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The Strava Thread

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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

The Strava Thread

Old 11-25-17, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by SethAZ
Have you noticed in Strava that when you edit a ride, or select what "Sport" the ride is for, that "e-bike ride" is an option? Or, why would you bother recording e-bike rides anyway?
why would you take an e-bike ride at all, let alone record one?
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Old 11-25-17, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Doge's world view is all about his kids. ...
FTFY. Could add wife too...

Originally Posted by tomato coupe
...He didn't like the fact that junior had to race against adults under (unfair) USAC gearing rules, and no one took notice of or remembers junior's race results. ...
Didn't matter for most races for my kid. Still unfair. It did matter for others. There are some pretty big races where the winner won because of the handicap put on juniors. Pretty much nobody remembers anyone's race results. That's why you have Strava segments :-)

I track a bunch of segments. I think the leader board is legit on all of them other than the random car that gets flagged. Can someone share uphill 3+ min 10K+ attempt segments that have a suspect leader board?
Here is one I track: https://www.strava.com/segments/15738866
The leader today has an average 2X that of the others. It is an obvious outlier and needs to be flagged.
Other than that, I find those top 24 as believable as any top 25 in a race did so fairly and without cheating.


As is pointed out, above is my opinion.
I guess I also need to point out, opinion is a significant part of a forum.
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Old 11-25-17, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Doge
There are some pretty big races where the winner won because of the handicap put on juniors. ...That's why you have Strava segments :-)

I track a bunch of segments. I think the leader board is legit on all of them other than the random car that gets flagged.

Here is one I track: https://www.strava.com/segments/15738866
You argue that Strava segments are more legit than race results because of USAC rules that you deem unfair, yet your prime example of a legit Strava segment is one that would never fall under the rules of the USAC?
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Old 11-25-17, 01:26 PM
  #254  
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
You argue that Strava segments are more legit than race results because of USAC rules that you deem unfair, yet your prime example of a legit Strava segment is one that would never fall under the rules of the USAC?
No Strava segment falls under the rules of USAC (unless made during a USAC race), which is why they are fair.

Here are two race examples among many and not just gearing, but this is a Strava Thread, not a race one.

My opinion is on this hilly race #2, a junior, could have made up the 3 sec and have been on the top step if he did not have limited gears.
Adrian2nd.JPG

After 10 hours maybe 30 sec could have been saved?
Adrian3rd.JPG
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Old 11-25-17, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by SethAZ
Have you noticed in Strava that when you edit a ride, or select what "Sport" the ride is for, that "e-bike ride" is an option? Or, why would you bother recording e-bike rides anyway?
I would want to record the rides because even with an ebike there is still some amount of physical effort exerted that would add to weekly training load, which is is a good thing. I know Strava filters segments for age and weight but between ebike and unassisted? If not, I would lose the abilities to easily view my unassisted PRs and to monitor live segments in-ride on the local segments I use to monitor fitness and improvement.

Keith
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Old 11-25-17, 02:23 PM
  #256  
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Originally Posted by trainsktg
I would want to record the rides because even with an ebike there is still some amount of physical effort exerted that would add to weekly training load, which is is a good thing. I know Strava filters segments for age and weight but between ebike and unassisted? If not, I would lose the abilities to easily view my unassisted PRs and to monitor live segments in-ride on the local segments I use to monitor fitness and improvement.

Keith
I would think that on most (lower end at least) ebikes, getting a [EDIT] unassisted PR is somewhat unlikely vs. on the non-electric bike, no?
Perhaps this Strava tool could be leveraged:
CommuteMarker

Last edited by Sy Reene; 11-25-17 at 02:26 PM.
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Old 11-25-17, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene
I would think that on most (lower end at least) ebikes, getting a [EDIT] unassisted PR is somewhat unlikely vs. on the non-electric bike, no?
Perhaps this Strava tool could be leveraged:
CommuteMarker
By 'unassisted' I mean rides with normal bikes, so rides with ebikes would almost certainly be faster than non-assisted, as the whole intent of using them is to get to work faster. Legit PRs would get eclipsed and lost. Regardless, I've already decided that the expense of another bike is not warranted for the benefits it might glean.

Keith

Last edited by trainsktg; 11-25-17 at 05:12 PM.
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Old 11-25-17, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
Something like a dude actively going after KOMs-- and I mean sniping for them-- on this thing:

I don't have alot of KOM's, but one's about a mile from that spot. Can you PM who this is?
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Old 11-26-17, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Smidsy Revenge
why would you take an e-bike ride at all, let alone record one?
One might in part for the mileage recording for maintenance purposes.

