Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

New to tubeless

Notices
Road Cycling It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle. -- Ernest Hemingway

New to tubeless

Old 02-06-23, 03:50 PM
  #1  
Shadco 
Resident PIA
Thread Starter
 
Shadco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: City of Oaks, NC
Posts: 648

Bikes: Gunnar Roadie, Look 765 Optimum

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 118 Posts
New to tubeless

Shakedown ride went great today, should I expect similar pressure drop over time compared to my tube setup? Used 95 psi with 25cs on my old bike, 77 front, 79 rear on new bike with 28cs. Even though I was concentrating on the new bike and new drivetrain I ended up going quicker on each segment.




.
__________________
--
Shad
I knew where I was when I wrote this
I don't know where I am now...
05 Gunnar Roadie Chorus/Record
67'er
Shadco is offline  
Old 02-06-23, 04:12 PM
  #2  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,997

Bikes: Cinelli superstar disc, two Yoeleo R12

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 946 Post(s)
Liked 494 Times in 398 Posts
I lose about the same amount of pressure with tubeless, as tubed. I prefer orange seal endurance sealant. For pressure, see the zipp pressure calculator. https://axs.sram.com/guides/tire/pressure

I'm switching over to all hookless rims for the lowest pressure. I have 23mm and 25mm IW hookless rims.
DaveSSS is offline  
Likes For DaveSSS:
Old 02-06-23, 04:53 PM
  #3  
Shadco 
Resident PIA
Thread Starter
 
Shadco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: City of Oaks, NC
Posts: 648

Bikes: Gunnar Roadie, Look 765 Optimum

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 118 Posts
Originally Posted by DaveSSS View Post
I lose about the same amount of pressure with tubeless, as tubed. I prefer orange seal endurance sealant. For pressure, see the zipp pressure calculator. https://axs.sram.com/guides/tire/pressure

I'm switching over to all hookless rims for the lowest pressure. I have 23mm and 25mm IW hookless rims.
that is what I used to determine starting pressures.

.
__________________
--
Shad
I knew where I was when I wrote this
I don't know where I am now...
05 Gunnar Roadie Chorus/Record
67'er
Shadco is offline  
Old 02-06-23, 05:59 PM
  #4  
fooferdoggie 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 568 Post(s)
Liked 729 Times in 441 Posts
it depends I am using a new sealant that was made for cars and such and reformulated for regular bikes. I have gotten over a month without any air loss. last time I had air los was when the temps went from the 40s to the 20s. thats at a bit lower pis around 50 to 60.
fooferdoggie is offline  
Old 02-07-23, 02:30 PM
  #5  
ratell
Full Member
 
ratell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 435
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked 35 Times in 26 Posts
My experience was that pressure loss got better. I did two bikes at the same time. My wife's bike had a moderate amount of loss that over time became the same as tubes. I assume because of better setting of the bead and spreading of the sealant. My bike had more loss that went away when I added sealant (I assume because I got the bead set better the second time around). Now both bikes don't lose anymore air than tubed bikes.
ratell is offline  
Likes For ratell:
Old 02-07-23, 04:02 PM
  #6  
masi61
Senior Member
 
masi61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 3,442

Bikes: Puch Marco Polo, Saint Tropez, Masi Gran Criterium

Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1025 Post(s)
Liked 350 Times in 251 Posts
If you are losing a significant amount of air between rides with tubeless, you usually have a problem with the taping job. My tubeless wheels stabilize once properly installed and maintain rideable pressure over longer periods of time. My other bike is latex tubed and thus loses 10-20 psi overnight thus necessitating re-inflation each time.
masi61 is offline  
Old 02-07-23, 05:41 PM
  #7  
jaxgtr
Senior Member
 
jaxgtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 6,180

Bikes: Trek Domane SLR 7 eTap AXS, Trek Emonda ALR 6, Trek FX 5 Sport

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 520 Post(s)
Liked 1,091 Times in 662 Posts
Also check the valve stem, and the core is tight as well. I had a small leak that ended up being the core was not tight enough.
__________________
Brian | 2023 Trek Domane SLR 7 eTap AXS | 2016 Trek Emonda ALR 6 | 2022 Trek FX Sport 5
Originally Posted by AEO View Post
you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

jaxgtr is offline  
Likes For jaxgtr:
Old 02-08-23, 07:27 AM
  #8  
eduskator
Senior Member
 
eduskator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Qubec, Canada
Posts: 1,438

