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Critical Mass Bicyclist Assaulted by NYPD (VIDEO)

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Critical Mass Bicyclist Assaulted by NYPD (VIDEO)

Old 07-29-08, 04:46 PM
  #301  
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Originally Posted by Spartan112 View Post
Worcester has cleaned up a bit over the years, but back in the late 80's early 90's there was a street where the city posted a sign that stated "HIV and Hepatitis B have not been controlled in this area"

The NYT saw fit to deem Clark University as existing in one of the top 10 worst neighborhoods of any college in the US.
i remember seeing that sign when i went to a show at Clark back in like 1988. i believe the neighborhood was called Piedmont? it was real sketchy.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Spartan112 View Post
Just saying that serving in the military does not always mean a person was/is honorable or even a decent human being. That said the cop in this sitaution is pretty clearly in the wrong.
Sorry for the impulse post. I suck. You have a point.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:48 PM
  #303  
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Originally Posted by scotch View Post
i remember seeing that sign when i went to a show at Clark back in like 1988. i believe the neighborhood was called Piedmont? it was real sketchy.
That's the one. Still is sketchy though not quite what it once was. Probably the worst crime cities in Mass are still Lowell and Springfield.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:49 PM
  #304  
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Originally Posted by EatMyA** View Post
Sorry for the impulse post. I suck. You have a point.
No worries.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:51 PM
  #305  
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I would guess that 90% of the people whining about how easy it is to be a cop/how they don't do anything good/etc. would run home whining to their mommies after one day on the streets of NYC. Actually, probably more like 95%.

In case you haven't noticed, it's better for your cause to be allied/partnered with law enforcement rather than at odds with them, whether you like/agree with them or not. But that's nowhere NEAR black/white enough for this crowd.
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Last edited by DrPete; 07-29-08 at 04:54 PM.
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Old 07-29-08, 04:53 PM
  #306  
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Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
I would guess that 90% of the people whining about how easy it is to be a cop/how they don't do anything good/etc. would run home whining to their mommies after one day on the streets of NYC.
I've been to NYC a number of times...I'd much rather spend a day there than Springfield, MA.
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Old 07-29-08, 05:00 PM
  #307  
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Originally Posted by EatMyA** View Post
what's yours? Screw our soldiers LHO was a vet? They are the ones that are really dying. This goon is not a hero of any kind. The "cyclist" did more for YOU and all of us by serving than that officer (term used loosely) ever did.
So what, he can't do anything wrong? Someone should tell that to all the folks imprisoned at Ft. Leavenworth. It's just a ridiculously flawed argument.

I'm all for supporting veterans, but this incident and what he may/may not have done to cause it have absolutely nothing to do with military service. Nor does this incident negate what good the officer may have done before or after that incident.
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Old 07-29-08, 05:55 PM
  #308  
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Originally Posted by Patriot View Post
I'll only make one more post in this thread, and hopefully a Moderator will see this.

This thread has absolutely NOTHING to do with Road Cycling. It's not even remotely related. It's purely a political story. I am sick and tired of hearing about these stupid politically motivated Critical Mass rides everyone keeps talking about. This garbage does not belong in the Road Forum to begin with. If anyone in the hierarchy even cares, please move this entire thread to the Political Forum where it belongs.
So you got caught telling porkies and now want the thread locked. I can understand that.
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Old 07-29-08, 06:09 PM
  #309  
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I live and work in NYC. Commute every day by bicycle from Brooklyn into lower Manhattan. Really surprised at the majority of the responses by fellow bikers here. Unfortunately the stereotypes about goon cops in NYC is somewhat correct, or at least their perception that way is. (I have a close childhood friend at a precinct in the bronx with a seedy past that easily made officer) The fact is the pay is very very low for the area. An entry lever graphic designer (my field) makes more than a new rookie out on the streets with a gun—that is scary. The fact that this particular officer acted the way he did is sadly no surprise. 22 years old and living with his parents? He should not be in a position of authority if this is how he treats civilians unprovoked.

I don't participate in CM and frankly find self-righteous bike advocates intolerable, but this cop is clearly in the wrong. The worst part is the victim would likely have no case if not for the video archive.
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Old 07-29-08, 06:47 PM
  #310  
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Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
So what, he can't do anything wrong? Someone should tell that to all the folks imprisoned at Ft. Leavenworth. It's just a ridiculously flawed argument.

I'm all for supporting veterans, but this incident and what he may/may not have done to cause it have absolutely nothing to do with military service
. Nor does this incident negate what good the officer may have done before or after that incident.
While this incident might not negate the officer's past contributions (probably not all that substantial: he was only on the force for a few weeks), he nevertheless ought to be fired for it unless he provides some plausible explanation for his behavior. What I saw on that video looks an awful like a wanton, unprovoked assault. What's more, after attacking the the cyclist, the officer invented what was almost certainly a false pretext to arrest him.

