adgrant

I am considering buying one of the Cannondale road bikes with the CAAD8 frame. Leaving aside the R5000 they offer four different versions within a $700 or so range.

For $1300 or so I can get the R700 fitted with mostly 105 9sp parts (but Ultegra RD, house brand brakes and 3rd party cogs/crank).

An extra $300 gets an R800 with a full 105 10sp component set (except for Ultegra RD). Seems like a worthwhile upgrade to me.

For another $300 the R1000 gets a full Ultegra 10sp component set (not sure how much better that is than the 105 but the finishes are nicer, particularly the brifters), an upgraded fork (same as R5000) and a different (and I assume better) wheelset (Mavic Ksyrium Equipe instead of Shimano WH-R550).

I rode the R1000 and the R700 back to back and the R1000 felt stiffer and more responsive. This could have been the wheels, the fork or my imagination. One thing I did not imagine was the much better Ultegra brakes vs the house brand cdale brakes on the R700. I am very tempted to just buy the R1000 but I could probably get very close to the same performance by getting the R800 and having the LBS swap out the wheels. I would then have an almost as good bike but would I save much? (guess I should talk to the LBS). The other option would be an R700 with upgraded brakes and wheels. Again, I wonder if this is really worth the trouble when I can get a better bike off the shelf for not much more.

I think it depends on:

How much better are the Mavic wheels compared to the Shimano WH-R550.
How much better is 10sp Ultegra vs 10sp 105.
How much better is 10sp 105 vs 9sp 105.
What about all the extra 105 bits on the R800 vs the R700.

Phantoj

What about the R900 with Campagnolo Veloce?

adgrant

An interesting idea. It does complicate the decision making process a bit because it doesn't quite fit into the neat CAAD8 hierachy. I haven't found one to test ride which given the different components, is something I would need to do. The mavic wheels are nice but the cdale house brand brakes are less thrilling but I could have those swapped out fairly easily.

Phantoj

A co-worker just picked up an R900... it had Gip-something Parade wheels. Maybe last year's model.

Personally, I'd go with the cheapest one that you won't keep thinking, "man, I coulda had the ______".

Or just get the R700.

DocRay

Usually the house-brand brakes can be greatly improved with just better pads. R1000 with Campy would be a rockin' ride.

thatguy

I say it depends on your budget, accounting for the inevitable upgradeitis. Even if you bought the R1000, you're going to want to start upgrading it anyway. Plus there's always new clothing, shoes, helmets, all kinds of other stuff that you're probably coveting too. Pick the one that you could just barely afford, and buy the one below that. After all, the engine will make a much bigger difference than any of these components.

adgrant

You could get close to an R1000 with campy if you upgraded the wheels and brakes. There would still be the fork though.

Pico

Some thoughts:
- The Shimano wheels are junk. Well at least the pair that came on my R700 were junk.
- C'dale brakes are terrible, although better pads would help a lot.
- Ultegra levers are smoother and easier to operate than 105, but 105 still shifts very well.

adgrant

Actually I am trying to avoid buying something I will feel the urge to upgrade as I think that is a more cost effective and simpler approach. lus I just like nice stuff (don't tell the sackcloth and ashes guys in the car free forum ). I will of course need clothes etc but clothes just don't interest me much, I will just buy what fits. Affording the bike isn't really an issue, explaining to my wife how much I just spent on a bike might be. However, she wants me to get off the couch and onto a bike. I could even afford the Dura-Ace model but spending more than 2k on a bike is something I don't want to do plus I can't really tell Dura-Ace from Ultegra at least in the 10sp.

I understand that the engine makes the most difference of course. However, that will take a while to fix. In the meantime, a fast bike will make the journey more fun. The difference between the R700 and R1000 was noticeable to me. The difference in price was too. However the difference in price between an R700 and an R800 doesn't seem like much to me and neither does the difference between the R800 and R1000.
I guess thats how you go from looking at a $1300 bike tolooking at a $1900 bike, $300 at a time.

adgrant

Thanks very much for the info. So I guess I will be looking at either an R800 with new wheels or an R1000. Since the difference in price will be less than $300 (perhaps much less) the R1000 is looking like the way to go.

I didn't realize how bad the C'dale brakes were until I rode the R1000. Though better brake pads would help, I see no reason to economize on brakes.

slacker_express

I have an '06 R1000 and really don't see any need to upgrade. If you think about it, it's pretty much an all-Ultegra bike; although they didn't have the Shimano compact double available when I bought it, so I swapped out the regular double for a FSA SLK compact. Really didn't think of this as an upgrade, but a way to get a compact sooner. I'm not sure that I can see the point of spending the $$ to upgrade from Ultegra to Dura-Ace.

