A hit.....to close to home...a loss of a friend
10-17-05, 07:59 AM
#52
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Originally Posted by badcompany9
The Charlotte Observer requires registration, so here is a copy of the article:
Cyclist dies in collision with off-duty city bus
Leier said she did not know details of Miller's other wrecks, but said they involved property damage and no injuries. She also did not know if he had been tested for drugs previously, but said drivers are terminated if they test positive.
Leier would not say whether it was uncommon for a driver to be involved in seven wrecks. She said union guidelines say drivers can face termination if they have four in 36 consecutive months. They can be fired sooner depending on the severity, she added.
Three of Miller's five previous wrecks were within 32 consecutive months, she said. After Friday, Miller had five wrecks in 32 months.
CATS supervisors report to all wrecks and have the discretion, Leier said, to allow the driver to take the bus back to the facility or to call someone else.
Cyclist dies in collision with off-duty city bus
Leier said she did not know details of Miller's other wrecks, but said they involved property damage and no injuries. She also did not know if he had been tested for drugs previously, but said drivers are terminated if they test positive.
Leier would not say whether it was uncommon for a driver to be involved in seven wrecks. She said union guidelines say drivers can face termination if they have four in 36 consecutive months. They can be fired sooner depending on the severity, she added.
Three of Miller's five previous wrecks were within 32 consecutive months, she said. After Friday, Miller had five wrecks in 32 months.
CATS supervisors report to all wrecks and have the discretion, Leier said, to allow the driver to take the bus back to the facility or to call someone else.
Crosscut sorry to hear about your loss. My heart goes out to you and the family.
10-17-05, 08:32 AM
#53
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I hope that the family is advised to sue the bus company. The bus company should compensate the family for allowing a murderer, with a proven record of being incapable of driving a large vehicle, to continue driving. It will not bring Todd back but the family definitely needs to be taken care of.
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10-17-05, 04:25 PM
#54
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Originally Posted by koffee brown
Sorry to read about the death of your friend. It really does anger me that the article pointed out that he was "riding fast with his head down". What does that have to do with anything? It's like they're looking for some sort of excuse to assign some of the blame to the cyclist. I'm angry at the bus company for not taking the guy back to the yard themselves, and why wouldn't they even perform the test at the hospital to begin with?
Such an unnecessary and avoidable loss.
Koffee
Such an unnecessary and avoidable loss.
Koffee
I'm a cyclist and I ride with cars all the time, so when I'm driving I try to be extra aware of cyclists (whether they're leg-driven or engine-driven). However, I can tell you that despite my extra efforts, it's not always possible to see the cyclists-->a few times I almost accidentally cut off cyclists (usually during bad conditions like it's dark and it's raining and they don't have lights or reflective clothing/gears). I might also be watching for other hazards when they get into my blind spot...yes, some cyclists are actually dumb enough to hang in my blind spot... Given the driving perspective, it's best to assume that drivers don't see you (most of you know this). Even if they do see you, it's best to wait for an acknowledgement before proceeding. I've been in some cases in which I'm like right in front of the driver, but even though they seem to see me, I don't seem to register in their consciousness (mind might be elsewhere). Experience tells me to be extra cautious when I'm on my bicycle...as I don't have a cage surrounding me.
Yes, I think it's inexcusable for the bus company to have such a driver remain on the force when he has had so many accidents! That's also one reason why I hate unions...difficult to get rid of lousy workers... By whose account did the report cite to say the cyclist was going fast and have his head down? It couldn't be the bus driver if he didn't even see the cyslist... From the sound of the article, it seems Todd might be riding parallel to the bus and it seems the bus driver turn w/o looking in the mirrors...
Sorry about your loss, I hope his family is doing okay. It's going to be rough for the family. Several months ago, my sister lost her husband in a car accident...leaving her with two young kids. I and my family has been trying to "fill in" ever since. Hopefully as a good friend of Todd, you can help his family out a bit. Hopefully Todd has life insurance, my sister's husband didn't...
10-17-05, 04:33 PM
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Update:
While I am still hurting, I am becoming more angry at the city and the CATS authority. Apparently today their lawyers have decided to call Todd's work to determine how safe a rider he was and his history of riding to work. This pisses me off! They allow their freaking ******* driver to drive a bus after he may be intoxicated or high on something, then send their crack pot lawyers off to investigate whether or not Todd was a safe rider. Seems they need to focus their attention on themselves. But hey this is the freaking government at work, using our tax dollars.
On our side we have the media which has contacted several of our team in efforts to further investigate the history of Todd and what cycling meant to him and what he did for the community. The reporter has promised us, that she will not let the story die and go away without finding out the results of the drug test and the actions the DA are taking. Today she reported back to us this.
