Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Any High Speed Wobbles with Upset Airflow with Deep section rims at Speed?

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Any High Speed Wobbles with Upset Airflow with Deep section rims at Speed?

Old 09-08-23, 09:15 PM
  #1  
Grupetto Bob
Thread Starter
 
rsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 5,406

Bikes: Bikey McBike Face

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2186 Post(s)
Liked 4,633 Times in 2,451 Posts
Any High Speed Wobbles with Upset Airflow with Deep section rims at Speed?

Used 60mms rims front and rear and on a 1 mile 6-8% descent today. I was cruising along at 45 MPH when a box truck doing about 40 MPH (a WAG) uphill upset the airstream suddenly throwing me into a high speed wobble. I was able to slow it down as the wobble became more pronounced just before I stopped. The hill’s speed limit is 35 and there was a car behind me (thanks Varia) the whole time. When I got out of the lane, which I took on the way down, to the shoulder, the car creeped past me making sure I was all right. I have been down this hill several times at speed with no issue but there were also no box trucks.

Wonder if anyone else has had this happen? Is there an inherent danger with deep section rims at higher speeds? Thoughts?
__________________
Road 🚴🏾‍♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾‍♂️

”Your lips move but I can’t hear what your saying” DG






rsbob is offline  
Old 09-08-23, 10:18 PM
  #2  
don't try this at home.
 
rm -rf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: N. KY
Posts: 5,782
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 911 Post(s)
Liked 375 Times in 272 Posts
I've only had a couple of speed wobbles over all my years of riding. ( Riding just a typical road bike with low profile rims.)

They were each caused by sudden troubles that got me to grab the bars with a death grip and stiff arms. The oldest one was an unexpected sharp blast of side wind on a fast downhill. A more recent one was unseen gravel on an otherwise good road downhill. It's crazy how the initial wobble keeps going for a long time!

I googled my old comment, and located one of the threads. from 2009! The comments are still relevant.
Severe high speed wheel wobble
rm -rf is offline  
Likes For rm -rf:
Old 09-09-23, 08:41 AM
  #3  
Grupetto Bob
Thread Starter
 
rsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 5,406

Bikes: Bikey McBike Face

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2186 Post(s)
Liked 4,633 Times in 2,451 Posts
On another thread SierraRider commented that with his 45s he was doing 55 and was hit by a side wind gust which put him into a wobble as well. It appears that deep section rims may have more of a tendency to be affected by sudden wind changes at speed.

I too had a speed wobble on my Fondriest using 25s and old fashioned aluminum rims which developed a wobble any time I exceeded 40 MPH, it was cured with a new fork. Had many very interesting/clenching moments before the change.

I may switch the front wheel to a 35mm in the future when I know I will be doing fast descents as insurance.
__________________
Road 🚴🏾‍♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾‍♂️

”Your lips move but I can’t hear what your saying” DG







Last edited by rsbob; 09-09-23 at 08:50 AM.
rsbob is offline  
Old 09-25-23, 08:13 AM
  #4  
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Posts: 11
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
I have experienced the same with sudden, strong crosswinds on my 40mm carbon wheelset. It never happened with my old alloys, so it is most certainly the fault of the wheels.
Silver02M5 is offline  
Likes For Silver02M5:
Old 09-26-23, 09:40 AM
  #5  
just another gosling
 
Carbonfiberboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Everett, WA
Posts: 19,320

Bikes: CoMo Speedster 2003, Trek 5200, CAAD 9, Fred 2004

Mentioned: 114 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3783 Post(s)
Liked 1,812 Times in 1,305 Posts
I once had a bit of trouble riding a long descent at about 50 and being passed by many vehicles doing maybe 60, while using only slightly deep alu rims. That was on my spare bike, a CAAD9. Didn't a a real speed wobble, just a terrifying lot of wiggling. I never used it for that sort of a ride again. Never had a problem on my Trek. This thread maybe has me giving up the idea of getting deep rims. I do a lot of fast descending on somewhat busy roads.
__________________
Results matter
Carbonfiberboy is offline  
Old 09-26-23, 10:44 AM
  #6  
I'm good to go!
 
