Many years ago, Connie Paraskevin-Young, google if you don't know, jumped into one of our Masters 35+ criteriums and took 3rd without trying. All of the old Masters guys, some Cat 2s, whined until she got dq'd. Don't remember why other than she was a world champion trackie and a woman. It was really pretty funny. :)

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 19798925)

Was she over 35?

Originally Posted by indyfabz (Post 19798846)

[MENTION=2795]Trsnrtr[/MENTION] to the rescue?

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 19798921)

When you posted about mixing it up with Cat 1/2 I thought that meant a race, and having never seen that, I was interested, and wanted to look her up. The groups are too far apart for the fastest women to compete (meaning contend) in a men's Cat 1/2 race of significant size.

We can go pages as to why, but you only need to look at results and speeds to see that is true. This is a bit like comparing MMA to boxing. They are different.

As in any non-open class field there are exceptions that make that competitor have an apparent advantage over their class. Yet another reason I don't like the class/grouping system.

Originally Posted by Trsnrtr (Post 19799257)

This was about 1991 and wikipedia gives her bd as 1961 so that was probably the reason she got dq'd. Then again, my memory isn't that good so it might have been a 30+ race in which case she would have been OK. I'm betting it was a 35+ race.

Originally Posted by Dan333SP (Post 19799269)

It is a race, albeit a weekly series. The field is mostly 1/2/3 dudes. She finishes behind the 1/2 guys but with the 3s. Not an enormous field but for me it's still impressive. Another cat 2 girl who the pro actually coaches was allowed to do a 1/2/3 circuit race with the guys, she finished in the field for that one.

I know lady pros aren't going to beat equally well trained male racers for obvious reasons, I was just sharing an anecdote that, at least locally, the fastest ladies can humble all but the fastest men.

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 19799342)

My kid was in Connie's program in LA for a bit.

Originally Posted by Dan333SP (Post 19799383)

...(put on by Rapha)...