patentcad

That 'cycling culture' thread led me to thinking of the state of road racing at the highest level today. While its origins are European and it remains a Euro sport, the major technology has been influenced so strongly by American companies and innovation it's hard to deny that the peloton and its 'cycling culture' have an American twist these days. Every road bike in the peloton has a sloping top tube - which comes straight out of American mountain bikes - and all this carbon fiber stuff was pioneered by companies like Trek nearly 20 years ago. Aero helmets, Oakley-style eyewear - the list does go on. And of course American riders WINNING 10 Tour de France titles since 1986 has helped disseminate this stuff. And out of NOWHERE (I think the first American raced in Europe in the 1970's). I'm sure we'll see other Americans ascend the TDF podium in the near future. I'm looking foward to it.

'Cycling culture'. Man the bike weenieism here just kills me. If you need me I'll be riding this morning. That's MY cycling culture. It's called shut up and ride.

EURO

What a load of rubbish.

my58vw

Cycling is a worldwide sport with worldwide intervention. You can not say the majority of inovations have occured out of a specific place in a specific area or country. Cycling is an evolving sport, and many companies have played a small part in that. On a typical bike you could have parts from europe (wheels), Italy (campy) or Japan (shimano), United States (trek, cdale road frames), Canada (cervelo).

Who wins the tour de france is not so much because of where the inovations come from (I agree many come from the US) but from where the rider with the biggest heart, best trainers and roads to train on come from... that could be ANYWHERE in the world!

Mandy

pigmode

Why do you only say that *after* you blab?

[edit] I threw in a smiley

mirona

Too true.

Anyway, here's how the world works: Euros start it, Americans buy into it, and Asians make it more efficient and productive.

shiftinjon

How can I say this in a way that won't offend...? How about, "what a load of rubbish!"

The first carbon fiber frame was manufactured here in America, by Exxon Graftek, in 75/76, and then the market was quickly co-opted by European companies like Peugeot, Bador, Vitus, etc.... Trek was way off the back with regards to CF development. In fact, nothing they are doing is original or innovative in the CF market.

Aerodynamics were in use long before 'mericans like Greg Lemond used aero bars and helmet in the TDF. Here is Francesco Moser using a very aerodynamic design in '84 to set the Hour Record.

https://www.lequipe.fr/Xml/Cyclisme/D...ser_230184.jpg

Eyewear???...a technological advantage???

Sloping top tubes???...a technological advantage???

terrymorse 

You forgot to mention that it was Americans who brought science to professional training. Prior to 1999, there wasn't a lot of science in the training methods.

Albany-12303

+1

shiftinjon

When Eddy B. came to America, he brought the accumulated knowledge, much of it developed through scientific methods, of the Eastern block countries, one of the reasons he had an immediate positive impact on the US cycling program.

Moser trained for his hour record with a HRM.

Arnie Baker's book on scientific training for cycling was published in '95.

This book was published in 1972 and was a collection of scientific training methods specifically adapted to cycling by the Italian Central Sports School:

baj32161

So I gather that this is your last post since you will be out riding and not "talking" in here.

See Ya!

patentcad

Of course not. I will be in here driving you all crazy with controversial diatribes on a regular basis. But take heart. The Spring is coming and I'll be riding many more hours. I'll have less time to entertain the weenies.

2Rodies

As for CF bike frames LOOK was light years ahead of Trek in this area. If you want to give America full props in cycling then you have to look to Mt Biking. We invented it and made it into the cycling sport of the '90's. Mt biking kept the cycling manufactures alive in the '90's which allowed them to survive to live through this road renaissance. As for making CF more inexpensive you would have to look at the auto racing industry, specifically F1, for bringing that into our daily lives.

EURO

You mean the American cycle manufacturers. There hasn't been a road renaissance in Europe, there was never a dip, unless you consider the '98 Festina scandal.

shiftinjon

..missed something... You've probably not heard of these people since you started following Lance and cycling, but Major Taylor raced in and was famous in Europe at the turn of the century. Audrey McElmury and Michael Hiltner were both successful racing in Europe pre-70's.

An interesting side note: Americans do produce more garbage than any nation in the world.

pigmode

Yeah, with a lot of stuff America did the "Japanese" thing by taking, innovating. In the meantime, look to Suntour and Shimano for their significant contributions to the drivetrain.

2Rodies

Yes, absolutely, I should have specified the Am market. Before the emergence of Mt Biking, cycling had really hit a low patch in the US. Funny thing, from a purely personal standpoint, I never got into the mt bike craze. The only reason I bought one was because all my buddies had abandoned the road for the dirt and I wanted someone to ride with.

But Euro's statement is true in another respect and that is why Euro riders and companies dominate the sport, it's part and parcel of their culture.

theshoemaker

Of course we do! We are so busy throwing away all of the trash talk everybody writes about us.

Every detail in this thread is debatable. Stand back, look at the great big basic bar graph of who contributed how much to what, then ask yourself why it matters.

shiftinjon

So could you debate these details, please(hoping )?

theshoemaker

Obviously you read my words, but you weren't listening.

shiftinjon

Just as I thought.

puddin' legs

Terry, I'm surprized at your short memory....the Russians and East Germans where the pioneers in sports training/doping/medicine/athelete screening and testing, etc.... Eddie B. came from the Polish system that had roots in the Soviet, etc...

DXchulo

There, I fixed that for you.

lotek 

And lets not forget Dave Staub who trained with Reg Harris and rode in Europe in the 50's

jbhowat

Wow. Maybe he's compensating, but you were the first guy to randomly and unnecessarily use the word 'penis' in a thread about bikes and cultures. Good job. Maybe you have some repressed (or not) feelings?

DocRay

American technology? Shimano is made in US?

Oh, Oakleys are the reason for the 10 TDFs?

Do you mean to infer that the bikes matter at all at the level of the Giro or TDF? LOL.

Sorry dude, but I'm with Euro on this one. As we learned from the Ben Johnson scandal inquiry in '84, US olympic teams, together with Nike, formed the most sophisticated doping research institute in the world. American riders used EPO years before the rest of the world had access from Amgen. The tech curve of doping is still in advance of the detection tests. That's the only US technology that is making a difference.