Last edited by aloysius; 07-29-08 at 07:02 PM.
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Old 07-29-08, 06:49 PM
  #311  
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That 'officer' is a scumbag plain and simple, and should be dealt with accordingly.
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Old 07-29-08, 07:59 PM
  #312  
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While I do so love the fact that officer is in the wrong he has been dealt with accordingly.
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Old 07-30-08, 12:16 AM
  #313  
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Originally Posted by Within a Word View Post
CM generates ill will by delaying motorists by... a few minutes?
Cars delay me by far more than several minutes every time I'm on my MC. Bicyclists never delay me, in fact we can happily share a lane (*) and get along just fine. Similarly, they get around me easily. Cars block bicycles, cars can't get around bicycles, cars block cars, cars block motorcycles. See a pattern here? It's not about MC's and bicycles - it's about cars, or more specifically about insisting on using a humongous vehicle on a roadway of limited width. Sure I drive occasionally too - but not effing around a densely populated city. I get me and my passengers and their stuff loaded up and we get the hell out of dodge. Driving a car in NYC? Sorry. You get what you deserve, because you are the problem. Seriously.

(*) Illegal in states where prohibited by law
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Old 07-30-08, 01:06 AM
  #314  
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Originally Posted by neverjared View Post
While I do so love the fact that officer is in the wrong he has been dealt with accordingly.
Not yet, he's been put on standard desk duty while he's under investigation. He won't be 'dealt with' until I hear he's off the force.
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Old 07-30-08, 05:56 AM
  #315  
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This won't be dealt with until Bloomberg says 'enough is enough' to the cops. He has yet to say this kind of behavior has to stop.
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Old 07-30-08, 07:09 AM
  #316  
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Cop has been stripped of his badge and gun. Check this link:

https://cbs13.com/national/nyc.youtub....2.782212.html
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Old 07-30-08, 07:16 AM
  #317  
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My brother is a police officer. I'm support law enforcement and believe there is a story behind everything but I have to say NYC police are rather brutal.

Someone should scrutinize their hiring practices. Some officers seems to have a swager about them when walking down the street. Baton swinging stroll, similar to what you see in a gangster. Walking down the street some officers look more like a rent-a-cop than police officer. Even baggy pants. Not very professional.

I flew into NYC once on my way to Princeton and ended up drinking with a friend. It was late, and while waiting for a train in Penn station I fell asleep seated, with my back to a large pole not wanting to sit in the general seating as it appeared rather sketchy. I was wearing a suit with luggage so it can't be said I looked like a vagrant. I was awoken with a cop's hand pressing deep into the cartilage of my throat, instantly awoken, dazed in confused. My friend was shocked so seemed the other officers partner. In fact, looking at his face he was praying for me to take a swing in the confusion so he could lay down a beating. I wasn't playing game.

Then his partner said you can sit here and walked away.

Just wasn't necessary. Nice way to treat a visitor.
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Old 07-30-08, 08:26 AM
  #318  
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People on this board do realize that not every night-time social ride is Critical Mass, right? and they're not all the same.
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Old 07-30-08, 08:38 AM
  #319  
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I can't possibly imagine why anyone would dislike or distrust any officer of the law.
 
Old 07-30-08, 09:29 AM
  #320  
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Originally Posted by the_drain View Post
I find it laughable that you assume this officer doesn't have a degree. He could be a physicist for all you know.

The same mistake was made with the Canadian military after the Somalian scandal....they made a degree manditory...problem was, a lot of the people involved HAD degrees.

Having a degree doesn't make you smarter.

Also, here in Canada, it is tough to become a police officer....it is a very vigorous procedure and mistakes are still made.

The RCMP for example go through:

An entrance exam (read, intelligence test), a physical test, a comprehensive background check, a couple of interviews including a behavioral/situational one and polygraph, medical, typing....and that is just to get in the door. You then attend a 24 week boot camp (which they JUST started paying you for) ...which is regarded as one of the worlds best training facilities...after which you aren't guaranteed a job.

I'm sorry, the demographic attracted to this job are not the type that don't want to do 'menial' labor. It attracts people from all backgrounds.
The cop is 22 years old, and comes from a long line of cops. I doubt he decided to spend his time from 18 to 22 studying nuclear physics, and then joined the NYPD just for fun. Not that it's not possible, but it's equally possible he could start ****ting gold and pissing diamonds, however quite unlikely.

