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Endurance bikes: Giant vs Canyon

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Endurance bikes: Giant vs Canyon

Old 02-10-18, 03:30 PM
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sebi
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Endurance Bike: Giant vs Canyon

Hello friends,

I am considering buying an endurance road bike, mainly for pleasure cycling (50-75 mi long rides).
I'd be curious what would you'd choose among the following bikes (sorry I cannot post links):

1) 2017 Giant Defy Advanced 2 - $1600 (2017 close-out)
Shimano 105

2) 2018 Giant Defy Advanced 1 - $1800 (on sale)
Shimano Ultegra with some exceptions

3) Canyon Endurace CF SL Disc 7.0 - $1800 (I can get 10% off)
Shimano 105

I've tried the Giant Defy 1 so far and it was a pretty smooth ride and I will get a chance to try a Canyon next week.
1) Which one would be more comfortable in terms of road vibrations? Looking at the geometry, I can see the Canyon is a bit more "aggressive"?
2) Is the quality comparable between the bikes brands? I know they are both reputable brands. I see the Canyon price point is a bit higher despite their direct sales model but I also know Giant makes their own frames.
3) 2018 Giant Defy Advanced 1 @ $1800 seems like a good deal but I was discouraged when I saw it has Giant Conduct hydraulic disc brake instead of Shimano and Shimano FC-RS510 crankset (instead of Ultegra).

Thanks for any input!

Last edited by sebi; 02-10-18 at 03:33 PM.
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Old 02-10-18, 03:45 PM
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Out of the two Giants, I would not do the 2018 for the reason that you stated - the move to a hybrid braking system is pretty chintzy. The crankset doesn't concern me as much.

I'm sure that the Canyon is a great bike, but for $200 savings and (presumably) local support in the event of warranty issues, I'd do the Giant.
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Old 02-10-18, 08:17 PM
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1) 2017 Giant Defy Advanced 2 - $1600 (2017 close-out)
Shimano 105

2) 2018 Giant Defy Advanced 1 - $1800 (on sale)
Shimano Ultegra with some exceptions
Some good deals on the Giants.--The 2018 Giant Defy Advanced 1 retails for over
$2400.At those prices I would like one of the Giants.

Last edited by Joeyseven; 02-10-18 at 08:28 PM.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:06 AM
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I just purchased a 2017 Defy Advanced 2. Haven't had a chance to ride it yet (and likely won't for another few weeks) due to the weather, but I picked it over a 2018 model for the reason WhyFi listed. They kind of cheaped out a bit with the 2018 parts. The brakes are likely the big thing, but having 105 cranks was also nice for me if/when I might get a power meter. Both Stages and 4iiii make ones that can be put on a 105 crank.

That being said, the price I paid was roughly what you're being offered, but I didn't have the chance to get the advanced 1 on sale (it would have been full price). But, I do think the 2018 advanced 1 is a bit of a rip off. You can get the advanced 2 and upgrade the components yourself for less than the difference in price as there's only a couple pieces that are different.

The big improvement for the 2018 bikes is the tubeless rims/tires. But, from what I understand, the rims are the bike's weak link anyway, so this is something you would likely look to upgrade at some point anyway.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:18 AM
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I'm interested in this comparison as well. I'm looking at picking up either an endurance road bike, or a cyclocross bike. Honestly probably leaning towards the cyclocross.

Regardless...Giant and Canyon seem to be as far as I can tell the best value nice bikes out there. Having local support would be nice. I do my own work though, and I like the look of Canyon bikes more (though not their cyclocross bikes...). So I'm pretty torn.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:23 AM
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You can't beat Giant for quality control, as they literally have control over every aspect of their bike, down to the the carbon fibre and resin.

