Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Longevity of Di2 drivetrains?

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Longevity of Di2 drivetrains?

Old 02-01-20, 01:15 AM
  #26  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 22,257
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15935 Post(s)
Liked 7,550 Times in 4,208 Posts
Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
They have made a LOT more Di2 since that first iteration. I would expect the spare batteries to be readily available in retail channels for some time after production ceases, and if at that point you still have a Di2 system you intend on using for years to come, just grab a spare or two then.

If you want a system that will last 20 years... maybe stick to mechanical, though much of that will be getting replaced as well and may not be the same parts in 20 years.
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Likes For Seattle Forrest:
Old 03-23-21, 11:52 AM
  #27  
dbf73
TFO
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: MSP
Posts: 272

Bikes: Trek Emonda SL7 eTap, Felt AR-B, Colnago Master Mapei

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked 12 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by Nachoman View Post
I agree. I've been on Di2 since about 2010, which was the original iteration of Di2.
But after about 5 years of use, I started having some battery issues (it went from getting about 1,500 miles per charge, down to about 500 miles per charge). I just lived with it. Then about 2 years later, it got really annoying because I had to keep charging it about once a week. I finally took it to every upper-end bike shop in town and personally scoured the internet, but the battery was no longer available and not serviceable.
Bought first gen Di2 in 2011 w external battery and it has been flawless. At least 1000 miles between charges until this month when the battery only held a charge for a hundred or so and then totally died. Nice thing about living in same city as QBP is that LBS had a new battery the same afternoon
dbf73 is offline  
Likes For dbf73:
Old 03-23-21, 12:54 PM
  #28  
Psimet2001 
I eat carbide.
 
Psimet2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 21,388

Bikes: Lots. Van Dessel and Squid Dealer

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1165 Post(s)
Liked 931 Times in 413 Posts
Originally Posted by dbf73 View Post
Bought first gen Di2 in 2011 w external battery and it has been flawless. At least 1000 miles between charges until this month when the battery only held a charge for a hundred or so and then totally died. Nice thing about living in same city as QBP is that LBS had a new battery the same afternoon
Q actually had something from Shimano in stock??!!! Stop the presses!
__________________
PSIMET Wheels, PSIMET Racing, PSIMET Neutral Race Support, and 11 Jackson Coffee
Podcast - YouTube Channel
Video about PSIMET Wheels

Psimet2001 is offline  
Old 03-23-21, 01:28 PM
  #29  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 22,257
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15935 Post(s)
Liked 7,550 Times in 4,208 Posts
Originally Posted by Psimet2001 View Post
Q actually had something from Shimano in stock??!!! Stop the presses!
These kids today, they don't know what presses are. I tell them we used to have smart phones made of paper, we'd buy a new one every day, sometimes they had to stop a production run to update the content. It's not like now where you buy a bike that pedals for you.
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Likes For Seattle Forrest:
Old 03-23-21, 01:43 PM
  #30  
Psimet2001 
I eat carbide.
 
Psimet2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 21,388

Bikes: Lots. Van Dessel and Squid Dealer

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1165 Post(s)
Liked 931 Times in 413 Posts
As a shop owner and mechanic- I would say that Di2 doesn't wear out any faster than a mechanical derailleur. The shifters actually tend to last longer. Not unheard of to have to replace the battery but there's also been some updates to new batteries that are also the brains of the system allowing for more versatility to be added to an old group just by updating the battery.

Also saw an old comment about not going wireless - as most of you know by now a semi-wireless Di2 Dura Ace group is expected to be announced soon. I have absolutely no inside scoop on that but seems to be the chatter. Wireless levers but wired for the derailleurs.
__________________
PSIMET Wheels, PSIMET Racing, PSIMET Neutral Race Support, and 11 Jackson Coffee
Podcast - YouTube Channel
Video about PSIMET Wheels

Psimet2001 is offline  
Old 03-23-21, 01:44 PM
  #31  
Psimet2001 
I eat carbide.
 
