ExPhys

I am interested in picking up a powertap, but need some advice on the wheel set. I will use the wheels for both training and racing and would like to budget around $800 for the wheels (not including the powertap rear hub).
I live in Utah so the terrain varies widely (lots of mountains, so weight is somewhat of an issue), also I weigh in around 140lbs.
What are your recommendations???

Jacobi

I think it was Hammertoe that bought one from Edina Bike. Check out there website and you'll see they have them ranging from $900-1500.

-Barry-

ElJamoquio

Let's assume you plan on spending $900 for the hub.


$1700 will get you pretty much anything, including Zipp, from eBay. Personally I don't see much of a reason to go beyond the 420 AC's or the Niobium 29's or whatever they are.

CEE

check out www.wheelbuilder.com

waterrockets 

What are you racing and training on now? Do you like those? We can help pick a similar loose rim based on that information.

At your weight, there's no reason for you to go as high as 32h, other than the wide availability of used inventory. I'd say that even with a lighter rim, like an Aerohead or Zipp303 (possibly comparable in strength -- not making weight claims!), you could still run 24h/28h, end up with a durable wheelset, and save a couple grams.

I'm riding a 32h Aerohead OC, and it's 110g lighter than the DeepV non-PT wheel I was running before. Of course, at 178 lbs, I know it's not going to be a 5-year wheel like the last one (probably ~2 years for me).

merlinextraligh

My powertap is built up with a 404 clincher. I went with a clincher because I use it to train on as well as race.

damocles1

PT SL
IRD Cadence Aero rim (same as Nio30)
Sapim CxRay spokes
Brass nipples

Bulletproof...

vic32amg

I recently sold my powertap on a 2007 404 tubular. I do not recommend a deep section wheel for training. Also I do not recommend a deep section wheel that is clincher ( 404 specific) the weight is ridiculous. I do recommend a dt swiss or even mavic open pro as great wheel. also they can be made light using other rims and going tubular as well. The PT hub is not light and even when built up correctly it's still not that light. Also I have notice that my carbon wheels tend to go out of true more often than my non carbon wheels. When dealing with a PT which can involve some complex/ sensitive parts , I would recommend getting a wheel that is not so sensitive.

ExPhys

I was thinking something along the lines of the (as was suggested by damocles1):

IRD Cadence Aero rim (same as Nio30)
Sapim CxRay spokes
Brass nipples

What would you say your wheelset weighs?

Currently I have a pair of Mavic ES end Elites. Thanks for the replies.

merlinextraligh

My PT/Zipp 404 wheel hasn't been "sensitive" at all. 3 seasons with no issues, in spite of the fact I'm pushing it wieght wise for the non clydesdale version.

As for Zipp 404 clinchers being ridiculously heavy, they weigh 1600 grams, which is admittedly subtantially heavier than CF tubular wheels, but its comparable weight to a number of wheels that are much less aero (e.g. Mavic Kyseriums), and not as stiff.

vic32amg

^ please post where your clinchers with power tap are less than 1700 grams. I am sure that is not the case.

JBS103

What's so absolutely wrong with a little weight, especially when you are training?

vic32amg

......

JBS103

That really doesn't answer the question, but okay. I'll keep quiet.

I understand the driving force behind making everything as light as possible and have no intentions of starting a weight debate as it's redundant. I just don't see the point of writing options off for a few hundred grams.

damocles1

My PT SL weighs 420grams
The rim weighed 450grams
Sapim CXRay X 32spokes weighed 139grams
Nipples weighed 30grams

That's 1039grams for a 32 hole PT SL wheel that is strong, stiff and relatively aero. I have a custom rear wheel with a White Industries H1 hub, IRD Cadence rim, CXRays and alu nipples. It weighs 775 grams. I really can't tell the difference when riding...

merlinextraligh

You're right the Pt hub adds weight. However the PT hub adds the same weight if you bulid it up with an Open Pro rim, or any other rim. The point is that a Zipp 404 clincher rim and 24 spokes is abouthe same weight as the rim and spokes of wheels that people consider to be an acceptable weight, such as Kyseriums, and the 404 wheel is going to be a lot more aero, so the argument that it's "ridiculously heavy" is a bit over the top.

vic32amg

OK here are the reason why it makes sense to stay away from a heavy training / racing wheel

first the OP is 140 lbs which means that the power/weight ratio plays an even bigger role.