Easy enough to exclude by making private or marking as commute.
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Old 11-26-17, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by trainsktg
I would want to record the rides because even with an ebike there is still some amount of physical effort exerted that would add to weekly training load, which is is a good thing. I know Strava filters segments for age and weight but between ebike and unassisted? If not, I would lose the abilities to easily view my unassisted PRs and to monitor live segments in-ride on the local segments I use to monitor fitness and improvement.

Keith
You can record them as a normal ride and check the 'hide from leaderboard' box. You'll still be able to look and track all your results but you won't be taking any KOMs.
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Old 11-26-17, 11:09 PM
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E-bike rides have their own separate category, but I don't know if Strava keeps their leaderboards separate. If they do then there is no need to mark the ride as private or hidden from leaderboards -- they should just be categorized correctly.
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Old 11-26-17, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by atwl77
E-bike rides have their own separate category, but I don't know if Strava keeps their leaderboards separate. If they do then there is no need to mark the ride as private or hidden from leaderboards -- they should just be categorized correctly.
If you mark it as an ebike ride they don't keep track of time on segments.
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Old 11-27-17, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by gregf83
You can record them as a normal ride and check the 'hide from leaderboard' box. You'll still be able to look and track all your results but you won't be taking any KOMs.

Ahhhh, good to know, thanks.

Keith
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Old 11-27-17, 09:37 AM
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Anybody had recent Strava problems with ride tracking stopping or starting without manual intervention?

Two rides ago tracking didn't start until about two miles remained on ride (phone in pocket); last ride it stopped tracking with about 1/2 mile to go. iPhone, iOS 11, latest Strava update.

I haven't had such problems before, with exception of a couple possible instances of user error (when nothing gets tracked, as opposed to part of a ride)
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Old 11-27-17, 09:40 AM
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I wish there was a filter for "race result" as well as eBike, age, gender etc. You can conclude that based by the ride times being close to each and on the same day.

Some races everyone is way down the list as everyone was cruzing, while others there was some huge attack and they take the first 2-3 pages.

I do kinda like trying to find what race it was by the Strava evidence.
Here's one: https://www.strava.com/segments/620210
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Old 11-27-17, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
So "my" E-Bike guy is apparently doing it deliberately-- less than 24 hours after I had flagged his KOM-stealing E-Bike ride, he came back and E-Biked that segment alone-- literally just that 3.5 mile segment. The lightest amount of sleuthing shows that he got the E-Bike on November 11 (as that's when his average ride speed jumped 6mph) so I just went and flagged every ride he's done since the 11th.

Having heard tell of others encountering E-Bikers going out after KOMs, I thought that it was just internet speculation or suspicion. But I can tell you for sure, these people exist. He had gotten into the top 10 on the climbing segments of the Redlands Bicycle Classic TT course, just a week after averaging 13-14mph on flat road.

I imagine there are some out there who are less flagrant about getting themselves onto the leaderboards electrically, and I doubt Strava cares about them either. After all, the leaderboards are a slight step above meaningless. Doesn't mean it doesn't get me senselessly riled up.
Despite hearing similar types of things across a variety of sports, I'm still amazed that people like this can exist. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in order to "accomplish" something that no one except you will ever care about? And you know you cheated to do it so it's tainted for you. I just don't get it.
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Old 11-27-17, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by OBoile
Despite hearing similar types of things across a variety of sports, I'm still amazed that people like this can exist. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in order to "accomplish" something that no one except you will ever care about? And you know you cheated to do it so it's tainted for you. I just don't get it.
I enjoy Strava a bit like a fan of any race or sport. It is different, with a different venue and of course not exactly like real racing, but fun as a spectator no mater what. As it is not real-time, I can passively look people up, cross ref results etc.

The word "cheat" needs a lot of definition for me. I didn't see the segment, but generally when a KOM is taken using a motor it is fairly obvious. I don't see that as cheating, rather just being inconsiderate, oblivious, sloppy etc...