Psimet2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 21,388

Bikes: Lots. Van Dessel and Squid Dealer

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1165 Post(s)
Liked 931 Times in 413 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
These kids today, they don't know what presses are. I tell them we used to have smart phones made of paper, we'd buy a new one every day, sometimes they had to stop a production run to update the content. It's not like now where you buy a bike that pedals for you.
I thought of that right after I typed it...
__________________
PSIMET Wheels, PSIMET Racing, PSIMET Neutral Race Support, and 11 Jackson Coffee
Podcast - YouTube Channel
Video about PSIMET Wheels

Psimet2001 is offline  
Old 03-23-21, 02:08 PM
  #32  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,570

Bikes: TWO Cinelli superstar disc with SRAM Force AXS

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked 354 Times in 286 Posts
I've been through 8-9-10-11-12 speed drivetrains in 25 years, so extreme longevity doesn't concern me. I've already had both Campy and SRAM 12 speed drivetrains. I've never replaced worn out drivetrain parts, other than chains and once a cassette with several Ti sprockets. Never a warranty issue either. Having two bikes in play nearly always helps.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 03-23-21, 06:46 PM
  #33  
robbyville
Senior Member
 
robbyville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Palm Desert, CA
Posts: 2,405

Bikes: Speedvagen Steel

Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 387 Post(s)
Liked 169 Times in 115 Posts
Almost but not quite a zombie thread but I’ll add that the guy who bought my bike is still going strong with the DI2 that I installed in 2013 despite the bike having fallen off his bike rack at speed last year and all parts being transferred to the new frame!
robbyville is offline  
Likes For robbyville:
Old 03-26-21, 01:44 PM
  #34  
dbf73
TFO
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: MSP
Posts: 272

Bikes: Trek Emonda SL7 eTap, Felt AR-B, Colnago Master Mapei

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked 12 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by dbf73 View Post
Bought first gen Di2 in 2011 w external battery and it has been flawless. At least 1000 miles between charges until this month when the battery only held a charge for a hundred or so and then totally died. Nice thing about living in same city as QBP is that LBS had a new battery the same afternoon
update - turns out battery not bad. New battery dead after a day. Operation on charged battery fine but quick drainage guess due to partial short somewhar. Since this is my trainer bike now, I’ll wait til outdoor season a regular thing and then investigate further. For now will remove battery when not riding
dbf73 is offline  
Old 03-26-21, 06:57 PM
  #35  
Kimmo 
bike whisperer
 
Kimmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,447

Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1447 Post(s)
Liked 658 Times in 468 Posts
Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
I also might add that I have had to do zero adjustment on the RD or FD since the initial install. The same could not be said for any of the mech drivetrains I've had.
As a mechanic, I can tell you that quality mechanical derailers can hold adjustment very well, but it's rare for cables and housings to be installed as well as necessary for solid reliability.

Much like cup and cone bearings being regarded as inferior by many, due to them rarely being sold properly adjusted...

Cables, particularly the RD cable, need to be die-drawn and completely free of kinks. Even the tight curl imparted by badly installing a cable can be problematic (SRAM shifters do this despite your best efforts, but it's okay since they opted to sacrifice low shift effort for high signal-to-noise; they're less affected by this stuff). When this signal-to-noise ratio is too low, the indexing in the shifter doesn't have enough say in the position of the derailer to work crisply (looking at you, 1st-gen Shimano 10s). But the biggest offender is housings, and one issue in particular leads to adjustment going out over time, which folks incorrectly attribute to cable stretch, which is. not. a. thing.

What the thing is: poorly-seated ferrules, generally. Also, when you cut shift housing, the line across the ends of the strands is more or less perpendicular to the axis of the housing, until you bend it. For the RD loop, it can be worth holding it in the shape and hitting the ends with a dremel. Anyway, seating the ferrules - with the cable installed but before adjustment (try to clamp the cable tight enough not to slip but don't mangle it too much), grab the exposed cable at the downtube... just kidding lol, you can't do that these days. The chain should be in the small cog and ring. Now, shift the shifter without turning the cranks - this loads up the cable beyond its normal operating tension and gets the housing bedded into the ferrules, and the ferrules bedded into the cable stops. Plastic and metal ferrules both deform somewhat in this process; you want this to happen before adjustment.

