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Sore legs..

Old 03-01-07, 09:14 AM
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Sore legs..

I figured that after a few years of riding 200 to 250 miles a week.....everyweek that I would get to the point where my legs would get used to riding this amount and would not be sore after a few days in a row of riding. I am plenty strong but the quad ache just never seems to go away. Am I alone in this or this a pretty normal deal?
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Old 03-01-07, 09:19 AM
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Endurox is your friend. One glass after every ride. That, and lots of stretching.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:20 AM
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I used to use a rolling pin to "strip" my legs (force circulation and flush lactic acid out). it helps alleviate soreness a hell of a lot.

you can use your fingers too, press down at your ankles like you're playing the piano with rusted keys, and pull up towards your heart. always towards your heart. and do it before you sleep or at least before you don't plan on getting up for a while. recovery massage is the true reason cyclists shave their legs.

this season I'm getting the stick which is meant for this purpose.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by DrPete
Endurox is your friend. One glass after every ride. That, and lots of stretching.
I do chug a big glass of chocolate milk after a ride but I will try the Endurox and see if it helps. Stretching......good call. I never stretch but I know I should.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by DrPete
Endurox is your friend. One glass after every ride. That, and lots of stretching.
oh yeah recovery drinks too, 15 minutes after each ride. supposedly, after 15 minutes your body will direct whatever nutrients you ingest towards other things besides recovery. is that true doc?

also, is chocolate soy just as good as chocolate milk? I can't drink milk, I'm lactose. I hate it.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by steaktaco
oh yeah recovery drinks too, 15 minutes after each ride. supposedly, after 15 minutes your body will direct whatever nutrients you ingest towards other things besides recovery. is that true doc?

also, is chocolate soy just as good as chocolate milk? I can't drink milk, I'm lactose. I hate it.
So the reading I've done on recovery drinks comes mainly from CTS and some sources at trainingpeaks, not from any medical education, so take that for what it's worth. The physiology/science used is reasonable, though, and seems to have a good foundation. The concensus is that they really work, especially if taken within 60 minutes of finishing a workout. That's when the body is looking to replace lost glycogen, etc. So you have more than 15 minutes. The 4:1 carb to protein ratio seems to have some strong backing too.

Chocolate milk is OK, but endurox does have some other stuff (antioxidants, glutamine, etc.) that seem to help too. If I'm far from home and forget my endurox it's off to 7-11 for a CM.

I have no idea about the soy, but I know endurox is non-dairy...
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Old 03-01-07, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by steaktaco
I used to use a rolling pin to "strip" my legs (force circulation and flush lactic acid out). it helps alleviate soreness a hell of a lot.
I have a tool like this as well that I got at the chiropractor's office and it works wonder for me to get the circulation going.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:32 AM
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And massage ... after a tough day, and especially before an important ride, I would massage. One or many ways, is to lie on your back, with legs up against the wall, massaging from the ankles down the calves & thighes ... using gravity to help flush out the lactic burn. That's when I appreciated having shaved legs because I'm a little on the hairy side.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:34 AM
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Endurox rules. Gotta stretch though, and try elevating your legs for 20-30 minutes after you shower and are relaxing. I would lay on my floor, prop my feet up against my dresser at around a 45 degree angle, and watch TV.

BTW, do you throw in a regeneration/easy week every 3 weeks or so in the mix to give yourself time to recover?
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Old 03-01-07, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by GuitarWizard
BTW, do you throw in a regeneration/easy week every 3 weeks or so in the mix to give yourself time to recover?
the cycle recommended by my coach was training week, training week, training week, race week, rest week~5 week cycle. but at my level it didn't really matter, so I just rode as much as I wanted until, all of a sudden, I'm so sloOoOow and my legs are like logs then I know it's time for a rest week.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:42 AM
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Some people respond well to different programs....but 3 weeks is a good average.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:44 AM
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For me, after a long "bonking" type of ride, I like pasta. I fix it often, and I keep some cold in the fridge, and eat a cup while downloading my ride data. Eat another cup after my shower. I'm cheap that way.

For shorter rides, I have a Coke or an ice-cold beer. With a water chaser, natch.

Do you ride every day, Gary? Just curious.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by GuitarWizard
BTW, do you throw in a regeneration/easy week every 3 weeks or so in the mix to give yourself time to recover?
I try....I really try I am too obsessed with the thought that I have to ride my hardest everytime out. I will leave the house with the mindset that I am going to spin easy and keep my HR low but sure enough as soon as I get warmed up I start pounding. I need to mature up a bit in that respect and force myself to do some recovery days and weeks.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:45 AM
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Stretching and salmon oil. The salmon oil has natural anti-inflammatory properties.
http://www.hammernutrition.com/za/HN...T&PROD.ID=5112
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Old 03-01-07, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by garysol1
I try....I really try I am too obsessed with the thought that I have to ride my hardest everytime out. I will leave the house with the mindset that I am going to spin easy and keep my HR low but sure enough as soon as I get warmed up I start pounding. I need to mature up a bit in that respect and force myself to do some recovery days and weeks.
it's best to do the easy rides while chatting someone, and take out big ring just in case.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by VegaVixen

