Specialized Dolce Elite - Specific questions
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Specialized Dolce Elite - Specific questions
I am helping a friend who bought one and we're trying to get her feeling comfortable on it. A few questions for those who ride one or who know someone who does:
1. She has the smallest size - 44 cm - which is exactly what all the fit calculators recommend. But the stem that the bike shop gave her - and that the fit calcs recommend - is only 70mm! Is this normal?
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
1. She has the smallest size - 44 cm - which is exactly what all the fit calculators recommend. But the stem that the bike shop gave her - and that the fit calcs recommend - is only 70mm! Is this normal?
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
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Last edited by theopowers; 04-21-06 at 08:01 AM.
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glad to help. I have a bike with similar geometry (Ruby Pro) and i also bought the Dolce for my sister. I migth need some additional details though My comments are below. Feel free to PM me again if you have other questions.
Giant has some great price points. The trouble is that they have a very odd fit. the guy at my lbs said that he has a hard time fitting certain peopel on them. they work great for people with long arms or long torsos because the top tubes are very long. I can't fit on a giant because of that.
anyway let me know if you need any other info.
Originally Posted by theopowers
I am helping a friend who bought one and we're trying to get her feeling comfortable on it. A few questions for those who ride one or who know someone who does:
1. She has the smallest size - 44 cm - which is exactly what all the fit calculators recommend. But the stem that the bike shop gave her - and that the fit calcs recommend - is only 70mm! Is this normal?
70mm is a short stem. Not the shorest however, that would be a 60 I believe. Generally speaking most frame manufacturers try to kee the stock stem around 80-90mm because if you go too long or too short it affects tha handling. Even though stems go from 60-120mm, most people don't want to be on the extremes. Too short and the bike behaves in a twitchy manner. Too long and the bike will be harder to steer. How tall is this person? I'm 5'3" and my inseam is 29" I think. My sister is 5'2" and has an inseam that is somewhere between 27 and 28. I'd probably want to know what some other measurements are to be more precise. Arm length and torso length also come into play here when selecting frame sizes and components. What did the fit calculators say about stem length and top tube length? anything? If not, I can point you to a site that will calculate this stuff.
For whatever fit calculator you used, on what basis did it give you the 44cm? Was it based on inseam length only and therefore just standover height? I don't have much standover clearance on any frame. On my 48cm Ruby (same geometry as the dolce) I have maybe 1/2". This is much less than the amount that these fitting people say I shoudl have! The onyl way I could get more than 1" of clearance is by going to a 44cm frame, but then allthe other dimensions would be too short. (the reach for example)
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
My bike has special bars on them that bring the shifters close to the bars. That way there is less stuff I have to grab in order to brake. I have the Dura Ace shifters which you can put shims into in order to bring the brake levers even close to the bars. I don't know if you can do this with 105 but it is worth asking a shop about this. Or call specailized. they are very helpful.
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
I don't know what it came with 42cm! That seems very odd. I don't think it is normal, but then again I would have to check the specialized website to see what the stock parts are. If this is a very new bike, tell the LBS that it just isn't working for her and ask them to switch it. some places guarantee the fit.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
This is called "Bar Phat", a special padding that specialized puts under the bar tape in order to absorb vibration. Unless she has tiny hands, I'd just leave it there. It may help once she gets used to the slightly thicker wrapping. This stuff costs about $30-40 separately rather than $10-15 for plain tape.
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
The wheels will do well for all-around riding. The only reason to upgrade is if you are going to do heavy-duty miles or racing. My sister doens[t have any complaints about hers and I know a girl who races on them. they aren't the lightest out there by any means, but unless she is going to race or do 100+ miles per week, then she might not tell the difference.
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
PS I told her the Giant Women's bikes were spec'ed better at the same price point, but it went in one ear and out the other, apparently. Didn't even get a look.
1. She has the smallest size - 44 cm - which is exactly what all the fit calculators recommend. But the stem that the bike shop gave her - and that the fit calcs recommend - is only 70mm! Is this normal?