I find it amazing that people are so ready to jump up and support police brutality. Why should these cops have to worry about PR, the very people they are trying to abuse are standing up for the abusive acts in a public forum. That's pretty scary, talk about not needing to brainwash the populace.

Joe
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Old 07-30-08, 09:32 AM
  #321  
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Originally Posted by sfrider View Post
Cars delay me by far more than several minutes every time I'm on my MC. Bicyclists never delay me, in fact we can happily share a lane (*) and get along just fine. Similarly, they get around me easily. Cars block bicycles, cars can't get around bicycles, cars block cars, cars block motorcycles. See a pattern here? It's not about MC's and bicycles - it's about cars, or more specifically about insisting on using a humongous vehicle on a roadway of limited width. Sure I drive occasionally too - but not effing around a densely populated city. I get me and my passengers and their stuff loaded up and we get the hell out of dodge. Driving a car in NYC? Sorry. You get what you deserve, because you are the problem. Seriously.

(*) Illegal in states where prohibited by law
What? How dare you suggest that perhaps bikes are better transport than cars. You NEED a huge vehicle taking up an entire lane when you could fit 4 bicycles in the same space. It just makes sense!

Joe
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Old 07-30-08, 09:36 AM
  #322  
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When Official Truth Collides With Cheap Digital Technology

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/30/nyregion/30about.html


July 30, 2008
When Official Truth Collides With Cheap Digital Technology
By JIM DWYER

Around 9:30 on Friday night, a bicyclist pedaling down Seventh Avenue veered to the left, trying to avoid hitting a police officer who was in the middle of the street.

But the officer, Patrick Pogan, took a few quick steps toward the biker, Christopher Long, braced himself and drove his upper body into Mr. Long.

Officer Pogan, an all-star football player in high school, hit Mr. Long as if he were a halfback running along the sidelines, and sent him flying.

As of Tuesday evening, a videotape of the encounter had been viewed about 400,000 times on YouTube. “I can’t explain why it happened,” Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly said on Tuesday. “I have no understanding as to why that would happen.”

But this episode was not just a powerful crash between one bicyclist and a police officer. It may turn out to be yet another head-on collision between false stories told by some police officers in criminal court cases and documentary evidence that directly contradicts them. And while in many instances the inaccurate stories have been tolerated by police superiors and prosecutors, Officer Pogan’s account is getting high-level scrutiny.

Later that night, Officer Pogan composed a story of his encounter with Mr. Long. It bore no resemblance to the events seen on the videotape. Based on the sworn complaint, Mr. Long was held for 26 hours on charges of attempted assault and disorderly conduct.

Over the weekend, though, the videotape, made by a tourist in Times Square with his family, fell into the hands of people involved with Critical Mass, the monthly bicycle rally that Mr. Long had been riding in.

The availability of cheap digital technology — video cameras, digital cameras, cellphone cameras — has ended a monopoly on the history of public gatherings that was limited to the official narratives, like the sworn documents created by police officers and prosecutors. The digital age has brought in free-range history.

Hundreds of cases against people arrested during the 2004 Republican National Convention collapsed under an avalanche of videotaped evidence that either completely contradicted police accounts, or raised significant questions about their reliability. The videotapes were made by people involved in the protests, bystanders, tourists and police officers.

At the New York Public Library, a small group holding a banner against one of the stone lions was arrested and charged with blocking traffic in the middle of 42nd Street, although video showed they were on the steps, and nowhere near the street.

In another case at the library, a police officer testified that he and three other officers had to carry one protester, Dennis Kyne, by his hands and feet down the library steps. Videotape showed that Mr. Kyne walked down the steps under his own power, and that the officer who testified against him had no role in his arrest. The charges were dismissed; the Manhattan district attorney’s office declined to bring perjury charges against the officer who gave the testimony.

Dozens of complaints were sworn by police officers who said they had witnessed people violating the law on Fulton Street and near Union Square, but later admitted under oath that their only involvement was to process the arrests, and that they had not actually seen the disorderly conduct that was charged.

An assistant to District Attorney Robert M. Morgenthau wrote to the Police Department to stress the importance of officers’ not swearing to things they had not seen for themselves. The prosecutors said the confusion surrounding mass arrests made it hard to bring perjury charges.

The case of Christopher Long and Officer Pogan is shaping up as another example of an official narrative being directly challenged by videotape.

In a criminal court complaint, Officer Pogan wrote that Mr. Long deliberately attacked him with the bike — although the videotape shows Mr. Long veering away from Officer Pogan, who pursues him toward the curb.

The officer said he was knocked to the ground by Mr. Long. Throughout the tape, though, he remains on his feet, even after banging into Mr. Long.