Do you ride every day, Gary? Just curious.
Typically 5 to 6 days with 35 to 50 miles per ride. Frequently my off days are spent on the mountain bike though. It is a real obsession for me. If I don't get a ride in on a particular day my mood sucks. I feel like I let myself down.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by clausen
Stretching and salmon oil. The salmon oil has natural anti-inflammatory properties.
http://www.hammernutrition.com/za/HN...T&PROD.ID=5112
ever hear of mustard bath??
a long time ago, my crazy english neighbor who is an athlete saw me limping in pain and told me to get into a mustard bath, I would of tried anything.
I should of known better then to take advice from someone who gets a little tipsy at 10 in the morning
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Old 03-01-07, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by blonduathlongrl
ever hear of mustard bath??
a long time ago, my crazy english neighbor who is an athlete saw me limping in pain and told me to get into a mustard bath, I would of tried anything.
I should of known better then to take advice from someone who gets a little tipsy at 10 in the morning
salmon, mustard—I just got hungry.
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Old 03-01-07, 10:20 AM
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glutamine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glutamine
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Old 03-01-07, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by garysol1
I try....I really try I am too obsessed with the thought that I have to ride my hardest everytime out. I will leave the house with the mindset that I am going to spin easy and keep my HR low but sure enough as soon as I get warmed up I start pounding. I need to mature up a bit in that respect and force myself to do some recovery days and weeks.
Yep....as you prolong the hammering with no real recovery time, you'll stagnate and not improve..or in some cases, go backwards. Then you'll get depressed and the willingness to ride soon becomes replaced with "I HAVE to ride".

I used to subscribe to the "go hard all the time" camp, and it seemed to work ok for 6-8 months or so, but then the legs would become progressively more and more tired, and I was just digging myself into a hole. This year has been different; I took a methodical base-building approach, and am building up my fitness gradually. Yesterday was my first time doing a LT workout in months, as a matter of fact....as I am now into the "build" period. Even though my "top end" isn't quite there right now since I didn't do any type of real intensity over the winter, I was pretty strong during the workout. I would venture to say just as strong as I ever was before, and this was just the first workout of this phase. I can't wait to see how things stand in another couple months.

It's definitely not easy to train yourself to cut down on the intensity - it took me a solid week of reallllly chomping at the bit to hold back during last fall when I started up base miles. But....then you get to concentrate more on what you miss when you have your head down and hammering, so it's not so bad. Kind of enjoyable, actually.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:45 AM
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I'm not naturally flexible and so I would agree with what's mentioned previously, stretch tons. I stretch any time I'm in front of the tv and before I go to bed. And rest is not overrated!

One other thing that hasn't been mentioned yet: I'm sure you've been fitted, but something to consider is how your fit may have evolved due to your higher mileage these days. For me, moving my saddle back helped me get down lower on the bike, but it also took some of the emphasis off my quads and shifted it to my glutes and hamstrings. If your quads are truly dead all of the time (granted this is very subjective) you might have people check out your fit, or experiment yourself with fore-aft.

Good pedal technique also goes a long way I think. Regardless of where you are on the saddle, you can decide to emphasize different leg muscles during the pedalstroke.

I don't think you can ever eliminate quad soreness, but there are ways to mitigate it during rides, and strengthen the surrounding muscles as well. ymmv!
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Old 03-01-07, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by garysol1
I figured that after a few years of riding 200 to 250 miles a week.....everyweek that I would get to the point where my legs would get used to riding this amount and would not be sore after a few days in a row of riding. I am plenty strong but the quad ache just never seems to go away. Am I alone in this or this a pretty normal deal?
It depends. Are you using the same intensity as always, or have you backed the intensity off yet kept the same miles? If your intensity is the same then of course you'll still get sore. If you back off the intensity, you'll stop getting sore legs.

But if you do get sore legs, the best remedy is 20 min of EASY spinning. (Note the "easy" in that statement, anything above that won't help)
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Old 03-01-07, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by garysol1
I do chug a big glass of chocolate milk after a ride but I will try the Endurox and see if it helps. Stretching......good call. I never stretch but I know I should.
Stretching will help if you do it right after the workout and don't push it hard. If you wait till the next day to do it, it'll make them more sore.
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Old 03-01-07, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by DrPete
Endurox is your friend.
What do you mean by Endurox? Isn't Endurox just the name of the company that makes many products? Are you talking about:

"Endurox® R4® Recovery Drink was developed by leading exercise physiologists and based on landmark research redefining how the exercising muscle recovers. Endurox R4 contains the patented 4 to1 ratio of carbohydrate to protein to speed muscle glycogen replenishment and rebuild muscle protein after exercise, antioxidants to reduce post-exercise muscle damage and glutamine to help reduce muscle stress."

Or so the website says.
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Old 03-01-07, 01:02 PM
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+1 on the endurox.

and for me, the foam roller is magic
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