I suppose I could think about upgrading the wheels from Ksyrium Equipes to something better. The '05 had the better Elites. So that may be in the cards some day, but at this point I need to do justice to the bike the way it is.

adgrant

I think your analysis seems spot on. I assume the big advantage of the Elite wheels is weight? I need to look into the whole compact double/double/triple thing. I have noticed that the doubles seem to shift much better than the triples.

R900

I would at least test ride a R900. Our Tandem is full Ultegra and I like the Veloce much better, more crisp and positive, the Ultegra is smooth, but I wish more tandems had a Campy option. I didn't think the brakes were that bad on my R900, although I did replace the C-dale brakes with some Chorus. About the only change I might make now is wheels. The stock set are fine, but I get itchy for a lighter set when I read the forums too much. If you really must have a Shimano bike I would get the R1000.

John

krazyderek

I'd go for the r1000, but not for 1900$ that seems way to high to me. I paid 1500$ for my 05' r1000 with elite wheels and full ultegra 10spd. If the 06' bike comes with equipe wheels, try and hassle a bit on the price get it down to something a bit more reasonable like 1600-1700$ or get them to throw in some decent pedals like the ultegra SPDSL pedals to match the rest of the ultegra on the bike. Then if you're still tempted to upgrade, ask how much to drop the wheels, hopefully something like 300$ then just pick up a set of mavic ES/SL from probike kit for 800/700$, or upgrade at the shop if they have a decent price.

My opinion is get the r1000 or don't get anything at all. Same thing with upgrading, get the best (mavic ES, or SL) or don't upgrade at all, stick with the equipe wheels and reward yourself with a new race wheel start of next season when the ES go on sale this winter.

adgrant

I would love to test ride the R900 but I haven't found anyone with it in stock. I will check a few more stores though. However I do like the Ultegra brifters. They are nice and large and I also like having the brake lever shift.

The brakes on a stock R900 are supposed to better than the brakes on a R700 but I thought the R700 brakes were pretty bad after I rode the R1000. If I bought the R900 I would probably do as you have and upgrade the brakes but not the wheels.

adgrant

Actually 1900 was the cheap store. The other one in the neighborhood wanted $2000. $1550 gets you an R800 and the R900 is a bit more.

corny

R1000 if you can justify it! If not so, change the brake pads no need to change the levers as well.

adgrant

Actually I would be changing the calipers, not the levers. Some online research indicates that a set of 105 calipers costs around $100 (probably more at the LBS) and the Ultegras are a bit more. Brakes aren't something I would want to cheap out on. Probably not worth upgrading the 700 though. It would be better to spend another $200 or so and get the full 105 10sp R800.

corny

Sorry I meant calipers, i was writing in a bit of a whizz! Honestly the cdale ones are fine, they are tektros I believe and are darn good with DA or Koolstop pads.

C-R700

I have an 05 R-700. Specs are basically the same as 06. I wish I would have went with an R-1000, budget couldn't pull the trigger. I don't have a problem with the wheels, maybe a bit heavy, fine for me. The pads do suck.

adgrant

You are correct, they are indeed tektros or at least the Omegas on the R900 are. Harris Cyclery is selling them for $20 or so. I guess the Thetas on the R700 must be worth at least $10 a pair. Clearly if I get an R700 or R900 I will at least be changing the pads. However, given that the "Kool Stop" pads are about $50 for two pairs, I am not sure why I wouldn't just go ahead and switch out the calipers too. I just don't understand why I would want to save a few bucks on my brakes (clearly the bike marketing people don't agree). Web opinion on the Thetas seems to be divided between switch the pads and just trash the brakes completely.

adgrant

Did you switch out the pads? My concern with buying the R700 (which seems like a great bike for the money) is I will wish I had bought the R1000 (which also seems like a great bike for the money).

adgrant

BTW does anyone have an opinion about the forks on the R1000 (and R5000) vs the fork on the other CAAD8 bikes. I am not reallty sure if the ride differences between the R700 and R1000 were due to the better wheels or fork.

DaveSANYYZ

I can't feel a difference after a 10mins ride of the two handling-wise.

I test drove the 05 and 06 R700/800/1000, and the only difference I felt is that the '06 R800 and R1000 shift much smoother; but can't tell much difference between the '06 R800 (105) and '06 R1000 (ultegra).

I settled for an '06 R1000 compact at the end because some mentioned it has stronger wheels; plus I got it on sale.

adgrant

Interesting. I definitely felt a difference handling wise between the R700 and the R1000. The 1000 felt stiffer. I assume much of that was due to the better wheels. One option would be to buy an R800 and have the wheels switched. I doub't that would save much over just getting the R1000 though.