Comfort is personal? Just going with appearance, Canyon? Customer Service, I'd go with Giant. If you have problems with Canyon, you're gonna have to deal with Germany or having to find a local shop that Canyon approves of to do repairs etc. With Giant, you'll have direct support from whoever you are buying it from. Overall customer experience, I would expect Giant to be a slam over Canyon. Canyon seems to be a great option if you are looking for that direct from OEM experience, if there are no problems. I've read numerous issues dealing with Canyon, something as stupidly simple as stem/handlebar becoming nightmare experience. Canyon flat out refusing as they claim frame size X gets handlebar/stem combo X, F you if you are not anatomically perfect for our bikes.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:26 AM
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Canyon may be made by Giant.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Canyon may be made by Giant.
I have my doubts. I suspect Canyon are actually made in China not in Taiwan, and not by Giant but by a few smaller manufacturers. I only say this because there are a lot of small direct from factory frames from China that mimic or look similar to Canyon's frames. I also suspect this because quality has been suspect from frame to frame. Sort of implies to me, multiple frame manufacturers make frames for Canyon, meaning Endurance SLX batch A is made in a different factory from Endurance SLX batch B. That's my suspicion with Canyon. I have the same suspicion for other brand specifically Cervelo and Orbea. My impression is that whenever factory can't meet the demands, they outsource to another smaller factory. I really do not believe for example Workswell/Hong-Fu etc sell enough frames to stay in business, I believe the bulk of their business is partnerships with Merida/Topkey/Keen Tech when they can't meet the demands of their contracts, outsource to them.

Even if they were made by Giant, Giant's own frames will be of higher quality just because Giant uses their own proprietary carbon/resin for their bikes, which they don't share with other brands.

Last edited by zymphad; 02-12-18 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:48 AM
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Its the Heat treatment that is the complex procedure, done right, .. We have Aluminum welders here.. they make Boats.


Trek uses Giant for most of their modest priced bikes .. hydroformed to a different shape ..
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Old 02-12-18, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Its the Heat treatment that is the complex procedure, done right, .. We have Aluminum welders here.. they make Boats.


Trek uses Giant for most of their modest priced bikes .. hydroformed to a different shape ..
That's awesome. Except all the bikes he is comparing are carbon.
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Old 02-12-18, 10:54 AM
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I would say 2018 Defy has marginally better value with the Ultegra derailleus and cassette, which i imagine have to be the newest R8000....but they use a 900g+ Shimano crankset thats worse and heavier than 105 and use 105 shifters.

So as a whole from a weight perspective, its a wash vs the full 105 kit from the Canyon, just may shift a touch nicer if indeed its R8000 parts.

Giant generally is going to give you a better bike for less money, but there's some cost cutting going on there.


Aesthetically speaking, I have not been a huge fan of the newer logo and neither of the Defy 4 color options speak to my personal must have taste, but i admit they often do look a lot better in person.

I do find the solid color Canyon straight up sexy in either the Stealth or StormGreen (military green), and the bike in general has that iconic look of the Ultimate whic makes it quite attractive.

The Endurace is also equipped with nicer wheels (1655g DT Swiss Splines) and Continental GP tires . I may be mistaken, but Giant PR-2 disc wheels are approach 1900g's.

Last edited by Esthetic; 02-12-18 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 02-12-18, 11:03 AM
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Here we are a tourist town selling history, nobody buys expensive carbon bikes, but they ship theirs here, to tour the coast.

the rare buyer, goes to Portland where they can test ride several kinds.. you should go test ride several..


OP which ones are sold where you live?






...
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Old 02-12-18, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by OBoile View Post
The brakes are likely the big thing, but having 105 cranks was also nice for me if/when I might get a power meter. Both Stages and 4iiii make ones that can be put on a 105 crank.
Pioneer, also.
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Old 02-12-18, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
Regardless...Giant and Canyon seem to be as far as I can tell the best value nice bikes out there. Having local support would be nice. I do my own work though, and I like the look of Canyon bikes more (though not their cyclocross bikes...). So I'm pretty torn.
The Domane SL5 disc models have seen a recent price drop and at $2500 are very competitive in this segment. The SL 5 Gravel (which is the same frame as the SL 5 Disc, but with a different paint job) is one of the best values out there right now, if you can find one - instead of the 505 levers, it has the Ultegra-level 685 levers and 805 calipers. I was able to find one in my size locally and was fortunate enough to have found it about two weeks before the shop's annual 20% sale (they didn't make me wait 'til the sale).
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Old 02-12-18, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
The Domane SL5 disc models have seen a recent price drop and at $2500 are very competitive in this segment. The SL 5 Gravel (which is the same frame as the SL 5 Disc, but with a different paint job) is one of the best values out there right now, if you can find one - instead of the 505 levers, it has the Ultegra-level 685 levers and 805 calipers. I was able to find one in my size locally and was fortunate enough to have found it about two weeks before the shop's annual 20% sale (they didn't make me wait 'til the sale).
Treks frame gimmicks sort of scare me

