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Douglas Titanium - Buyer's remorse

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Douglas Titanium - Buyer's remorse

Old 09-05-06, 10:45 AM
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Douglas Titanium - Buyer's remorse

I cashed in all my husband points a few months ago and bought a Douglas Precision Ti frame with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork. I had tried other titanium bikes before and liked the ride, but this thing is about to beat me to death.

If I were a criterium racer I would be thrilled with it. I've never ridden a bike that could carve a corner or respond in a sprint like this one, but I am a middled aged guy who averages about 15 miles per hour and I need a little more plushness in my ride. I wish I had bought a steel frame now.
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Old 09-05-06, 10:57 AM
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Try raising the handlebars and installing some wider tires (with lower air pressure). I think riding position affects "plushness" a lot more than frame material.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:01 AM
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So the titanium frame is too harsh? I was under the impression that part of the draw for titanium was that it gave a steel-like ride, at a lower weight.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by gurana
So the titanium frame is too harsh? I was under the impression that part of the draw for titanium was that it gave a steel-like ride, at a lower weight.
that's not what I've heard, I've also heard that titanium gives a ride feel similar to aluminum, very harsh.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by gurana
So the titanium frame is too harsh? I was under the impression that part of the draw for titanium was that it gave a steel-like ride, at a lower weight.
That's what I had always heard, too.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:13 AM
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A frame is only one component that determines a bikes "feel" or "ride". I think the biggest influence is the wheels. What kind of wheels do you have on your Douglas? Tire size? PSI? All play a factor.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Olebiker
That's what I had always heard, too.
And it's usually true. But like with any material, the way it's built has as much to do with the ride as the material. It might have big, stiff, oversized tubes that are making the ride too stiff for your liking.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Olebiker
That's what I had always heard, too.

that is actually true. try a good titanium bike like a serotta or independent and you'll notice.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:17 AM
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Strip the parts including the fork, sell the frame and buy a steelie.

I might have an extra one laying around - what size you need?

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Old 09-05-06, 11:25 AM
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My 11 year old Ibis Ti is VERY comfy, like a giant, tight spring. My buddy's 2 year old Litespeed Ghisallo (a compact Ti frame) rode like a steel pole. Brutal.

Generally Ti frames are very comfortable and resliliant. But there are so many factors that may be influencing the ride here - impossible to diagnose over the Internet. It is hardly surprising that a Douglas Precision leans towards the racing/performance side of the equation. And much of this is subjective. Maybe I'd find that Douglas frame very forgiving. Too many variables here.

Bottom line: if you're that unhappy with the bike, start test riding new ones. But TEST RIDE them at your LBS. One of the inherent pitfalls of mail order bike shopping, and you fell into it. Oh well.

I have yet to ride a good steel frame that was QUITE as comfortable as a good Ti frame. Close, but half a cigar, at least the ones I've ridden. My Jamis Dragon MTB is Reynolds 853 steel, and I ride that on the road quite a bit in winter. Great bike as well. A good Ti frame is pretty close to an ideal long distance road frame (like my Ibis). You can ride it all day long and they are like BUTTAH.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by DRLski
that's not what I've heard, I've also heard that titanium gives a ride feel similar to aluminum, very harsh.
These are myths. Frame stiffness depends more on frame geometry and tubing thickness/diameter than it does on frame material. As you go up the price ladder, frame builders are more careful to tune the ride characteristics of the frame. Low end frames are often over built to reduce manufacturing costs.

Of course, tires, wheels, fitness level, and riding position will also have a big impact on riding comfort.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:40 AM
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I ride a Ti Litespeed Ultimate and a KHS Reynolds 853 steelie. I have Mavic Ksyrium SLs on both the bikes. They ride quite comparably. HOWEVER, I had a set of Shimano wheels on the KHS before I put on the Mavics. The ride between these two different sets of wheels was like the difference between a ride in an Army jeep to a Lincoln town car. My suggestion to you is try some different wheels before you write it off. Both my bikes are very sweet rides for an old guy like me and I attribute it to the wheels, not the frame. I do believe that, all other things being equal, Ti and Reynolds give very comparable rides. This is of course just another person's opinion. Good Luck
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Old 09-05-06, 11:43 AM
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Which Douglas? In general Ti tends to result in a bike with a softer ride, both because of the nature of the material, and most of the market is looking for a relatively cushy ride in a Ti frame. Of course how it's built matters. there's a big difference between a Ghisallo and a Vortex for example, in the Litespeed line.