Careful now - you have all this stored energy in your shift system it's not designed to take. Escapement shifters (Shimano, SRAM, some Campy) really don't like releasing a cable that's under a lot of tension and can suffer damage from that - turn the cranks to release that cable tension. Now unclamp the cables and continue from the point most mechanics jump straight to after installing the cables. Hopefully you don't have a munted section of cable just near the pinch bolt, but if you do, oh well, at least it'll stay in adjustment and the ferrules will still be bedded in when you replace the cable. Some folks reckon you should change the housings whenever you change the cables, but I reckon that's going overboard. Friction does increase as the linings wear; you want to replace them now and then. Thankfully, the RD loop is easy to swap and is responsible for a lot of the friction.

Beyond that, there's wear in the derailer pulleys (easy sorted), pivots and FD cage (sadfase). Not to mention drivetrain wear, which can sometimes be missed as the cause of poor shifting. I think it's possible for a chain to show minimal wear lengthwise while having a lot more lateral slop than new, which will definitely affect shift performance, so it's worth considering if everything else checks out. Folks forget to check hanger alignment too.

Just out of interest, have you used mechanical SRAM?

ETA: lol, just realised this is a zombie thread I've already replied to

Last edited by Kimmo; 03-26-21 at 07:04 PM.
Kimmo is offline  
Old 03-26-21, 07:13 PM
  #36  
Kimmo 
bike whisperer
 
Kimmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,447

Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1447 Post(s)
Liked 658 Times in 468 Posts
Originally Posted by Psimet2001 View Post
Wireless levers but wired for the derailleurs.
Like that FSA vapourware! Makes a lot of sense, sleekest way to do it.
Kimmo is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 09:04 AM
  #37  
noodle soup
Senior Member
 
noodle soup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 8,905
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4692 Post(s)
Liked 1,834 Times in 986 Posts
Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
Like that FSA vapourware! Makes a lot of sense, sleekest way to do it.
FSA Electronic shifting is real. I've built CF frames that were used by FSA (at Interbike and the NAHBS) for display/demo bikes..
noodle soup is offline  
Likes For noodle soup:
Old 03-27-21, 09:49 AM
  #38  
Psimet2001 
I eat carbide.
 
Psimet2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 21,388

Bikes: Lots. Van Dessel and Squid Dealer

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1165 Post(s)
Liked 931 Times in 413 Posts
Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
FSA Electronic shifting is real. I've built CF frames that were used by FSA (at Interbike and the NAHBS) for display/demo bikes..
Someone just put out a review after having ridden them for a long time. Can't remember who or where but it was well done and the group seemed of interest.
__________________
PSIMET Wheels, PSIMET Racing, PSIMET Neutral Race Support, and 11 Jackson Coffee
Podcast - YouTube Channel
Video about PSIMET Wheels

Psimet2001 is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 11:01 AM
  #39  
popeye
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Posts: 1,857

Bikes: S works Tarmac, Felt TK2 track

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 335 Post(s)
Liked 144 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
Pretty much my experience. I've had mine since 2013 and it's got many many thousands of miles on it. Zero issues with the Di2 part of the drivetrain but I have replaced cassettes, chains and chainrings. I also might add that I have had to do zero adjustment on the RD or FD since the initial install. The same could not be said for any of the mech drivetrains I've had.

That all said, I've recently upgraded a mech bike to eTap and I have to say I like that system very much. So I think the same translates to electrical drivetrains vs mechanical ones.

J.
Welcome to the world of broken shift cables Zombie.

Last edited by popeye; 03-27-21 at 11:12 AM.
popeye is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 01:34 PM
  #40  
JohnJ80
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 4,476

Bikes: N+1=5

Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 783 Post(s)
Liked 162 Times in 120 Posts
Originally Posted by popeye View Post
Welcome to the world of broken shift cables Zombie.
Not tracking you on this. ETap has no shift cables.
JohnJ80 is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 03:06 PM
  #41  
popeye
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Posts: 1,857

Bikes: S works Tarmac, Felt TK2 track

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 335 Post(s)
Liked 144 Times in 90 Posts
Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
Not tracking you on this. ETap has no shift cables.
Read it backwards.
popeye is offline  
Old 03-27-21, 03:15 PM
  #42  
eduskator
Senior Member
 
eduskator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Québec, Canada
Posts: 1,045

Bikes: TCR Pro 0 / Revolt 2

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 458 Post(s)
Liked 268 Times in 202 Posts
Never heard of anyone having issues with DI2. Seems like it's built like a tank.
eduskator is offline  
Likes For eduskator:
Old 03-27-21, 05:46 PM
  #43  
Kimmo 
bike whisperer
 
Kimmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,447

Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1447 Post(s)
Liked 658 Times in 468 Posts
Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
FSA Electronic shifting is real.
Yeah, I didn't mean full vapourware, just so rare that I'll be surprised if I ever see it in front of me.