Bikes: TCR Pro, Revolt Adv

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 618 Post(s)
Liked 358 Times in 276 Posts
Pressure loss will depend on how well your tires beads are sealed on the rim. The type, and especially the quality of the sealant used will make a huge difference.

I always ride 20-25kms immediately after installing new TL tires and sealant. It helps create a nice seal. In fact, some tire manufacturers like Schwalbe have included this step in their mounting instructions.
eduskator is offline  
Likes For eduskator:
Old 02-08-23, 12:52 PM
  #9  
Zaskar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 698
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 131 Posts
I've been playing with tubeless tires since 2012 - mtn, road, gravel. Currently have 5 bikes, 3 of them are tubeless. I've had bootleg tubeless conversions, factory taped, self-taped (1 and 2 layers), hookless, hooked...

I can offer one sweeping generalization regarding pressure loss: Compared to Tubed, Tubeless tires lose more pressure over the same time period.

Factors include: Everything the guys already mentioned plus (or maybes its multiplied by) the installer's skill level.

Last edited by Zaskar; 02-08-23 at 01:05 PM.
Zaskar is offline  
Likes For Zaskar:
Old 02-08-23, 02:57 PM
  #10  
Trsnrtr
Super Moderator
 
Trsnrtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 22,243

Bikes: Trek Emonda, Giant Propel, Colnago V3, Co-Motion Supremo, ICE VTX WC

Mentioned: 104 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9967 Post(s)
Liked 3,564 Times in 1,668 Posts
Originally Posted by Zaskar View Post
I can offer one sweeping generalization regarding pressure loss: Compared to Tubed, Tubeless tires lose more pressure over the same time period.
Same here as far as pressure goes. I've had many tubeless setups since 2016 and pressure loss overnight is a given for me. No big deal as I check pressure before every ride.
__________________
Keep the chain tight!







Trsnrtr is offline  
Likes For Trsnrtr:
Old 02-08-23, 03:02 PM
  #11  
Frank72
Full Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: KCMO
Posts: 200

Bikes: 2022 Ribble Endurance Disc Sport 2018 Trek Emonda Al4, 2012 Motobecane Heat Ti,

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times in 66 Posts
Hey my guy at the LBS showed me a trick to seal tires. Get a 5 or 3 gal bucket. After the tire is aired and has sealant, set wheel and tire flat on bucket for a couple hours and then turn over for a couple hours let sit over night turn over etc. This really did the trick for sealing a stubborn tire that did not want to stay aired.
Frank72 is offline  
Likes For Frank72:
Old 02-08-23, 07:22 PM
  #12  
tempocyclist
Senior Member
 
tempocyclist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Australia
Posts: 603

Bikes: 2002 Trek 5200 (US POSTAL), 2020 Canyon Aeroad SL

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 218 Post(s)
Liked 493 Times in 239 Posts
^ That's a good tip. Will have to remember that one.

I've always use the "bounce and rotate" method to splash sealant all around inside the tyres, then pop the wheels back on the bike and go for a short ride!

This is a good Tubeless Install and Tips video:

tempocyclist is offline  
Old 02-08-23, 07:51 PM
  #13  
fooferdoggie 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 568 Post(s)
Liked 729 Times in 441 Posts
Originally Posted by Frank72 View Post
Hey my guy at the LBS showed me a trick to seal tires. Get a 5 or 3 gal bucket. After the tire is aired and has sealant, set wheel and tire flat on bucket for a couple hours and then turn over for a couple hours let sit over night turn over etc. This really did the trick for sealing a stubborn tire that did not want to stay aired.
when I did mine the weather was too bad ro ride so every hour or so with nothing to do I would swirl there sealant around the tire a bit. sometimes add air if needed. Had two days to do this.
fooferdoggie is offline  
Old 02-08-23, 09:28 PM
  #14  
Shadco 
Resident PIA
Thread Starter
 
Shadco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: City of Oaks, NC
Posts: 648

Bikes: Gunnar Roadie, Look 765 Optimum

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 118 Posts
So…

I mounted the tires on a new build about 2 weeks before I finished the build. I seated them using an air compressor and kept them inflated to around 90 psi needing to refresh about every 2 days.

