cthenn

The amount of ignorance in this...I can't even.

Dan333SP

Exactly. Not only is there no guarantee he'd be competitive in the GT races versus the established riders even if he put in all the time/work, he would be in for a world of misery getting down to the weight required to be competitive on mountain stages. Bradley Wiggins went through exactly that, and although he did manage to win the Tour, he is more of the exception than the norm (and may not have been clean). You can read about Wiggo's transformation here-

Bradley Wiggins: The transformation - Cycling Weekly

WalksOn2Wheels

And he's been all over the map physiologically. From track to Grand Tours to classics where he put on some weight.

And now he's massive compared to his Tour days. Here he is last December doing indoor rowing:


This article shows the contrast even more drastically:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/other...urged-11652084

WalksOn2Wheels

So what were you trying to say in the thread title? I might be losing a little too much brain power over it.

Dan333SP

“Best of us”? “Beseech us”? “Better than us”? “Covfefe”? So many questions.

Campag4life

I don't like Phinney's personality which is contrived, stilted and tries too hard to be hip. A phony. Maybe a nice guy if he drops the façade off camera but on camera he comes off as a duffus. A pretty good but not great bike rider tho.

But love Sagan. He's the best and so great for the sport. What a breath of fresh air. You can't win at that level and not be a killer, but man, you couldn't draw up a better personality. What charisma and yes, the chicks watch pro cycling because of him.

Will say however, even tho Froome has to be given props for his metronome, workman approach, his current med fiasco withstanding...until Sagan wins the TdF...if he ever does, he will not be considered great. Great comments in this thread about Sagan's weight and training keeping him from winning the prestigious race. He got robbed last year. A disgrace. Mighty mouse who is known for shooting the gap due to his diminutive size, was foolhardy to shoot the gap against superman Sagan who would have put Boonen or anybody else into the wall...probably the greatest road racing bike handler on the planet or ever. Idiot governing body who not only robbed Sagan of his run but of us watching his brilliance.

WhyFi

I'm pretty sure it's "Sagan = he's the cyclist we deserve, but not the one we need, right now."

WalksOn2Wheels

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor...#Major_results

I'm guessing you mean "good, but not great" in the sense of he doesn't pull down massive results regularly. But he's much better than your average no-name domestique and he came back from a pretty horrific injury. He just finished 8th in the race that started this thread. I'd call him a great rider, but not one of "the" greats.

Also, it's not a facade, he's just a privileged white kid from Colorado. He's about as hipster as you can get. It's not an act. You don't have to like it, but it certainly isn't phony.

Campag4life

I said good but not great. That's what he is. A good rider but likely will never win the TdF.

As to not a façade, I suppose in some way's that is worse.

We should take a poll to see how many here like Taylor Phinney's 'shtick'. I ain't no prude...in fact the opposite but he really sux as a person. I was hoping it was an act...lol.

WalksOn2Wheels

He's won national and world titles in Track and TT, the most recent being national TT champ in 2016. He even wore the Polka Dot jersey at the TDF in 2017. If winning the TdF is your measure for great, then Sagan is also relegated to "good, but not great" status.

memebag

What do people not like about Taylor Phinney's personality? Everything I've seen from him seemed witty and intelligent. Is there something I'm missing or is this just a matter of taste?

Campag4life

You really want to debate who is the better cyclist...Phinney versus the three time world champion Sagan?

How about Phinney versus Boonen? Or Phinney versus Cancellara?

Both Boonen and Cancellara are better cyclists and may not go down as great. Phinney is pretty good tho like I said.

Campag4life

Are you from Colorado?

Must be a matter of taste as you say.

Taylor Phinney's alter ego:

memebag

Nope, Texas. So some of y'all just don't like stoners?

Campag4life

Lets see if Phinney does the commentary for this year's TdF.

WalksOn2Wheels

I think you're letting your opinion of his personality color your opinion of his skills. He's an accomplished rider. Not one of "the" greats by any stretch, but certainly a great rider. Any no-name support rider in a stage race is a good rider. Someone with that many national and world titles to their name, even if they aren't specifically in the road racing discipline, is a great rider.

Campag4life

In bold above. Ridiculous. A person's talent for riding has nothing to do with his personality. Contrast the personalities of all the great riders which btw have no comparison to Phinney's stoner persona. And for the last time, Phinney is a good pro rider and not great.

You carry on without me and will let others explain it to you.

WhyFi

memebag

Why?

MKahrl

I take exception to the term "One Day Wonder" as applied to Sagan. It sounds it bit pejorative like "One Hit Wonder" for singers who had only one hit in their entire career. With not a single other song worth remembering it's a wonder they had that one hit.

In Peter Sagan's case he's won a great many of the toughest races against the top competition and no one wonders how he does it.

As one of only two riders to win the points classification 5 times in the Tour de France it's clear he's more capable than a large majority of riders in multi day tours as well.

WalksOn2Wheels

That's cute that you think everyone agrees with your opinion.

But hey, my opinion is also an opinion, so there you go. I think we can both agree he'd drop us pretty hard on one of his recovery rides.

superdex

Someone hasn't watched the spring classics at all.

rgr555

what makes sagan a great or best rider?

is he gifted in the lungs and physique? i feel like anyone who trains in the gym properly can get a similar physique. how much of it is cycling technique? i know his sprints at the end seem very calculated, very high IQ rider. what makes him the best?

Campag4life

Yes, very high cycling IQ without question. Extraordinary bike handling skills that can't be taught in the gym...but the difference between Sagan and mere mortals you can't see...heart and lungs.

FWIW, I am built identically to Eddie Merckx down to his skinny legs. Eddie is built like the boy next door with pretty unremarkable musculature. Same with Greg Lemond. Difference you can't see. Same applies to most top cyclists.

Its also neurological. Extraordinary coordination:

Iride01 

No, I didn't. They are one-day races. So again, you people are consistently making my point.