ravenmore

Before my race Sunday I was changing the cleats on my Specialized Carbon Comps. The new Look cleats come with screws that will accept a small allen wrench. While I think its about time they did this, I have to post fair warning - BE CAREFUL! You can overtighten 'em, which I never have been able to do with a regular screw driver.

The damage: I stripped one screw hole on one shoe, and also have 2 screws on so tight I can't back them out. I completely stripped the screws trying to get them out - with both the allen wrench and a regular screw driver.

Anyone have any ideas on how to get the @#$# remaining screws out and if the threads can be re-tapped on the shoe? I hate to write off a pair of $200 shoes.....

MacMan

Drill out the screws. The shoe threads should be OK if you do it gently. You'll have to clamp the shoe in a vise - so be careful not to crush the carbon sole!

Chicocreole

Hardware stores have screw extracors just bring the shoes with you and they should be able to help you out.

You will probably need a Power drill though!

reneuend

Yes. I worked as a machinist for 10 years and broken screws was a common occurance. We used modified carbon mill bits to remove screws, but you should be able to do the same with carbon drill bits.

Get a carbon drill bit smaller than the screw and drill it out.
Its possible to retap the threads as long as there isn't too much material loss. If not, I would try to see if you can replace the thread inserts.

Good luck!

Psimet2001 

+1 - Screw extractors are available at almost any hardware store. They look like "wormy" (my own expression) thread taps that have a reverse thread on them. Most decent sets come with the corresponding drill.

To overstate the obvious - be careful drilling. Most cycling specific fasteners tend to not be very drill friendly. Slow the bit down, and keep the tip lubricated. Should be OK.

botto 

OT and too late anyway - but it's generally a BAD idea to make equipment changes the day of, or even the day before a race/event what have you.

Good luck with the shoes.

edzo

for future reference...


when installing cleats, lightly grease the threads,
then smear clear silicone 'around' the hole, then install
cleat and tighten down, then coat all around the cleat
with clear sillycone, and clean up the excess. you are trying
to prevent water from getting to the bolts themselves


this will make it a little hard to replace the cleat (you
just have to remove bolts and pry with a screwdriver
to break the silicone) but
it will pretty much guarantee water and other crap won't
get in there and seize the bolts over the season.

works great for spuds and mtb riding

2Rodies

Rav allways put some white grease on the threads before you put them into the shoes. This will help you get them out when you need too.

ravenmore

Thanks - I was just going over my equipment the night before the race and noticed one of my cleats was worn too thin. I thought it might be dangerous as a cleat breaking in a ride/race can cause all sorts of problems when your foot comes flying out.

Getting the screws out is bad but what REALLY concerns me is stripping the screw hole.... I've never tapped anything - just know that you can if need be.....

jimbud

[IMG][/IMG]

I recommend getting a hold of a dremel tool and a 1" diameter carbon cut off wheel. Use the cut off wheel to grind a new groove straight acrossed the top of the head of the screw just wide enough for med. sized straight screwdriver blade. Make it deep enough to give the screwdriver some bite and then back the screw out using the new groove. I had the same thing happen to me.

Psimet2001 

Unless I am mistaken those are inserts. You can run into a lot of different problems. The inserts could tear out under the load of tapping. They are blind (not through holed) so you probably won't have enough of a lead in on most "plug"- taps (read common) to get a full thread if there is even enough left to re-tap. Bottoming taps with a small heli-coil could probably be done . . .

Bob S.

Ravenmore; Forgive me, I am not sure I fully understand the situation (sometimes I am slow that way).

What I think I read was: You have carbon soled shoes which are tapped (have female threads) to accept the cleat fasteners. Currently, one of the holes is stripped from screw over tightening and in the other holes are socket head (allen wrench type) screws which are stuck in place. The socket heads of these stripped. Correct?

Can you get any bit with an allen wrench? Possibly with a metric/SAE next size up? Can you get a with a small vise grip type wrench or similar on the outside of the socket.