Monday AM was the time for the shakedown ride so I put 2 ozs in each tire with them off the bike, shook them back and forth then put them on the bike and spun them around good. Then I took them for a 15 mile ride.

It’s Wednesday night and they still have the pressure I set them at Monday AM. I used regular Orange Seal sealant. Tires are Schwalbe Pro One 28mm rims are Campy Shamal Carbons.

​​​​​​…
__________________
--
Shad
I knew where I was when I wrote this
I don't know where I am now...
05 Gunnar Roadie Chorus/Record
67'er
Shadco is offline  
Likes For Shadco:
Old 02-08-23, 09:51 PM
  #15  
letrebici
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Great tips above. another tip if you haven't already... add a Valve core tool to your saddle bag. the little plastic ones will do, or the full sized one is still very small. check the VC when airing up before a ride.I converted my gravel bike with tubeless road tires the other day and had my second shakedown ride today and last night I checked and rear was flat. it was a loose valve core which I did not remove for installing the road tires but it was loose. I just replaced it entirely. Also pick up a package of replacement valve cores. I had them for my mt bikes. this is my first tubeless road set up. Enjoy your ride!
letrebici is offline  
Old 02-08-23, 10:01 PM
  #16  
jaxgtr
Senior Member
 
jaxgtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 6,180

Bikes: Trek Domane SLR 7 eTap AXS, Trek Emonda ALR 6, Trek FX 5 Sport

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 520 Post(s)
Liked 1,091 Times in 662 Posts
my valve covers are also a core tool if needed on the ride. Work really well.
__________________
Brian | 2023 Trek Domane SLR 7 eTap AXS | 2016 Trek Emonda ALR 6 | 2022 Trek FX Sport 5
Originally Posted by AEO View Post
you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

jaxgtr is offline  
Likes For jaxgtr:
Old 02-09-23, 05:07 AM
  #17  
Racing Dan
Senior Member
 
Racing Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,154
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1267 Post(s)
Liked 290 Times in 197 Posts
Originally Posted by Zaskar View Post
I've been playing with tubeless tires since 2012 - mtn, road, gravel. Currently have 5 bikes, 3 of them are tubeless. I've had bootleg tubeless conversions, factory taped, self-taped (1 and 2 layers), hookless, hooked...

I can offer one sweeping generalization regarding pressure loss: Compared to Tubed, Tubeless tires lose more pressure over the same time period.

Factors include: Everything the guys already mentioned plus (or maybes its multiplied by) the installer's skill level.
Hardly surprising considering there is ~26 ft of tyre to rim interface to keep airtight.
Racing Dan is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 06:47 AM
  #18  
Zaskar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 698
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
Liked 231 Times in 131 Posts
Originally Posted by Racing Dan View Post
Hardly surprising considering there is ~26 ft of tyre to rim interface to keep airtight.
Yet, the 37' of bead on my car hasn't lost a pound in 6 months. Granted, that's 35 psi vs. 80 psi. Still, my experience with tubeless is that when they lose pressure, it doesn't stop losing pressure at 40 or 30 psi.

But, those car wheels don't have spoke holes. Hmm... Seems like that tape job is pretty important.
Zaskar is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 07:29 AM
  #19  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,997

Bikes: Cinelli superstar disc, two Yoeleo R12

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 946 Post(s)
Liked 494 Times in 398 Posts
I buy wheels with no spoke access holes whenever possible. Many Fulcrum/Campy wheels and my BTLOS wheels require no rim tape. My Zipp wheels require tape.
DaveSSS is offline  
Likes For DaveSSS:
Old 02-09-23, 07:40 AM
  #20  
Shadco 
Resident PIA
Thread Starter
 
Shadco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: City of Oaks, NC
Posts: 648

Bikes: Gunnar Roadie, Look 765 Optimum

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 118 Posts
No rim tape needed on the Shamal’s either.