Dear *****,
I am working on a follow up story today. I need to spend some time tracking
down reports from the police and CATS, but I will call you after that.
I can tell you that I've worked for years with the sergeant who was at the
wreck scene and have always found him to be completely fair -- even when
police officers have caused fatal wrecks. I think they work slower and more
carefully when a city employee is involved but in the end I think they call
it as they see it.
Melissa Manware
Public Safety Reporter
The Charlotte Observer
mmanware@charlotteobserver.com
I personally spoke to her this afternoon and she has made several calls regarding the case. The drug results are not back yet, and the police will not file a full report until they have that information. She expects it to be around two weeks. I also told her that many times a rider seems to have his head down while riding only to actually be very aware and looking where he is going. Just because he may appear to be looking down doesn't mean he is.
We are all emailing her to show how much this means to us and how it effects our lives. Especially those who commute. We don't want to turn this into a political thing but we want the right thing done.
We don't want this to be swept under the rug.
This weekend our team, several friends, and family, plus several bike shops are going to ride through uptown Charlotte to the accident site and hold a silent honor ride for Todd. It is the first step in healing for us. I think we may invite Melissa (reporter) to ride with us this weekend and show her what we deal with.
Thanks for all your thoughts and prayers.
Cross
While I am still hurting, I am becoming more angry at the city and the CATS authority. Apparently today their lawyers have decided to call Todd's work to determine how safe a rider he was and his history of riding to work. This pisses me off! They allow their freaking ******* driver to drive a bus after he may be intoxicated or high on something, then send their crack pot lawyers off to investigate whether or not Todd was a safe rider. Seems they need to focus their attention on themselves. But hey this is the freaking government at work, using our tax dollars.
On our side we have the media which has contacted several of our team in efforts to further investigate the history of Todd and what cycling meant to him and what he did for the community. The reporter has promised us, that she will not let the story die and go away without finding out the results of the drug test and the actions the DA are taking. Today she reported back to us this.
Dear *****,
I am working on a follow up story today. I need to spend some time tracking
down reports from the police and CATS, but I will call you after that.
I can tell you that I've worked for years with the sergeant who was at the
wreck scene and have always found him to be completely fair -- even when
police officers have caused fatal wrecks. I think they work slower and more
carefully when a city employee is involved but in the end I think they call
it as they see it.
Melissa Manware
Public Safety Reporter
The Charlotte Observer
mmanware@charlotteobserver.com
I personally spoke to her this afternoon and she has made several calls regarding the case. The drug results are not back yet, and the police will not file a full report until they have that information. She expects it to be around two weeks. I also told her that many times a rider seems to have his head down while riding only to actually be very aware and looking where he is going. Just because he may appear to be looking down doesn't mean he is.
We are all emailing her to show how much this means to us and how it effects our lives. Especially those who commute. We don't want to turn this into a political thing but we want the right thing done.
We don't want this to be swept under the rug.
This weekend our team, several friends, and family, plus several bike shops are going to ride through uptown Charlotte to the accident site and hold a silent honor ride for Todd. It is the first step in healing for us. I think we may invite Melissa (reporter) to ride with us this weekend and show her what we deal with.
Thanks for all your thoughts and prayers.
Cross
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10-17-05, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by brokenrobot
Very sorry to read this.
As an aside: WHAT is WRONG with the Charlotte bus agency? Reading the article, it sounds as though they suspected drugs were involved in the first crash (he was asked to come in for a test) - and they told him to KEEP DRIVING until he got back to the depot anyway?! Seems to me that if you think your driver is impaired, you GET HIM OFF THE ROAD!
Frankly, I suspect that even if the driver was sober when he hit the cyclist, he was too messed up on stress after the first incident to be handling his bus safely. As a matter of policy, drivers who cause accidents need to be IMMEDIATELY relieved of duty until they test clean...
As an aside: WHAT is WRONG with the Charlotte bus agency? Reading the article, it sounds as though they suspected drugs were involved in the first crash (he was asked to come in for a test) - and they told him to KEEP DRIVING until he got back to the depot anyway?! Seems to me that if you think your driver is impaired, you GET HIM OFF THE ROAD!
Frankly, I suspect that even if the driver was sober when he hit the cyclist, he was too messed up on stress after the first incident to be handling his bus safely. As a matter of policy, drivers who cause accidents need to be IMMEDIATELY relieved of duty until they test clean...
They said that they make everyone involved in an accident to take a drug test. Not because they suspected him of being on drugs. But, I do agree that they should have pulled him from the road after the first accident if for no other reason than being stressed out afterwards.
