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Upgrading groupset question

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Upgrading groupset question

Old 09-11-17, 07:17 AM
  #1  
rperkins146
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Upgrading groupset question

I have a 2011 groupset (105 -5700, 10 speed). I am considering upgrading it to an Ultegra - 6800.


If you care why, the short answer is just because I want to. There is little wrong with the 5700 set, the cassette shows some signs of wear, It shifts good I just have to adjust it every so often.


My question is this, would you...
1. buy a NEW groupset so that the drivetrain is not worn


2. buy used components when you find a deal


I ask because I have read somewhere ( I read a lot and don't remember where) that you should not put a new component on an old drivetrain.


Thanks in advance.


Rob
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Old 09-11-17, 07:30 AM
  #2  
dabac
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Mixing chains and cassettes of different degrees of wear has a considerable risk of not working out well.
Cranksets - particularly road - takes considerable mileage before getting worn enough to matter.

Swapping in shifters in a worn group isn't an issue at all.
Front derailers likewise.
Rear derailers can get worn pulley wheels, which eventually can mesh poorly with a new chain.
Likewise a brand new derailer can mesh poorly with a worn chain.
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Old 09-11-17, 07:47 AM
  #3  
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Originally Posted by rperkins146 View Post
I have a 2011 groupset (105 -5700, 10 speed). I am considering upgrading it to an Ultegra - 6800.


If you care why, the short answer is just because I want to. There is little wrong with the 5700 set, the cassette shows some signs of wear, It shifts good I just have to adjust it every so often.


My question is this, would you...
1. buy a NEW groupset so that the drivetrain is not worn


2. buy used components when you find a deal


I ask because I have read somewhere ( I read a lot and don't remember where) that you should not put a new component on an old drivetrain.


Thanks in advance.


Rob
I would just replace the chain and cassette because it sounds like everything else is working.

If I just wanted an upgrade I would buy a brand new groupset. I'd probably go with 105 5800 and save $150-$200 over Ultegra.
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Old 09-11-17, 08:30 AM
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Buying used shifters and derails is usually just fine. Put on new cables and housings and always use a new chain. A new cassette is worth it as well. You can step down on the cassette to save money without affecting anything. Chainrings typically take a long time to wear although those Shimano 6800 rings - I have seen wear out sooner than normal.
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Old 09-11-17, 08:50 AM
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Buy a complete groupset. I have upgraded one bike from a 3500 (Sora) to 5800 and I built up another frame/fork set with a 5800. The upgrade was done via eBay auctions piecing together the groupset and the build-up was by buying a whole groupset. Result? Piecing together: 2 weeks of effort on multiple BIN and auctions costing about $425 w/shipping. Buying a complete groupset: less than 2 weeks effort to find a complete set for $380 w/shipping. Less time, money and, effort to buy a whole group set vs piecemeal.


Also, if you're going to go piece-by-piece, I'd suggest waiting until you have all of the components because you can't use 10 sp shifters with an 11 cog cassette. There are a lot of other considerations but to list them all would be mind numbing if you purchase part-by-part. Also, I think that it's better to strip the bike completely and install everything at one time.
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Old 09-11-17, 08:59 AM
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I agree entirely with what Psimet says above. Another factor is how many miles you (or the previous owner) put on a drivetrain. I have worn out a set of chainrings in less than 12,000 miles -- takes about a year for me. I won't resell them at that point, but there may be people out there who do.
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Old 09-11-17, 09:47 AM
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You rarely get a deal piecing it 1 by 1.

Even then, when buying used you'll have to pay retail for cables and housing, probably new bottom bracket too...it eats away at saving.

Then you'll be sitting on parts for a while because you can't install them one at a time. Further, what are chances you'll find the right sizes and lengths and config.

Just bite the bullet and have an all fresh 6800 or 5800 group.

Or at the least, buy a full group off someone doing a full swap
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Old 09-11-17, 10:52 AM
  #8  
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I would watch the currency exchange rates and buy a groupset from England as they further botch the Brexit process.

No wrangling over price, endless searching on ebay and craigslist, multiple transactions, equipment of questionable quality and no right to return or worrying about whether it was stolen.

Just one transaction from a reputable vendor and done. The only downside is the cost of overseas returns should the need arise.

I got a 105 groupset for $311.11 last year when their currency tanked after they voted to leave the EU.


-Tim-
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Old 09-11-17, 11:14 AM
  #9  
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Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
I would watch the currency exchange rates and buy a groupset from England as they further botch the Brexit process.

No wrangling over price, endless searching on ebay and craigslist, multiple transactions, equipment of questionable quality and no right to return or worrying about whether it was stolen.

