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SRAM eTap AXS vs Dura Ace Di2

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SRAM eTap AXS vs Dura Ace Di2

Old 10-19-20, 10:21 PM
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TTron
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SRAM eTap AXS vs Dura Ace Di2

Im looking at purchasing a Roubaix Pro or S Works. Reviewers seem very excited about the SRAM with the wide gear range, shifting, charging, configurability, but seem to ding it for price and added weight. Whats reality for durability and reliability vs Dura Ace? Am I able to adjust once and leave it along? Im very happy with 105 di2 on my Tarmac Pro, except for the fat finger shifting up, but need down. Terrain here is both flats and hills. Appreciate the feedback. Thx
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Old 10-20-20, 12:17 AM
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I was just about to post an almost identical question about the differences between eTap AXS and Ultegra Di2.

The bike I'm looking at has otherwise identical models with the drivetrain bring the difference. The SRAM is $500-ish more, includes a power meter, and has one more speed.

But I have zero personal experience with electronic shifting. My current bike has Shimano 105 on it.

Last edited by guachi; 10-20-20 at 08:13 AM.
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Old 10-20-20, 09:36 AM
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One's 12sp and wireless, the other is 11sp and wired. Google will provide you with hundreds of useful posts/articles.
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Old 10-20-20, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by guachi View Post
The SRAM is $500-ish more, includes a power meter, and has one more speed.
Who makes the Power Meter?
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Old 10-20-20, 10:26 AM
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Di2 every day of the week and twice on Sunday. No question about it.
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Old 10-20-20, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by seattle forrest View Post
di2 every day of the week and twice on sunday. No question about it.
+1
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Old 10-20-20, 01:11 PM
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The main reason I prefer SRAM (from way back in the RED10 days) is that I never fat finger shifts, not even in the winter with heavy vague feeling gloves, and that the brake levers don't pivot (no longer relevant, but old Shimano ones did).

For Cyclocross that was a huge differentiator, as shifting is hard enough already when bouncing around with muddy hands.

But I still greatly prefer the ergonomics of SRAM (with one big fat shift lever tab) over Shimano.
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Old 10-20-20, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by jadocs View Post
Who makes the Power Meter?
Product description says "SRAM Force AXS Power Meter". So it could be anyone and rebranded as SRAM, for all I know. It doesn't mention if it's double- or single-sided.
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Old 10-20-20, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jadocs View Post
Who makes the Power Meter?
I'd assume its a Quarq since Sram owns the brand.

https://www.sram.com/en/quarq

https://www.sram.com/en/sram/models/pm-frc-d1
"Designed specifically for electronic shifting and featuring Quarq’s premier DZero power measurement technology, the SRAM Force AXS power meter is a huge step forward in power meter design."

"Power balance measures left and right legs separately"


Last edited by GlennR; 10-20-20 at 07:08 PM.
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Old 10-20-20, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by guachi View Post
Product description says "SRAM Force AXS Power Meter". So it could be anyone and rebranded as SRAM, for all I know. It doesn't mention if it's double- or single-sided.
Most likely QUARQ since SRAM owns that brand.
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Old 10-20-20, 09:48 PM
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Nothing is substantially better than virtually any element of Dura-Ace, and some elements are streets ahead.

Shimano established ownership of the road bike with 7400, and has kept its grip pretty much ever since. The number of times they screwed something up in the three and half decades since, you can count on one hand.

Might as well ask if you should buy a Ford or a Toyota.
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Old 10-20-20, 11:24 PM
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Originally Posted by TTron View Post
Im very happy with 105 di2 on my Tarmac Pro, except for the fat finger shifting up, but need down.
Nobody noticed this?
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Old 10-21-20, 04:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
Might as well ask if you should buy a Ford or a Toyota.
It's Ford vs Cheby.
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Old 10-21-20, 11:37 AM
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SRAM owns Quarq and Powertap now. They made their own power meter and bought the tech to do it.

On the rest - I probably shouldn't comment. Too many people I know who work in places see this stuff. Good luck in your search.
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Old 10-21-20, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Psimet2001 View Post
SRAM owns Quarq and Powertap now. They made their own power meter and bought the tech to do it.
That's typical SRAM. They don't really innovate, they buy companies that innovate(Zipp, Rock Shox, Avid),
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Old 10-21-20, 09:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Psimet2001 View Post
SRAM owns Quarq and Powertap now. They made their own power meter and bought the tech to do it.

On the rest - I probably shouldn't comment. Too many people I know who work in places see this stuff. Good luck in your search.
I'm a PC enthusiast. Compared to PC component reviews bike review websites and YouTube channels are garbage.
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Old 10-22-20, 07:25 AM
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Di2 will soon be 12 speed and your new purchase will be largely outdated. Sram added a 12 sprocket to gain range and then gave it up with the 13T difference at the crank. Campy didn't do that.

I used nothing but Campy for 25 years, so I had 10 and 11 speed long before shimano users. I waited until chorus 12 came out last July to get 12 speed. Just a couple of months ago I switched to force axs, but kept my Campy 48/32 crank for more range. The 48/10 top gear is like a 53/11 and proved to be more than I needed, so I'm now using a 46/30 grx crank with force 10-36 for a 552% range, which is more than any sram offering.

A sram 12 speed cassette will also work great with a Campy 12 drivetrain.