10-20-05, 08:56 PM
#57
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Update:
Credit: charlotte.com
No drugs, alcohol found in bus driver
The driver of a CATS bus involved in a fatal wreck Friday was not on alcohol or drugs, city officials said. He was tested after his bus collided with a bicycle, killing 36-year-old Todd Weaver.
The bus driver, 51-year-old Jerry Lee Miller, had been in a minor wreck 30 minutes earlier and was taking his bus back to the station. Prosecutors have not decided whether he'll face charges.
Credit: charlotte.com
No drugs, alcohol found in bus driver
The driver of a CATS bus involved in a fatal wreck Friday was not on alcohol or drugs, city officials said. He was tested after his bus collided with a bicycle, killing 36-year-old Todd Weaver.
The bus driver, 51-year-old Jerry Lee Miller, had been in a minor wreck 30 minutes earlier and was taking his bus back to the station. Prosecutors have not decided whether he'll face charges.
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10-20-05, 09:53 PM
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Im so sorry, my condolences to his family, I can not imagine what they must be feeling right now. As far as the case goes, I dont see how they could rule in favor of the bus driver. Im no law expert but lets face it, bus driver with a horrible record, Cyclist who commutes to work every day, who was wearing his helmet, and besides, whoever saw todd with his "head down", was that person examining todd directly? Did they just cause a glimpse of him? Did he suffer from post-traumatic shock? All factors that can rule out his credibility regarding todd having his head down. It would be unjust to not convict the driver...
10-20-05, 10:08 PM
#59
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Originally Posted by meme
... By whose account did the report cite to say the cyclist was going fast and have his head down? It couldn't be the bus driver if he didn't even see the cyslist... From the sound of the article, it seems Todd might be riding parallel to the bus and it seems the bus driver turn w/o looking in the mirrors...
...
...
12-22-05, 07:14 AM
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Update: Just heard on the radio that the bus driver - who was fired two weeks after the accident that killed Crosscut's friend - has been charged. Here's a Charlotte Observer piece:
Misdemeanor count levied against man fired after October collision
MELISSA MANWARE
The driver of a CATS bus that collided in October with a bicycle, killing its rider, was charged Wednesday with misdemeanor death by vehicle.
Police have issued a criminal summons to Jerry Lee Miller, who has since been fired, Detective Charlie Brown said. The summons means Miller will not go to jail.
Brown said the misdemeanor charge was the most serious available to prosecutors. Because Miller was not impaired at the time, a felony charge would not have applied.
Todd Weaver, 36, of Concord was killed Oct. 14 when a Charlotte Area Transit System bus turned in front of him as he rode his bicycle along South Tryon Street. Weaver, an avid cyclist and father of two, had been riding home from his job off Tyvola Road, something he did about twice a week, family members said.
Miller, who drove CATS buses for 4 1/2 years, had been involved in a minor wreck minutes before the collision with Weaver, hitting a planter at Fourth and South Tryon streets.
Miller was told to take the bus back to the transportation center and report for a drug test, which is standard procedure with any wreck where anyone could claim injury.
Weaver was headed north on Tryon. The bus, southbound on Tryon, collided with Weaver as the bus made a left turn to enter the South Tryon Bus Facility near Clanton Road. Weaver was thrown from his bike and pronounced dead.
Before that day, CATS spokeswoman Jean Leier said, Miller had been in five other wrecks: He hit a construction fence near the Mecklenburg County jail in June 2001, struck signs attached to utility poles and broke bus mirrors in September 2001 and February 2003, hit another pole in July 2004 and rear-ended a truck in October 2004.
Leier said CATS found that each of the wrecks was preventable.
Mark Weaver, Todd Weaver's brother, said the family is pleased prosecutors decided to charge the driver.
"I just want to make sure everyone takes Todd's death seriously and responsibly," he said.
Weaver said his brother's wife and children -- 11-year-old Brady and 7-year-old Elizabeth -- have had a difficult time.
"As hard as they are trying, it's hard to get through a season like this without constant reminders of the loss," he said. "We are doing everything we can to try to hold up the family and support them."
Misdemeanor count levied against man fired after October collision
MELISSA MANWARE
The driver of a CATS bus that collided in October with a bicycle, killing its rider, was charged Wednesday with misdemeanor death by vehicle.
Police have issued a criminal summons to Jerry Lee Miller, who has since been fired, Detective Charlie Brown said. The summons means Miller will not go to jail.
Brown said the misdemeanor charge was the most serious available to prosecutors. Because Miller was not impaired at the time, a felony charge would not have applied.