KOM cheating for me is when someone does something unusual (motor) in such a way as to move their place without the results themselves being obviously brought into question. I have not seen this personally, although I expect they are there, just that if it was done well - I don't notice :-). When I see someone on a leader board I'll look to see where else they are. I may look up their cycling results. It generally checks out. When it is weird, I'm not going to flag it unless I know a whole bunch more, and I know it is unique.
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Old 11-27-17, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by OBoile
Despite hearing similar types of things across a variety of sports, I'm still amazed that people like this can exist. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in order to "accomplish" something that no one except you will ever care about? And you know you cheated to do it so it's tainted for you. I just don't get it.
Lots of people record their rides with Strava and don't care about their segment times. If they ride an ebike they'll naturally move up on the leaderboard. Assuming that they bought an ebike because of Strava or that they're deliberately trying to get a KOM is a bit of a stretch. I use an ebike occasionally and don't always remember to log it correctly so I might temporarily take a KOM on my commute route. I'm not sure anyone's riding e-bikes on meaningful (90+% aren't) segments.
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Old 11-27-17, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by gregf83
Lots of people record their rides with Strava and don't care about their segment times. If they ride an ebike they'll naturally move up on the leaderboard. Assuming that they bought an ebike because of Strava or that they're deliberately trying to get a KOM is a bit of a stretch. I use an ebike occasionally and don't always remember to log it correctly so I might temporarily take a KOM on my commute route. I'm not sure anyone's riding e-bikes on meaningful (90+% aren't) segments.
No issue with people who just forget or don't notice... but the post I responded to certainly makes it sound deliberate. When the guy's KOM was removed, he came right back and rode that segment (and just that segment) again to take it back.
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Old 11-27-17, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by OBoile
No issue with people who just forget or don't notice... but the post I responded to certainly makes it sound deliberate. When the guy's KOM was removed, he came right back and rode that segment (and just that segment) again to take it back.
Deliberate does not make it cheating.

The word is used a lot, but I don't want it to cheapen the real meaning being used to describe someone that is just a jerk.

To repeat, will someone please share such a segment/ride that someone did something unfair to get?

Also, again, unfair does not mean cheating.

Last edited by Doge; 11-27-17 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 11-27-17, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by OBoile
Despite hearing similar types of things across a variety of sports, I'm still amazed that people like this can exist. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in order to "accomplish" something that no one except you will ever care about? And you know you cheated to do it so it's tainted for you. I just don't get it.
I agree with one of the posts above-- if you have a powered bike that will do 30mph, might as well just do the segments in a car. It's got a 250W hub, and the Strava estimated power for his rides is usually 310-330W, so this guy is just soft-pedaling the 70-90 minutes until the battery runs out. I mean, it sounds like fun, but I would never use it to climb Strava leaderboards.
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Old 11-27-17, 09:41 PM
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Can someone clarify something for me: why record an e-bike ride on Strava at all? Aren't there other apps for just keeping track of mileage and such, that don't bother with rankings, "personal best" times and other such athletic-oriented data? Is it because Strava is just the go-to data collection platform? For instance, VeloViewer relies on it, and it has all kinds of interesting ways of looking at routes, and metrics that are about exploration, not performance.

Maybe the folks who are interested in the performance data will learn eventually and clean up their act when it comes to e-bike rides. Easier said than done, I suppose - I know I don't always remember to tag my Citibike rides as commutes (or even Citibike rather than my default road bike), which actually makes my data look worse....
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Old 11-27-17, 11:05 PM
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Sorry to step away from the e-bike topic for a moment, but since this is the Strava thread I feel it's justified.

Two or three weeks ago I joined the Strava GCN group, which has something like 60k members now. One interesting result is that on a majority of my rides now I'll pick up a random kudo from someone else in the GCN group who is apparently following the club activity feed. I've gotten kudos from Germany, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Qatar, various places in the US, a couple from various places in Asia or the pacific, etc. Each time I check out the rider's Strava page, and often they'll have photos and such up that they took during their rides that give me a little taste of what the area they are from is like. The kudo I got today is from some guy in Tasmania, and he's got the coolest photos up from some of his rides in territory that can only be described as looking like the jungle. Anyhow, I think it's kind of cool.
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Old 11-28-17, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Doge
Deliberate does not make it cheating.

The word is used a lot, but I don't want it to cheapen the real meaning being used to describe someone that is just a jerk.

To repeat, will someone please share such a segment/ride that someone did something unfair to get?

Also, again, unfair does not mean cheating.
You don't think using an e-bike without properly recording that fact is cheating? That's a bit silly.

What if it was Phil Gaimon who was using the e-bike? Would it still not be cheating?
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Old 11-28-17, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by SethAZ
Sorry to step away from the e-bike topic for a moment, but since this is the Strava thread I feel it's justified.

Two or three weeks ago I joined the Strava GCN group, which has something like 60k members now. One interesting result is that on a majority of my rides now I'll pick up a random kudo from someone else in the GCN group who is apparently following the club activity feed. I've gotten kudos from Germany, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Qatar, various places in the US, a couple from various places in Asia or the pacific, etc. Each time I check out the rider's Strava page, and often they'll have photos and such up that they took during their rides that give me a little taste of what the area they are from is like. The kudo I got today is from some guy in Tasmania, and he's got the coolest photos up from some of his rides in territory that can only be described as looking like the jungle. Anyhow, I think it's kind of cool.
That is cool. I think I'll join that group. Certainly sounds cooler than people getting worked of over the technical definition of cheating.
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