Anyway, wireless shifters with the derailers wired to a single battery is definitely the smartest way to do it, and FSA did it first, good on em.
Kimmo is offline  
Old 03-28-21, 03:45 PM
  #44  
noodle soup
Senior Member
 
noodle soup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 8,905
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4692 Post(s)
Liked 1,834 Times in 986 Posts
Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
Yeah, I didn't mean full vapourware, just so rare that I'll be surprised if I ever see it in front of me.

Anyway, wireless shifters with the derailers wired to a single battery is definitely the smartest way to do it, and FSA did it first, good on em.
I got to play with it for a bit, and it works fairly well.

swapping to a Shimano cassette helped it shift quicker. SRAM 11 speed groupsets also benefit from this change.
noodle soup is offline  
Likes For noodle soup:
Old 03-28-21, 08:54 PM
  #45  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 8,949

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Salsa Timberjack Ti, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Phil Wood Apple VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame, Proteus frame, Ti 26 MTB

Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2503 Post(s)
Liked 1,549 Times in 1,033 Posts
My Di2 has been going fine since 2016 or so Ultegra 6870. I had a front derailleur blow up but that was covered under warranty and I can't blame that on the Di2 it was just a bad derailleur that finally failed.
veganbikes is offline  
Old 03-29-21, 01:09 AM
  #46  
Kimmo 
bike whisperer
 
Kimmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,447

Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1447 Post(s)
Liked 658 Times in 468 Posts
Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
I got to play with it for a bit, and it works fairly well.

swapping to a Shimano cassette helped it shift quicker. SRAM 11 speed groupsets also benefit from this change.
Every bike can benefit from a Shimano drivetrain. It's a shame there isn't more discernment in the market to give them their due. Who invented HyperGlide, folks?

If you think about it, chains, cogs and rings are almost certainly the part of the bike that relies most on precise manufacturing and nuanced design, the best of which can only be the product of a huge company with engineering resources to burn. Derailers, particularly the electronic variety, would be a close second; at least Shimano has the rep it deserves for those.

And don't get me started on hubs, oh my god. Folks will take any old junk and call it gold.

Last edited by Kimmo; 03-29-21 at 01:12 AM.
Kimmo is offline  
Old 03-29-21, 11:16 PM
  #47  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 22,257
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15935 Post(s)
Liked 7,550 Times in 4,208 Posts
Originally Posted by eduskator View Post
Never heard of anyone having issues with DI2.
I know someone who thinks the derailleurs look a little funny.
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Likes For Seattle Forrest:
Old 03-30-21, 04:53 AM
  #48  
noodle soup
Senior Member
 
noodle soup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 8,905
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4692 Post(s)
Liked 1,834 Times in 986 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
I know someone who thinks the derailleurs look a little funny.
they do look a little strange, but not nearly as bad as Campanolo and SRAM rear derailleurs.
noodle soup is offline  
Likes For noodle soup:
Old 03-30-21, 08:05 AM
  #49  
eduskator
Senior Member
 
eduskator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Québec, Canada
Posts: 1,045

Bikes: TCR Pro 0 / Revolt 2

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 458 Post(s)
Liked 268 Times in 202 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
I know someone who thinks the derailleurs look a little funny.
If that someone calls this an issue, he/she must be very spatial!
eduskator is offline  
Likes For eduskator:
Old 03-30-21, 06:04 PM
  #50  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 22,257
Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15935 Post(s)
Liked 7,550 Times in 4,208 Posts
And if it's the worst problem I've ever heard about anybody having with Di2... 🙂
Seattle Forrest is offline  
Likes For Seattle Forrest:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.