Also lots of things other than the frame matter. Air pressure as noted is the easiest thing to change. The type of wheels mkes a big diffrence too. Deep dish rims are going to ride harsher than box shaped rims, and clinchers are going to be harsher than tubulars. If you want a softer ride put on a set of tubular wheels built with a box shaped rim.

Or just sell the frame, and buy a Merlin.
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Old 09-05-06, 11:54 AM
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I recently transferred most components, including the wheels, from my 1993 Litespeed Classic onto my new 2005 Litespeed Firenza frame. The Firenza feels much more solid, but not harsh. The Classic truely had a 'steel frame' feel to it but OTOH I love the way the Firenza feels too.......I believe the Douglas is very similar to the Firenza, in tubing and geometry, if I'm not mistaken.
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Old 09-05-06, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by cydewaze
But like with any material, the way it's built has as much to do with the ride as the material. It might have big, stiff, oversized tubes that are making the ride too stiff for your liking.
+1
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Old 09-05-06, 12:09 PM
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Olebiker...what wheels do you have?

Wheels are going to make a bigger difference over a frame any day.

titanium is definitely springier than steel and should give a plush ride.
 
Old 09-05-06, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
Or just sell the frame, and buy a Merlin.
+1

tongue-in-cheek:

(but then, i'm biased - my Fortius rides like steel, weighs like carbon)

p.s. to the OP: i'm sure if you posted the size of your Ti ride's frame you'd have *no* trouble selling it!
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Old 09-05-06, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Olebiker
I cashed in all my husband points a few months ago and bought a Douglas Precision Ti frame with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork. I had tried other titanium bikes before and liked the ride, but this thing is about to beat me to death.

If I were a criterium racer I would be thrilled with it. I've never ridden a bike that could carve a corner or respond in a sprint like this one, but I am a middled aged guy who averages about 15 miles per hour and I need a little more plushness in my ride. I wish I had bought a steel frame now.
I race criteriums on that fork, and I'm thrilled with it.
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Old 09-05-06, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by linux_author- your bike sounds like a great ride... i'm sure you can make it more comfortable... try some cheap 700x25s (i use the Nashbar Prima 2 or Plus)... i.e.:

[url
http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=121&subcategory=1254&brand=&sku=2454&storetype=&estoreid=&pagename=Shop%20by%20 Subcat:%20700x18c%20to%20700x28c[/url]
That's probably the first thing I am going to do. I might even go to 28 if they will fit. I'm even considering pulling out that Brooks B-17 and raising the bars. I would hate to not be comfortable on this bike. It was a heck of a good deal and is drop dead gorgeous.
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Old 09-05-06, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Doid23
A frame is only one component that determines a bikes "feel" or "ride". I think the biggest influence is the wheels. What kind of wheels do you have on your Douglas? Tire size? PSI? All play a factor.
The wheels are 32 spoke Campy record with Open Pro rims. The tires are 23s at 110 psi. I weigh in at about 220.

The frame is a 55 and has oversize, shaped tubing which probably accounts for the harsh ride more than the choice of material.
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Old 09-05-06, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Olebiker
The wheels are 32 spoke Campy record with Open Pro rims. The tires are 23s at 110 psi. I weigh in at about 220.

The frame is a 55 and has oversize, shaped tubing which probably accounts for the harsh ride more than the choice of material.
Well there goes the "it must be the wheels" answer.
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Old 09-05-06, 01:02 PM
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mavic open pros are excellent wheels so I doubt that would contribute to the harshness, so I would believe it has something to do with the tubing and shaping
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Old 09-05-06, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by HAMMER MAN
mavic open pros are excellent wheels so I doubt that would contribute to the harshness, so I would believe it has something to do with the tubing and shaping
Or the tires or the wheelbase or the riding position.
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Old 09-05-06, 01:15 PM
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tire pressure

much more so than anything else
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Old 09-05-06, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by redfooj
tire pressure

much more so than anything else
If you can't pump those bad boys up to 120+ psi and still enjoy the ride, bag it.
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