70mm is a short stem. Not the shorest however, that would be a 60 I believe. Generally speaking most frame manufacturers try to kee the stock stem around 80-90mm because if you go too long or too short it affects tha handling. Even though stems go from 60-120mm, most people don't want to be on the extremes. Too short and the bike behaves in a twitchy manner. Too long and the bike will be harder to steer. How tall is this person? I'm 5'3" and my inseam is 29" I think. My sister is 5'2" and has an inseam that is somewhere between 27 and 28. I'd probably want to know what some other measurements are to be more precise. Arm length and torso length also come into play here when selecting frame sizes and components. What did the fit calculators say about stem length and top tube length? anything? If not, I can point you to a site that will calculate this stuff.
For whatever fit calculator you used, on what basis did it give you the 44cm? Was it based on inseam length only and therefore just standover height? I don't have much standover clearance on any frame. On my 48cm Ruby (same geometry as the dolce) I have maybe 1/2". This is much less than the amount that these fitting people say I shoudl have! The onyl way I could get more than 1" of clearance is by going to a 44cm frame, but then allthe other dimensions would be too short. (the reach for example)
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
My bike has special bars on them that bring the shifters close to the bars. That way there is less stuff I have to grab in order to brake. I have the Dura Ace shifters which you can put shims into in order to bring the brake levers even close to the bars. I don't know if you can do this with 105 but it is worth asking a shop about this. Or call specailized. they are very helpful.
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
I don't know what it came with 42cm! That seems very odd. I don't think it is normal, but then again I would have to check the specialized website to see what the stock parts are. If this is a very new bike, tell the LBS that it just isn't working for her and ask them to switch it. some places guarantee the fit.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
This is called "Bar Phat", a special padding that specialized puts under the bar tape in order to absorb vibration. Unless she has tiny hands, I'd just leave it there. It may help once she gets used to the slightly thicker wrapping. This stuff costs about $30-40 separately rather than $10-15 for plain tape.
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
The wheels will do well for all-around riding. The only reason to upgrade is if you are going to do heavy-duty miles or racing. My sister doens[t have any complaints about hers and I know a girl who races on them. they aren't the lightest out there by any means, but unless she is going to race or do 100+ miles per week, then she might not tell the difference.
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
PS I told her the Giant Women's bikes were spec'ed better at the same price point, but it went in one ear and out the other, apparently. Didn't even get a look.
anyway let me know if you need any other info.
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1. She has the smallest size - 44 cm - which is exactly what all the fit calculators recommend. But the stem that the bike shop gave her - and that the fit calcs recommend - is only 70mm! Is this normal?
The website lists the stem length for that size frame as 90mm. I'm guessing the shop that fit her decided she needed a shorter stem. Like snicklefritz said, if it is not so short that the bike handles poorly, it is a good thing if it fits her better than the stock size.
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
The brake levers on my GFs bike are definately short reach. I considered stealing hers as I have short fingers, furthermore, she doesn't go fast enough to need brakes anyway. (just kidding honey )
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
The specs on Specialized's site list the bar size for that frame as 380mm. I think the correct way to measure that is in the "drops" from center to center". That being said, I'm sure my GFs bike are 400mm like the specs list. They seem teeny to me.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
I'm sure it's about the comfort. One of the biggest complaints my GF had was that here hands hurt when she rode her old Schwinn.
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
I think a saddle is such a personal preference thing, that I'm suprised that they aren't an "option" on good bicycles. Having said that, the saddle on her bike is decent and it seems to follow the generic guidelines for womens saddles. i.e. wider sit area, shorter nose, center cutout.
As far as the wheels go, I'm no wheel guru. They seem to roll fine, and we have had no problems with them
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
PS I told her the Giant Women's bikes were spec'ed better at the same price point, but it went in one ear and out the other, apparently. Didn't even get a look.
I was not aware that Giant made "Womens" bikes. Is that new for this year? Seems like last year, all they had were small "mens" bikes. Most women I've talked to do seem to feel that some of the bicycles designed with them in mind do fit better.