Todd Weaver, 36, of Concord was killed Oct. 14 when a Charlotte Area Transit System bus turned in front of him as he rode his bicycle along South Tryon Street. Weaver, an avid cyclist and father of two, had been riding home from his job off Tyvola Road, something he did about twice a week, family members said.
Miller, who drove CATS buses for 4 1/2 years, had been involved in a minor wreck minutes before the collision with Weaver, hitting a planter at Fourth and South Tryon streets.
Miller was told to take the bus back to the transportation center and report for a drug test, which is standard procedure with any wreck where anyone could claim injury.
Weaver was headed north on Tryon. The bus, southbound on Tryon, collided with Weaver as the bus made a left turn to enter the South Tryon Bus Facility near Clanton Road. Weaver was thrown from his bike and pronounced dead.
Before that day, CATS spokeswoman Jean Leier said, Miller had been in five other wrecks: He hit a construction fence near the Mecklenburg County jail in June 2001, struck signs attached to utility poles and broke bus mirrors in September 2001 and February 2003, hit another pole in July 2004 and rear-ended a truck in October 2004.
Leier said CATS found that each of the wrecks was preventable.
Mark Weaver, Todd Weaver's brother, said the family is pleased prosecutors decided to charge the driver.
"I just want to make sure everyone takes Todd's death seriously and responsibly," he said.
Weaver said his brother's wife and children -- 11-year-old Brady and 7-year-old Elizabeth -- have had a difficult time.
"As hard as they are trying, it's hard to get through a season like this without constant reminders of the loss," he said. "We are doing everything we can to try to hold up the family and support them."
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12-22-05, 09:02 AM
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I am sorry for your lost. My condolences to you and his family. Thanks for sharing the story and the picture.
P.S the paper did get one thing right, he's a big guy.
P.S the paper did get one thing right, he's a big guy.
12-22-05, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by sandy_pangle
Cross..... All you can do is pray and be a friend to the family. Perhaps you could organize a benefit ride for his family or use the funds as scholarship money for his children. It is a crushing blow to lose the leader of the pack and as bad as you hurt, they hurt much worse. They are in my prayers
I think a benefit ride would be a great idea. This is something your friend would appreciate if he were alive.
I'll pray for his family and you.
12-22-05, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by reneuend
I think a benefit ride would be a great idea. This is something your friend would appreciate if he were alive.
I'll pray for his family and you.
I'll pray for his family and you.
think the club did a memorial ride of some kind...
crosscut does not seem to be around much lately, but hope he sees this and stays in touch....
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12-22-05, 01:37 PM
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Although its been said many times, I too would like to extend my heartfelt condolences to the Weaver family and all of Todd's close friends.
I wish you all strength in this time of sorrow.
I wish you all strength in this time of sorrow.
12-22-05, 03:23 PM
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For all we know he could have just been riding in the drops. Having your head low with eyes up might look like "having your head down" to a bystander.
12-22-05, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by koffee brown
It really does anger me that the article pointed out that he was "riding fast with his head down". What does that have to do with anything? It's like they're looking for some sort of excuse to assign some of the blame to the cyclist.
That line really bothered me too.
12-22-05, 07:25 PM
#67
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Very sorry to hear about the loss of your friend.
I think it's always difficult to assign blame without knowing all facts and I think it's distasteful that certain individuals have decided to make comments on accountability and blame based on zero evidence.
I think it's always difficult to assign blame without knowing all facts and I think it's distasteful that certain individuals have decided to make comments on accountability and blame based on zero evidence.
12-22-05, 10:52 PM
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I can't stand reading about the death of a bicyclist. Let's all be careful out there. Sorry for your loss.
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12-23-05, 01:01 AM
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My heart goes out to Todd's family and friends.
I hope Todd's family is considering a wrongful death lawsuit against the driver -- or even better, against CATS.
The bus driver shouldn't have been driving. I hope CATS has already changed their policy so that no one else will be asked/allowed to drive following a crash.
I hope Todd's family is considering a wrongful death lawsuit against the driver -- or even better, against CATS.
The bus driver shouldn't have been driving. I hope CATS has already changed their policy so that no one else will be asked/allowed to drive following a crash.
12-23-05, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by maximum01
I think it's always difficult to assign blame without knowing all facts and I think it's distasteful that certain individuals have decided to make comments on accountability and blame based on zero evidence.
Put another way, you are driving on a road. An oncoming car crosses the centerline and colides with your car in your lane. Who is at fault? I can't see any way the bus drive wouldn't be ticketted for "failure to yield to oncoming traffic."
Not trying to vilify anyone. It was an accident. As a corrective action, the bus company should reduce the number of accidents that trigger a driver being pulled.