Also if the OP is looking into training/racing with power then they are looking for any advantage they can get for the money.

If they are training in the mountains then a lighter wheel will certainly help more than an aero wheel.

also I believe they stated they plan on possibly racing with a PM then the lighter wheel would make more sense unless the are constantly breaking away solo.

Also on the OP's budget I find building the deep section wheel will cost him considerably more.

I think it makes sense if TTing is a big part of your racing or training. but when you are usually in the pack (which most of us are) and a mountain goat (which @ 140 lbs it sounds like he/she is) then a light shallow wheel would probably provide more benefit.

If the Op was 220 pounds and training on the flats and had 2000$ to put together a wheel then I would
suggest perhaps something a wee bit deeper.

Sure light wheels don't mean they will be better but when you consider that the OP is very light and probably doesn't put out the wattages of someone heavier then yeah, I think it makes sense. anything to help power/weight ratio.

and also @ 140 the op can ride a really light wheel set and is not hindered by weight the way say a 175 lbs cyclist would.

more than likely I have no idea what I am talking about.

vic32amg

I guess the statement that " the clincher 404 is heavy" is over stated when compared to elites etc.. but I had the 404 clincher and went to the Tubular and the difference in very noticeable. I think depending on how you like the feel of the road and dealing with flats can make the decision as of which wheel fits a particular cyclist, but the tubular is certainly lighter on the pedals.

also to say a " few hundred grams" are not significant I beg to differ. If those grams are located on the frame then perhaps not so much, but on wheels it does make a difference. if you are trying to be a serious cyclist that is. for the recreational 10 miles a week guy then perhaps it will not matter.

However:

a PT on a 404 clincher is not a bad thing I am simply suggesting that a tubular version is lighter with the same aero benefits. but the OP can build a even lighter wheel, with aero benefits on the budget they have.

ExPhys

Ok here a little more clarification.

Salt Lake has a wide variety of terrain (5 canyons w/ up to 10% grade within 10 miles of my house, long flat stretches near the Great Salt Lake where the TTs are usually held, and most of the road races combine significant climbs, flats, and descents). My FTP is right now is around 4.6w/kg, but even at 62kg, by nature I am a sprinter (>20W/kg <3s).

Based on the above conversation I am leaning towards one or the other types of rims
1. Open pro or DT Swiss 1.1
2. Nio 30 or DT Swiss 1.2

Again this will play into the aero vs. weight discussion.

Many thanks for the responses.

waterrockets 

On the rear, between those rims, the aerodynamics are irrelevant.

In the Open Pro / DT Swiss 1.1 line, you should seriously consider the Aerohead OC. It will build a stronger wheel than the OP or 1.1, and lighter.

The asymmetric spokeline helps the NDS/DS tension a lot. On my Open Pro wheelsets, the NDS tension is only ~55% of the DS. On my Aerohead OC/PowerTap, the difference is only 22%. That's a much better load distribution for the wheel.

Also, my wheel weighs 1077g: Aerohead OC, PT SL, 32h, Wheelsmith 2.0/1.7/2.0 spokes with brass nipples. You can save some significant weight on spoke count, spoke type, and AL nipples.

damocles1

I wouldn't build with an OP. I destroyed the OP my PT was built on in 3000 miles. I just don't think that OP hoops have the same quality that they used to...

Zipp clincher rims are HEAVY. A 417 (303 rim) weighs 543. A 505 (404 rim) weighs 606!!!
Zipp tubs...the 285 (303 tub rim) weighs 300. The 360 (404 tub rim) weighs 392.

Best of both worlds is to get a 24 hole Nio30 hoop, build it with CXRay spokes and be done with it. It's way more cost effective, and will take more abuse.

We're talking about rotational weight here too. The hub turns, but has little inertia as it sits in the middle. The 404 clincher hoop might be fine for racing at 25+ mph, but for training, it's a trailer sitting behind you. Hit a 5 or 6 km climb and you'll know that Zipp is back there. 150+ grams and almost 8x the $ for a Zipp clincher hoop just isn't worth it.