Do you have or have access to a impact driver (the mechanical type that you hit the top with a hammer) in which you could intall a socket type allen wrech tool. This approach has served me well in the past.

Are the threaded holes directly in the carbon laminate in the sole, or are there threaded inserts there. If the screws are directly in the laminate, you may want to try, assuming you can get something into or around the socket head to turn the screw (or even the cut off wheel cut slot as mentioned above), try a very low amount of heat. I would suggest heating the tool, then putting the tool into or around the socket head, let it sit for a moment, then try to loosen. Don't use too much heat as you can damage the laminate. If the the threads are in an insert, skip this step as it may loosen the inserts in the sole.

If you have to drill for an screw extractor, I encourage you to use a drill press when drilling. I suspect the screws are very small which means a small drill bit which are easy to break. Also, if you go offcenter & drill onto the sole, you are toasted. The drill press with an appropiate table clamp or jig should make the drilling easy.

If you don't have, or don't have access to a good tool box & shop,(or if you are not used to this type fo problem) track down a friend, relitive, or co-worker who does (is is used to this type thing). It will make the job much easier & probably save the shoes & cleats.

As for the hole where the screw is stripped, I would suggest: Remove the insole from the shoe. Clean the hole with acetone & let the residue evaporate. Take the screw & coat the threads with a wax. Ideally this should be a high quality wax (mold release wax, agent, PVA, etc.), but a quality car wax should do the trick. Place bit of tape over the hole inside the shoe. Place a drop or 2 of high quality epoxy into the hole, gently insert & screw the waxed screw into the hole & let it sit. Don't try to tighten. Let the glue cure & give it a try. Again, don't ape it.

Hopefully, this will work. If not, let me know, there are a few other tricks to try before drilling & retaping for the next larger size screw.

Good luck & take your time. Don't force it. Bob

ravenmore

Thanks - yeah, never thought about oiling shoe/cleat screws. Boy, you can bet that will happen from now on.

The screws take both a allen and a regular flat screw driver. Some good ideas here - I'll try 'em and see what happens.

Oh well, at least my old shoes (that I had to use instead) are light blue shimano's that match our team kits......

jyossarian

I had the threaded inserts on my shoes replaced by the LBS after I stripped the inserts screwing in some SPD cleats. Maybe you can get the inserts replaced if you need to after you get the cleats out.

thewalrus

I did this once, I was able to get the bolt out using a large size of torx bit and a screwdriver. Don't choose a torx that's too small, but one you need to really JAM into the stripped-out hex bolt. It's a one-time operation so make sure you have the torx firmly seated before trying it, or you'll just strip it more.



You may also be able to get it out by using a odd-size (4.5mm) of hex driver, there are half-millimetre sizes available at larger hardware stores like Home Depot. If I remember right the crank bros. cleat bolt I stripped was a 4mm, and I could not fit a 5mm into it, but 4.5 would have worked if I'd had one.

Bobby Lex

Don't write off your $200.00 shoes. Write off your $15.00 cleats.

In other words: Cut the plastic cleat off leaving only the bolts sticking up out of the bottom of your shoe. There should be plenty enough bolt sticking out to grab onto (pliers, vice, etc.) and twist out.

Bob

funkiwan

I had the same problem. I attempted the dremel method but still wasn't able to get enough grab. I solved it by taking my cleats down to the local hardware store. They were able to bore out a hole using a drill bit, and then hammered a tap (not sure if that was what it was called, exactly. It was a tapered bit with four edges) into the drilled hole and used a wrench to apply torque to the hammered-in bit. It took a few tries on each bolt. I nearly hugged him when he got the first one out!

merlinextraligh

damn it is zombie thread night.

Hunt-man

In 2006 I was just getting over being fat and out of shape.

bostongarden

time warp dance

madpogue 

It's just a jump... to the left....