Just one transaction from a reputable vendor and done. The only downside is the cost of overseas returns should the need arise.

I got a 105 groupset for $311.11 last year when their currency tanked after they voted to leave the EU.


-Tim-

Is there an efficient way to get a groupset without brake calipers? I want to get long-reach brakes with a 105 group, but to do that, it looks I have to work piece-wise. Best I've found so far is to wait for 25% off day at Nashbar and hope they have what I need that day.
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Old 09-11-17, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by redfooj View Post
Even then, when buying used you'll have to pay retail for cables and housing, probably new bottom bracket too...it eats away at saving.
I buy stainless steel cables, both brake and shift, for $1.50 per cable from the local bike collective.
I have housing in bulk- lined brake housing comes out to $.75/foot and lined Jagwire slick housing is $1/foot. Even if i bought them from one of the local shops from their bulk stash(which is what they use to cable bikes), itd be about $2/foot.

$10-12 and a bike is fully cabled and housed.
I know you can drop $70 or however much on a couple Jagwire cable kits, but that just isnt necessary.
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Old 09-11-17, 12:47 PM
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105 calipers sell really really easily as many people look to swap away from factory tektros for cheap, and its plug and play upgrade without rewrapping tapes, new cables, etc. just get the whole thing and dump the calipers
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Old 09-11-17, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by redfooj View Post
105 calipers sell really really easily as many people look to swap away from factory tektros for cheap, and its plug and play upgrade without rewrapping tapes, new cables, etc. just get the whole thing and dump the calipers
Ha! Of course! Turns out my wife's bike HAS long-reach calipers on it. I'm sure I can talk her into a free upgrade!

Thanks.
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Old 09-11-17, 03:36 PM
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I have recently bought Dura Ace 9100 groupset, except Ultegra 6800 cassette, piece by piece for $950. I bought from various U.K. online stores such as ProBikeKit, Ribble Cycles, Merlin Cycles, Chain Reaction, etc.

I waited for at least 40% off and 10%-20% additional first-time buyer or promotions. Also, whenever I could, I waited for the Euro to go down for better exchange rates. It took me 2-3 months to get everything.

Note that, most of the items were OEMs, without fancy Dura Ace retail packaging.

Good luck


Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
I would watch the currency exchange rates and buy a groupset from England as they further botch the Brexit process.

No wrangling over price, endless searching on ebay and craigslist, multiple transactions, equipment of questionable quality and no right to return or worrying about whether it was stolen.

Just one transaction from a reputable vendor and done. The only downside is the cost of overseas returns should the need arise.

I got a 105 groupset for $311.11 last year when their currency tanked after they voted to leave the EU.


-Tim-
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Old 09-11-17, 04:54 PM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by Psimet2001 View Post
Buying used shifters and derails is usually just fine. Put on new cables and housings and always use a new chain. A new cassette is worth it as well. You can step down on the cassette to save money without affecting anything. Chainrings typically take a long time to wear although those Shimano 6800 rings - I have seen wear out sooner than normal.
And 6800 rings are expensive.
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Old 09-11-17, 05:18 PM
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6800 is 11 speed, 5700 is 10 speed.

Your existing cassette and chain are no use to you as they are 10 speed and will not work with 11 speed.

The only items you can keep from your existing setup are the brake calipers, bottom bracket and chainset (works with 10 or 11 speed well enough).

You will need new shifters, derailleurs, chain and cassette.

You can probably buy these parts new at around two thirds of the price of the full groupset.

You can get a 105 cassette if you want to save more (that's an 11sp 5800 cassette, not the 10sp 5700 you have).

You may buy these used but chains and cassettes are wear items so unless they are near new they are probably a false economy. In addition the chain and cassette wear together so mixing chains and cassettes of different ages can lead to skipping. Buying used chains and cassettes of different ages is a massive risk. The jockeys wheels on rear derailleurs will wear and may need replacement if you are buying used.

While you are upgrading you may like to get the new R8000 front derailleur instead of the 6800 one or the very new (maybe not available yet ) FD-5801. These feature quite a few improvements over the old front derailleurs including a barrel adjuster on the derailleur itself.

Last edited by smarkinson; 09-11-17 at 05:22 PM.
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Old 09-11-17, 06:27 PM
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What about keeping the bike with 5700 and buying a brand new bike with 6800? Good time to do it now with 2018's coming out.
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Old 09-16-17, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
What about keeping the bike with 5700 and buying a brand new bike with 6800? Good time to do it now with 2018's coming out.


Could I get you to talk to my wife? I honestly flop back and forth between pulling the trigger this year on a new bike, or upgrading mine and waiting another year or two....
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