scandium alloy - the perfect frame?
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scandium alloy - the perfect frame?
"Dedacciai SC61.10A Frame (Horizontal Top Tube)
Raw frame weight (average size) 1050g.
Scandium alloy.
Considered by most prestigious manufacturers and pro riders as the perfect combination of strength, weight and rigidity"
https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/detail...e=RIBBFRAR0600
don't know much about scandium - sounds like a great material to me, any views? good price too... ($498US)
PS whoops, just found a thread on scandium, apologies! oh well...
Raw frame weight (average size) 1050g.
Scandium alloy.
Considered by most prestigious manufacturers and pro riders as the perfect combination of strength, weight and rigidity"
https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/detail...e=RIBBFRAR0600
don't know much about scandium - sounds like a great material to me, any views? good price too... ($498US)
PS whoops, just found a thread on scandium, apologies! oh well...
#2
Aluminium Crusader :-)
I'm not sure what 'raw frame weight' means; I assume unpainted, or even the unpainted and unwelded tube-set.
I had a Ciocc Challenger made out of the same stuff, but with a Deda carbon wishbone seat-stay, and very thin paint & stickers which was 1214g (frame only, size 57cm). So, I'd be very surprised if it was 1050g.
Also, claims of a 1050g frame being stiff is hard to totally believe, unless it was a tiny size. My aluminium Cervelo Soloist is made of decent stuff, is on the stiff side, and is 1440g (58cm), so, even though the claims of scandium are bold, ya can't just rip 400g of an aluminium tube-set and not expect to lose 'something'
I had a Ciocc Challenger made out of the same stuff, but with a Deda carbon wishbone seat-stay, and very thin paint & stickers which was 1214g (frame only, size 57cm). So, I'd be very surprised if it was 1050g.
Also, claims of a 1050g frame being stiff is hard to totally believe, unless it was a tiny size. My aluminium Cervelo Soloist is made of decent stuff, is on the stiff side, and is 1440g (58cm), so, even though the claims of scandium are bold, ya can't just rip 400g of an aluminium tube-set and not expect to lose 'something'
Last edited by 531Aussie; 09-10-07 at 09:36 AM.
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SC61.10 is not a scandium tubeset - one of the great misinformations that seems to pop up in frames for sale descriptions from time to time. Deda's scandium tubeset is called U2.
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See here for scandium:
https://doc.tms.org/ezMerchant/prodtms.nsf/ProductLookupItemID/JOM-0302-35/$FILE/JOM-0302-35F.pdf?OpenElement
"Scandium" is really scandium reinforced aluminum. some companies "scandium" is identical in alloy composition to others "aluminum", and almost all good aluminum alloys have scandium in them.
Here's Easton's blurb, but there is a lot of Bs in this:
https://www.eastonbike.com/downloadab...20Scandium.pdf
https://doc.tms.org/ezMerchant/prodtms.nsf/ProductLookupItemID/JOM-0302-35/$FILE/JOM-0302-35F.pdf?OpenElement
"Scandium" is really scandium reinforced aluminum. some companies "scandium" is identical in alloy composition to others "aluminum", and almost all good aluminum alloys have scandium in them.
Here's Easton's blurb, but there is a lot of Bs in this:
https://www.eastonbike.com/downloadab...20Scandium.pdf
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DocRay is right...."scandium" frames are aluminum alloy frames. ("Not that there's anything wrong with that"). I ride a Merckx Team SC which uses the Easton Scandium tubeset....it's a great frame, but I don't find the ride magnitudes different from my 7000 series frame. The bit in the Easton doc DocRay provides a link to regarding Scandium improving weldability I'd believe...the welds on the Team SC are as smooth as any I've ever seen on a steel frame.
OP, I'm gonna say that I'd think twice about buying a frame from a manufacturer that is claiming to use a scandium alloy when they aren't...looking at the enlarged version of the picture the welds don't even look as smooth as those on my 7000 series Klein. If they're bull****ting you on this....who knows?
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The material used has nothing to do with the resulting quality of a frame or fork. Really good (and really bad) frames and forks continue to be made from every sort of material.
The recipe for an outstanding frame and fork is simple: design, engineering, quality control, testing, re-design, re-engineering...expensive steps that require highly skilled, well-compensated folks.
But, today, the bike market is driven by "low price", so we continue to see a flood of poorly designed and poorly built bikes...using every sort of material to obtain poor results.
The recipe for an outstanding frame and fork is simple: design, engineering, quality control, testing, re-design, re-engineering...expensive steps that require highly skilled, well-compensated folks.
But, today, the bike market is driven by "low price", so we continue to see a flood of poorly designed and poorly built bikes...using every sort of material to obtain poor results.
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Weld appearance doesn't tell you much. Those tight, small welds without use of filler rod are aesthetically pleasing, but not as strong as with the use of filler.
More scandium tech:
https://www.home.no/al-sc/papers/Scan...%20Reviews.pdf
https://www.home.no/al-sc/
Scandium is the current BS hype word of marketers. It's been in use since 1971.
In golf clubs, it's " an advanced metal alloy that is much lighter and stronger than titanium. " LOL.
https://www.pga.com/equipment/equipme...ment102405.cfm
Just goes to show, marketers just pick out any buzzwords and then make stuff up.
More scandium tech:
https://www.home.no/al-sc/papers/Scan...%20Reviews.pdf
https://www.home.no/al-sc/
Scandium is the current BS hype word of marketers. It's been in use since 1971.
In golf clubs, it's " an advanced metal alloy that is much lighter and stronger than titanium. " LOL.
https://www.pga.com/equipment/equipme...ment102405.cfm
Just goes to show, marketers just pick out any buzzwords and then make stuff up.
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The Competitive link doesn't work.
If you continue to search you will find additional retail outlets that get it wrong.
If you're bored, there was a letter in the Tech section of Cyclingnews.com from an Australian builder who explains this confusion. You can find it in a search of that section. If you're doubly bored, you can read the Deda material data sheets which explain that there is no Scandium in SC61.10. Deda
Choose: Products-Aluminum-Drawing
From their website "7003 alloy (Al-Zn-Mg)" No Scandium. U2 is their Scandium tubeset "7XXX alloy with the addition of rare earths." Even though Scandium is not a rare earth, it's the cute little Italian way of protecting their IP>
This happens all the time - the sellers think that "SC" means Scandium in the tubeset designation, and it doesn't. Started right after the release of the original Pinarello Prince (which was SC61.10) and has continued ever since.
If you continue to search you will find additional retail outlets that get it wrong.
If you're bored, there was a letter in the Tech section of Cyclingnews.com from an Australian builder who explains this confusion. You can find it in a search of that section. If you're doubly bored, you can read the Deda material data sheets which explain that there is no Scandium in SC61.10. Deda
Choose: Products-Aluminum-Drawing
From their website "7003 alloy (Al-Zn-Mg)" No Scandium. U2 is their Scandium tubeset "7XXX alloy with the addition of rare earths." Even though Scandium is not a rare earth, it's the cute little Italian way of protecting their IP>
This happens all the time - the sellers think that "SC" means Scandium in the tubeset designation, and it doesn't. Started right after the release of the original Pinarello Prince (which was SC61.10) and has continued ever since.
Last edited by terry b; 09-10-07 at 01:24 PM.