The police officer wrote that Mr. Long had been “weaving” in and out of traffic, “thereby forcing multiple vehicles to stop abruptly or change their direction in order to avoid hitting” Mr. Long. However, in the videotape, it appears that there are no cars on the street.

Mr. Long is due back in court in early September. By then, most of Mr. Long’s bruises are likely to have healed. The prognosis for the truth is not so clear.

E-mail: dwyer@nytimes.com
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Old 07-30-08, 09:44 AM
  #323  
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This story has got some serious legs. Our local msg board lit on fire when someone posted this. I wonder why the story itself seems so compelling for so many people?
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Old 07-30-08, 10:00 AM
  #324  
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Originally Posted by johnny99 View Post
https://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/30/nyregion/30about.html


July 30, 2008
When Official Truth Collides With Cheap Digital Technology
By JIM DWYER

Around 9:30 on Friday night, a bicyclist pedaling down Seventh Avenue veered to the left, trying to avoid hitting a police officer who was in the middle of the street.

But the officer, Patrick Pogan, took a few quick steps toward the biker, Christopher Long, braced himself and drove his upper body into Mr. Long.

Officer Pogan, an all-star football player in high school, hit Mr. Long as if he were a halfback running along the sidelines, and sent him flying.

As of Tuesday evening, a videotape of the encounter had been viewed about 400,000 times on YouTube. “I can’t explain why it happened,” Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly said on Tuesday. “I have no understanding as to why that would happen.”

But this episode was not just a powerful crash between one bicyclist and a police officer. It may turn out to be yet another head-on collision between false stories told by some police officers in criminal court cases and documentary evidence that directly contradicts them. And while in many instances the inaccurate stories have been tolerated by police superiors and prosecutors, Officer Pogan’s account is getting high-level scrutiny.

Later that night, Officer Pogan composed a story of his encounter with Mr. Long. It bore no resemblance to the events seen on the videotape. Based on the sworn complaint, Mr. Long was held for 26 hours on charges of attempted assault and disorderly conduct.

Over the weekend, though, the videotape, made by a tourist in Times Square with his family, fell into the hands of people involved with Critical Mass, the monthly bicycle rally that Mr. Long had been riding in.

The availability of cheap digital technology — video cameras, digital cameras, cellphone cameras — has ended a monopoly on the history of public gatherings that was limited to the official narratives, like the sworn documents created by police officers and prosecutors. The digital age has brought in free-range history.

Hundreds of cases against people arrested during the 2004 Republican National Convention collapsed under an avalanche of videotaped evidence that either completely contradicted police accounts, or raised significant questions about their reliability. The videotapes were made by people involved in the protests, bystanders, tourists and police officers.

At the New York Public Library, a small group holding a banner against one of the stone lions was arrested and charged with blocking traffic in the middle of 42nd Street, although video showed they were on the steps, and nowhere near the street.

In another case at the library, a police officer testified that he and three other officers had to carry one protester, Dennis Kyne, by his hands and feet down the library steps. Videotape showed that Mr. Kyne walked down the steps under his own power, and that the officer who testified against him had no role in his arrest. The charges were dismissed; the Manhattan district attorney’s office declined to bring perjury charges against the officer who gave the testimony.

Dozens of complaints were sworn by police officers who said they had witnessed people violating the law on Fulton Street and near Union Square, but later admitted under oath that their only involvement was to process the arrests, and that they had not actually seen the disorderly conduct that was charged.

An assistant to District Attorney Robert M. Morgenthau wrote to the Police Department to stress the importance of officers’ not swearing to things they had not seen for themselves. The prosecutors said the confusion surrounding mass arrests made it hard to bring perjury charges.

The case of Christopher Long and Officer Pogan is shaping up as another example of an official narrative being directly challenged by videotape.

In a criminal court complaint, Officer Pogan wrote that Mr. Long deliberately attacked him with the bike — although the videotape shows Mr. Long veering away from Officer Pogan, who pursues him toward the curb.

The officer said he was knocked to the ground by Mr. Long. Throughout the tape, though, he remains on his feet, even after banging into Mr. Long.

The police officer wrote that Mr. Long had been “weaving” in and out of traffic, “thereby forcing multiple vehicles to stop abruptly or change their direction in order to avoid hitting” Mr. Long. However, in the videotape, it appears that there are no cars on the street.

Mr. Long is due back in court in early September. By then, most of Mr. Long’s bruises are likely to have healed. The prognosis for the truth is not so clear.

E-mail: dwyer@nytimes.com
Nice slanted "article". Gotta love the "press".
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Old 07-30-08, 10:04 AM
  #325  
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I just read that whole thread. WOW.

I hope those cops know that the internet isn't as anonymous as they think it is. Wow, just wow.
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