.
__________________
--
Shad
I knew where I was when I wrote this
I don't know where I am now...
05 Gunnar Roadie Chorus/Record
67'er
Shadco is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 09:10 AM
  #21  
RB1-luvr
I don't know.
 
RB1-luvr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: South Meriden, CT
Posts: 1,470

Bikes: '90 B'stone RB-1, '92 B'stone RB-2, '89 SuperGo Access Comp, '03 Access 69er, '23 Trek 520, '14 Ritchey Road Logic, '09 Kestrel Evoke, '17 Surly Wednesday, '89 Centurion Accordo, '15 CruX, '17 Ridley X-Night

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Liked 312 Times in 190 Posts
thank you to Tempo for that vid. I have no tubeless bikes nor plans to have any, but I enjoyed learning.
RB1-luvr is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 12:19 PM
  #22  
msu2001la
Senior Member
 
msu2001la's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,436
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1208 Post(s)
Liked 1,200 Times in 708 Posts
I lose 5-10psi per day on most of my tubeless installs, which is comparable to what I see with regular butyl tubes on higher pressure road tires.

The main difference is that tubeless tires seem to keep losing air until they go completely flat, so if left untouched for a month or so they will go completely flat. My tubed setups will lose a lot of air, but never go completely flat.

On lower pressure setups like gravel and MTB I get a lot less pressure drop, which is also true of tubed setups. My kid's bike has tubes, and at 35psi I won't need to touch them for many weeks.
msu2001la is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 12:41 PM
  #23  
eduskator
Senior Member
 
eduskator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Qubec, Canada
Posts: 1,438

Bikes: TCR Pro, Revolt Adv

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 618 Post(s)
Liked 358 Times in 276 Posts
Originally Posted by msu2001la View Post
I lose 5-10psi per day on most of my tubeless installs, which is comparable to what I see with regular butyl tubes on higher pressure road tires.

The main difference is that tubeless tires seem to keep losing air until they go completely flat, so if left untouched for a month or so they will go completely flat. My tubed setups will lose a lot of air, but never go completely flat.

On lower pressure setups like gravel and MTB I get a lot less pressure drop, which is also true of tubed setups. My kid's bike has tubes, and at 35psi I won't need to touch them for many weeks.
10-15PSI per day? That is not normal. There must be something you are not doing right.
eduskator is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 01:58 PM
  #24  
msu2001la
Senior Member
 
msu2001la's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,436
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1208 Post(s)
Liked 1,200 Times in 708 Posts
Originally Posted by eduskator View Post
10-15PSI per day? That is not normal. There must be something you are not doing right.
I literally wrote 5-10psi but since I guess we gotta argue about these things I'll check 'em today and then again tomorrow and report back.

I use a 20 year old floor pump gauge, so we're not talking NASA accuracy here.
msu2001la is offline  
Old 02-09-23, 01:59 PM
  #25  
alcjphil
Senior Member
 
alcjphil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 5,455
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1595 Post(s)
Liked 1,329 Times in 779 Posts
Originally Posted by Shadco View Post
No rim tape needed on the Shamal’s either.

.
Campagnolo 2Way fit wheels really shorten the learning curve when it comes to adopting road tubeless. I have owned my Shamal Ultra wheels for over 12 years now and setup has always been fairly easy. The earliest Hutchinson Fusion2 tires were more difficult to install than current offerings, but I quickly learned to mount them without tools and I have never had a problem getting them off either. Most of the bad experiences I have seen in this forum seem to be related to installation of rim tape which Campagnolo eliminated for their tubeless compatible wheels. BTW I also ride a LOOK
alcjphil is offline  
Likes For alcjphil:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.