The website lists the stem length for that size frame as 90mm. I'm guessing the shop that fit her decided she needed a shorter stem. Like snicklefritz said, if it is not so short that the bike handles poorly, it is a good thing if it fits her better than the stock size.
2. It looks like the brifters are regular 105s instead of the special short-reach ones that are available, and that other brands (Giant, for ex) put on their women-specific design. Is this correct, and is everybody comfortable with them?
The brake levers on my GFs bike are definately short reach. I considered stealing hers as I have short fingers, furthermore, she doesn't go fast enough to need brakes anyway. (just kidding honey )
3. The bike came with 42 cm bars! Hell, I can use those and I'm a 5'11'' male. Is this the norm as well? Seems like the teensiest frame available would come with 38, or 40 at least. The fit calcs recommend 38 for her.
The specs on Specialized's site list the bar size for that frame as 380mm. I think the correct way to measure that is in the "drops" from center to center". That being said, I'm sure my GFs bike are 400mm like the specs list. They seem teeny to me.
4. The bars have this big puffy wrap, or at least puffy stuff undet the wrap. It seems to me that a small person with small hands would want fairly thin handlebar/wrap diameter. Once again, is the the bike spec, or something that the store put on the make it more "comfy" and sell-able?
I'm sure it's about the comfort. One of the biggest complaints my GF had was that here hands hurt when she rode her old Schwinn.
5. Finally, are the seat and wheels decent, or are they calling for immediate upgrade? Alex 295's are the wheels, I think.
I think a saddle is such a personal preference thing, that I'm suprised that they aren't an "option" on good bicycles. Having said that, the saddle on her bike is decent and it seems to follow the generic guidelines for womens saddles. i.e. wider sit area, shorter nose, center cutout.
As far as the wheels go, I'm no wheel guru. They seem to roll fine, and we have had no problems with them
Mostly just curious about the normal bike spec, and what we might be able to insist the store swap out. The store is Hudson Trail Outfitters, by the way, an REI type store. They are supposed to have a 100% guarantee, but it apparently doesn't apply to bikes.
PS I told her the Giant Women's bikes were spec'ed better at the same price point, but it went in one ear and out the other, apparently. Didn't even get a look.
I was not aware that Giant made "Womens" bikes. Is that new for this year? Seems like last year, all they had were small "mens" bikes. Most women I've talked to do seem to feel that some of the bicycles designed with them in mind do fit better.
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Thanks for the input guys. We used wrench science.com, flyte1.com, and coloradocyclist.com for calculators. The colorado one is just inseam, and spit out 48.5 seat tube C-T. The other two are more complex, and both gave exactly the same #'s: 49 cm C-T and 55.75 cm Effective TT + stem. The Dolce's 44cm frame has a "virtual" seatpost C-T of 49.
Does Shimano actually sell shims for brifters? I read an article a while back about making them, but I haven't been able to find it again.
If Giant didn't have women's stuff before, they have jumped in with both feet. Their website really pushes it. But looking at the geometry you are right about the top tubes being longer, and since the top tube already seems long on the Dolce (if the 70mm stem is correct,), then we would really be hurting with a Giant.
Does Shimano actually sell shims for brifters? I read an article a while back about making them, but I haven't been able to find it again.
If Giant didn't have women's stuff before, they have jumped in with both feet. Their website really pushes it. But looking at the geometry you are right about the top tubes being longer, and since the top tube already seems long on the Dolce (if the 70mm stem is correct,), then we would really be hurting with a Giant.
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Last edited by theopowers; 04-21-06 at 08:03 AM.
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Originally Posted by theopowers
Does Shimano actually sell shims for brifters? I read an article a while back about making them, but I haven't been able to find it again.
https://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCEqP...080&spid=14890
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Did that bike come with an extra set of brake levers on the straight part of the handlebars? Specialized's web site says they're included, but an LBS guy I just talked to said they weren't, so I'm a bit confused. I'm gonna accompany my GF to test ride one soone enough, but just thought someone here might could clear that up..
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No extra levers were included on my GF's bike.