Iride01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,160

Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020

Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5842 Post(s)
Liked 4,466 Times in 3,078 Posts
Have you ridden the bike enough with low profile rims to know that the speed wobble doesn't happen with them in similar circumstances? I've only had one or two bikes that ever gave a death wobble. Both were old style geometry with long head tubes and just normal for their day non-aero rims.

Maybe I'm just not fast enough anymore! <grin>
Iride01 is offline  
Old 09-26-23, 10:55 AM
  #7  
Should Be More Popular
 
datlas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Malvern, PA (20 miles West of Philly)
Posts: 42,236

Bikes: 1986 Alpine (steel road bike), 2009 Ti Habenero, 2013 Specialized Roubaix

Mentioned: 556 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21735 Post(s)
Liked 8,171 Times in 3,819 Posts
I suspect the high-speed wobble is more related to a sympathetic/driven vibration that may not necessarily be caused by the deep section wheels per se.

In any case, it's scary and reminder to grab frame with your knees for stability etc.
__________________
Originally Posted by rjones28
Addiction is all about class.
datlas is offline  
Old 09-26-23, 12:25 PM
  #8  
Senior Member
 
79pmooney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 12,437

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Mentioned: 121 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4481 Post(s)
Liked 3,569 Times in 2,317 Posts
Originally Posted by datlas
I suspect the high-speed wobble is more related to a sympathetic/driven vibration that may not necessarily be caused by the deep section wheels per se.

In any case, it's scary and reminder to grab frame with your knees for stability etc.
+1 In many cases, the frame + rider geometry, stiffness, etc. has a harmonic resonance. The wheels or traffic or whatever are just the starters. (Tuning forks are quiet until they are hit.) My best bike with me on it has the tendency. Deepest rims it has ever seen are Velocity Aeros; not very deep. If I am strong, confident (and 15 years younger/fearless) speed wobbles simply aren't an issue. But even early on, I struggled on a cold wet ride with steep, narrow roads of poor pavement I didn't know. Now at 70, it starts around 40 mph. By contrast, the old racing bike I just picked up is rock solid at any speed this old man is ever going to go. I bet I could put rather deep rims on it and never have an issue; not that I am going to.
79pmooney is offline  
Old 09-26-23, 06:15 PM
  #9  
Grupetto Bob
Thread Starter
 
rsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 5,406

Bikes: Bikey McBike Face

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2186 Post(s)
Liked 4,633 Times in 2,451 Posts
Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
I once had a bit of trouble riding a long descent at about 50 and being passed by many vehicles doing maybe 60, while using only slightly deep alu rims. That was on my spare bike, a CAAD9. Didn't a a real speed wobble, just a terrifying lot of wiggling. I never used it for that sort of a ride again. Never had a problem on my Trek. This thread maybe has me giving up the idea of getting deep rims. I do a lot of fast descending on somewhat busy roads.
If I were to do it over again, 32 on the front and 55-60 on the back. That should take care of it.
__________________
Road 🚴🏾‍♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾‍♂️

”Your lips move but I can’t hear what your saying” DG






rsbob is offline  
Old 09-28-23, 08:24 AM
  #10  
Junior Member
 
88ss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Posts: 175
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 99 Post(s)
Liked 117 Times in 55 Posts
I would bet the heavier weight of deep rims adds to the tendency of a bike to stay in a speed wobble once it is there.
88ss is offline  
Old 09-28-23, 08:36 AM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Los Alamitos, Calif.
Posts: 2,449

Bikes: Trek 7.4 FX

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 998 Post(s)
Liked 872 Times in 506 Posts
I have no direct experience with high profile rims. I do know that my carbon Canyon seems to get blown around a little more than my other bikes just due to the lightweight nature of the bike.
TakingMyTime is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.