Last edited by DaveSSS; 10-26-20 at 06:42 AM.
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Old 10-22-20, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
That's typical SRAM. They don't really innovate, they buy companies that innovate(Zipp, Rock Shox, Avid),
That is either "financial engineering cobbled together assimilar parts" ala computer associates, which is garbage.

Or it is "adult supervision and tactical aquisition of tech into a well integrated company" ala GE or some private equity or VC fund models (the good ones) which is a good thing.

So far from SRAM I have seen more of the latter and less of the former.

Also, TREK bought bontrager, and Specialized bought Roval.... Garmin bought... TACX maybe? WHOO was bought by... um... wait.... bought Speedplay, so power pedals are probably coming up soon.

Wanna know why the industry tends to do that? I'd bet it has everything to do with Patents.
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Old 10-22-20, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by nycphotography View Post
That is either "financial engineering cobbled together assimilar parts" ala computer associates, which is garbage.

Or it is "adult supervision and tactical aquisition of tech into a well integrated company" ala GE or some private equity or VC fund models (the good ones) which is a good thing.

So far from SRAM I have seen more of the latter and less of the former.

Also, TREK bought bontrager, and Specialized bought Roval.... Garmin bought... TACX maybe? WHOO was bought by... um... wait.... bought Speedplay, so power pedals are probably coming up soon.

Wanna know why the industry tends to do that? I'd bet it has everything to do with Patents.
Some companies innovate and build quality components, other companies buy companies that build quality components.
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Old 10-22-20, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
Some companies innovate and build quality components, other companies buy companies that build quality components.
That's true, but also completely irrelevant except as some kind of ego attachment to a fantasy of how the world "should" be. All I care about is if they produce quality components at competitive prices with good distribution and customer service (and maybe with good HR policies and company culture). I don't really care if they acquire expertise organically or if they go out and buy it, so long as they integrate the acquisitions and manage the company like responsible, competent, adult leaders.

Speedplay is a classic example of the former (innovators and engineers) desperately in need of adult supervision from the latter. The Wahoo acquisition is a very good thing (I hope) for me as a speedplay customer who has loved the product but despised the company for over a decade.
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Old 10-22-20, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by nycphotography View Post
That's true, but also completely irrelevant except as some kind of ego attachment to a fantasy of how the world "should" be. All I care about is if they produce quality components at competitive prices with good distribution and customer service (and maybe with good HR policies and company culture). I don't really care if they acquire expertise organically or if they go out and buy it, so long as they integrate the acquisitions and manage the company like responsible, competent, adult leaders.

Speedplay is a classic example of the former (innovators and engineers) desperately in need of adult supervision from the latter. The Wahoo acquisition is a very good thing (I hope) for me as a speedplay customer who has loved the product but despised the company for over a decade.
I realize this thread is rapidly evolving away from the original question, but I'm curious about speedplay the company - I'm just curious what the company has done. Really just curiosity - I was away from serious cycling for a little over a decade, and have been fascinated by some of the new players (wahoo, for example), the old guard (Shimano, Campy, Garmin), and the not so new anymore, as well as the consolidation that has occurred.
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Old 10-22-20, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
That's typical SRAM. They don't really innovate, they buy companies that innovate(Zipp, Rock Shox, Avid),
Yes.. doubletap and eTab were not innovative.

If you want to broaden your product line the fastest way is you buy a proven product. It's just more cost effective than to develop a new one from scratch and then compete.

Just look at Facebook, Google, Microsoft and Apple.

Fiat bought Chrysler to get a foothold in the USA. with that they never would of been able to reintroduce Fiat and Alfa to the US which is a HUGE market not to be in.

FYI.. I've never had a problem getting a Zipp technician on the phone.. good luck talking to anyone at Sram. So they seem to have two different customer service philosophies. .
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Old 10-22-20, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post

FYI.. I've never had a problem getting a Zipp technician on the phone.. good luck talking to anyone at Sram. So they seem to have two different customer service philosophies. .
SRAM used to only work with dealers for their customer service, and they were extremely easy to deal with. If a part broke, they would send out a replacement without a hassle. Often an upgraded version.

Sometimes the rep would act like theyve never heard of the problem, but they finally stopped acting shocked when E-tap was first released.
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Old 10-22-20, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
SRAM used to only work with dealers for their customer service, and they were extremely easy to deal with. If a part broke, they would send out a replacement without a hassle. Often an upgraded version.

Sometimes the rep would act like theyve never heard of the problem, but they finally stopped acting shocked when E-tap was first released.
The only issue I had with a Sram product was the right shifter on my CX bike. It was a Rival CX1 and they sent a replacement that included the shifter, hose and rear caliper. They did it very quickly and all though the dealer. But the end user can't get them on the phone.
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Old 10-22-20, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
The only issue I had with a Sram product was the right shifter on my CX bike. It was a Rival CX1 and they sent a replacement that included the shifter, hose and rear caliper. They did it very quickly and all though the dealer. But the end user can't get them on the phone.
That's exactly why dealers exist. We get paid handle that. Communication to SRAM becomes much more streamlined and fact based that has gone through the lens of training and experience. They have our information on file. Makes the time on the phone and the transaction simple.

No OEM wants to spend outrageous tons of money on staffing teams of people who then have to try and diagnose technical issues with untrained people over the phone. That's the job of the computer/tech industry.
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