My fears very well my be irrational, be eh. Just seems like something else available to break that doesn't need to be there.
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Old 02-12-18, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
Treks frame gimmicks sort of scare me

My fears very well my be irrational, be eh. Just seems like something else available to break that doesn't need to be there.
It's not like Spec FutureShock™; they're essentially pivot points so that longer sections of the steerer/seat tube can flex. Having to replace a set of bearings is about as bad it could get.
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Old 02-12-18, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
Treks frame gimmicks sort of scare me

My fears very well my be irrational, be eh. Just seems like something else available to break that doesn't need to be there.
Agreed! Only the Emonda interest me as it seems to the carbon bike Trek makes that doesn't have half dozen gimmicks that could break. Maybe irrational, but all I think of when I see those iso/decoupler/integrated blah blah, great more stuff to break.
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Old 02-12-18, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by zymphad View Post
Agreed! Only the Emonda interest me as it seems to the carbon bike Trek makes that doesn't have half dozen gimmicks that could break. Maybe irrational, but all I think of when I see those iso/decoupler/integrated blah blah, great more stuff to break.
Ah, so you like bikes with as few bearings as possible? Yeah, you can't trust bearings. Might wanna get rid of those gears and derailleurs, too. Oh, and the brakes. You ride unicycles exclusively, right?
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Old 02-12-18, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
Ah, so you like bikes with as few bearings as possible? Yeah, you can't trust bearings. Might wanna get rid of those gears and derailleurs, too. Oh, and the brakes. You ride unicycles exclusively, right?
If only I could, but bike won't move then. I don't need ISO/decouplers/Trek blah blah nonsense though.
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Old 02-12-18, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by zymphad View Post
I don't need ISO/decouplers/Trek blah blah nonsense though.
IOW, you don't know what they are or how they work. Cool.
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Old 02-12-18, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
Ah, so you like bikes with as few bearings as possible? Yeah, you can't trust bearings. Might wanna get rid of those gears and derailleurs, too. Oh, and the brakes. You ride unicycles exclusively, right?
It’s a pretty simple, basic difference: wheels and cranks and handlebars are supposed to move. Frames aren’t. Therefore no reason for bearings in the frame.

But, like I said...it’s entirely possible Treks frames are better. I just dont see the payoff as being big enough to bother exploring some odd gimmick.
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Old 02-12-18, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
wheels and cranks and handlebars are supposed to move. Frames aren’t.
The wide variety of ways that compliance has been built in to frames/bikes would suggest otherwise.

Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
I just dont see the payoff as being big enough to bother exploring some odd gimmick.
Wouldn't you need to be able to test it before calling it a gimmick? Most professional reviews would disagree with your assessment uneducated guess.
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Old 02-12-18, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
The wide variety of ways that compliance has been built in to frames/bikes would suggest otherwise.



Wouldn't you need to be able to test it before calling it a gimmick? Most professional reviews would disagree with your assessment uneducated guess.
Lol like I said, I’m willing to be proven wrong, and am perfectly happy to claim ignorance on the subject. I do however remain unmotivated to explore the tech
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Old 02-12-18, 11:05 PM
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I have had a very good experience with Canyon almost to the point of becoming a fanboi, so I do like them. Also living in Denver, which is a bike capital where there are bikes galore, it seems like 8 out of 10 road bikes I see are Trek, Specialized, Cdale, and Giant. So if you want a bit more unique bike you tend to look past the big brands even if they are really good. But I did take a ride on a future shock Spec roubaix and it just felt like slop to me. I didn’t test ride a domane but I now kind of wish I had because it’s kind of a good do everything bike and I do like the Iso decouplers idea.
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