Hot r Not
11-11-13, 02:49 PM
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Go Lance!
This is the first time I've owned a bike that I think is worthy of posting in the Hot r Not thread.
This is my new (to me) 2000 Trek 5200 USPS team colored bike. It has Ultegra shift/brake levers, brake calipers, standard double cranks, 9 speed cassette, and front derailleur; a Dura Ace rear derailleur; Look Keo Classic pedals; Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheels, Bontrager Race X Lite CF Blade bars, Race Lite stem, and Race Lite CF seat post; and a Specialized saddle.
The pic was taken using Instagram.
This is my new (to me) 2000 Trek 5200 USPS team colored bike. It has Ultegra shift/brake levers, brake calipers, standard double cranks, 9 speed cassette, and front derailleur; a Dura Ace rear derailleur; Look Keo Classic pedals; Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheels, Bontrager Race X Lite CF Blade bars, Race Lite stem, and Race Lite CF seat post; and a Specialized saddle.
The pic was taken using Instagram.
11-11-13, 03:11 PM
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Yeah, it totally is Lance-ish. However, for the price I paid for it, I'll happily ride a Lance-mobile. 
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11-11-13, 03:37 PM
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less talky talky...
more pictures
more pictures
11-11-13, 03:46 PM
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More nonsense and rubbish. Have any real data to back up your Internet bluster? With an infinite number of body types / dimensions along with a myriad of frame geometries making a blanket statement regarding what an appropriate stem length should be is ludicrous. In addition, while Eddy M is one of the best cyclists of all time road bike geometries have changed significantly since his heyday so inferring a 130mm stem is the sweet spot (because Eddy used one) is ridiculous.
Oh, come on. Cherry picking and quote mining, woo-hoo!
Of course handlebar reach would be taken into account when looking at stem length, as well as shifter hood shape and position on the handlebar. I guess I have to explicitly state every little detail and then hope you won't try to take it out of context. When I said, repeated and then underlined the key word - "unusually", in "unusually short" - this should, for someone not trying to rip apart every technicality in order to "win" in an argument, mean that the stem is unusually short for the bicycle at hand, including frame size, handlebar reach, hood shape, etc, etc.
No, I did not say a frame should be designed around a particular stem and seat post and nothing else taken into account. The whole bicycle should be looked at as a system. You can't just ignore the effect that stem length, among other factors, has on the whole system and then just use whatever parts are necessary to get the contact points into a good ergonomic position. Yes, the contact points should be in the good ergonomic position, but the whole system should also be set up to function as close to optimal as possible. Proper frame size and geometry is a part of this and it cannot be ignored. Extreme adjustments needed to get a proper position on a particular frame are a sign of said frame's size and geometry not being optimal for the person. BTW, Eddy Merckx insisted his frames be designed to fit right with a 130mm stem - not because he thought it looked cool, but because he felt that provided the best overall performance. This is not to say that 130mm is the perfect stem length because Eddy said so, but to point that there is such thing as optimal stem length for a particular frame geometry.
People who need a short stem to ride a particular frame would in most cases be better served with a different frame geometry. Their whole riding experience would be better and that has nothing to do with what the bicycle looks like. That statement will stay true no matter what shape you try to bend it into.
Of course handlebar reach would be taken into account when looking at stem length, as well as shifter hood shape and position on the handlebar. I guess I have to explicitly state every little detail and then hope you won't try to take it out of context. When I said, repeated and then underlined the key word - "unusually", in "unusually short" - this should, for someone not trying to rip apart every technicality in order to "win" in an argument, mean that the stem is unusually short for the bicycle at hand, including frame size, handlebar reach, hood shape, etc, etc.
No, I did not say a frame should be designed around a particular stem and seat post and nothing else taken into account. The whole bicycle should be looked at as a system. You can't just ignore the effect that stem length, among other factors, has on the whole system and then just use whatever parts are necessary to get the contact points into a good ergonomic position. Yes, the contact points should be in the good ergonomic position, but the whole system should also be set up to function as close to optimal as possible. Proper frame size and geometry is a part of this and it cannot be ignored. Extreme adjustments needed to get a proper position on a particular frame are a sign of said frame's size and geometry not being optimal for the person. BTW, Eddy Merckx insisted his frames be designed to fit right with a 130mm stem - not because he thought it looked cool, but because he felt that provided the best overall performance. This is not to say that 130mm is the perfect stem length because Eddy said so, but to point that there is such thing as optimal stem length for a particular frame geometry.
People who need a short stem to ride a particular frame would in most cases be better served with a different frame geometry. Their whole riding experience would be better and that has nothing to do with what the bicycle looks like. That statement will stay true no matter what shape you try to bend it into.
11-11-13, 03:57 PM
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11-11-13, 04:04 PM
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Rockin the SS. I like it. What type of pedals do u have on your rig?
11-11-13, 04:06 PM
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11-11-13, 06:02 PM
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I run SPD's on my road bike commuter, ain't no thang. 
11-11-13, 06:07 PM
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11-11-13, 06:31 PM
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@Fiery, I am neither "cherry picking" or "quote mining", nor do I care to "win" an argument.
When you say an "unusually short" stem belies poor fit, I can see the point and don't disagree. When you further say 90-100mm on 58-60 cm frame is "unusually short", I do disagree. By this definition, would 110-120mm be "short", and 130mm the only appropriate "normal" stem length? The combination of 100 mm and traditional bars may be perfectly valid, depending on whether someone is optimizing their fit in the drops, or on the hoods. But your definition says this is a poor frame selection and "unusually short". If you had said an MTB stem, or a 70mm, or a riser stem, I would have not said a word, as I would agree.
I will also say that I have never seen an adjustable angle stem used in any manner other than to mangle any sense of normal in a fit.
When you say an "unusually short" stem belies poor fit, I can see the point and don't disagree. When you further say 90-100mm on 58-60 cm frame is "unusually short", I do disagree. By this definition, would 110-120mm be "short", and 130mm the only appropriate "normal" stem length? The combination of 100 mm and traditional bars may be perfectly valid, depending on whether someone is optimizing their fit in the drops, or on the hoods. But your definition says this is a poor frame selection and "unusually short". If you had said an MTB stem, or a 70mm, or a riser stem, I would have not said a word, as I would agree.
I will also say that I have never seen an adjustable angle stem used in any manner other than to mangle any sense of normal in a fit.
A good approximation is that, when looked from the side, a rider's hands should be straight above or out in front of the front hub, when in the preferred hand position. A typical modern handlebar has 75-85mm horisontal reach, and a typical preferred hand position is on the hoods. In such a typical case, a 58-60 size frame will typically work best with a 120-140mm stem; 110mm will be pushing it, 100 and below will be a compromise. Far from saying that the bicycle will be unridable, it simply won't perform the way it was designed to, especially when it comes to cornering. Is this OK?
More nonsense and rubbish. Have any real data to back up your Internet bluster? With an infinite number of body types / dimensions along with a myriad of frame geometries making a blanket statement regarding what an appropriate stem length should be is ludicrous. In addition, while Eddy M is one of the best cyclists of all time road bike geometries have changed significantly since his heyday so inferring a 130mm stem is the sweet spot (because Eddy used one) is ridiculous.
There's a myriad road racing bicycles in production at the moment, but their geometries really don't vary that much, especially when it comes to handling. Even when the variations in handling geometry are taken into account, a road racing bicycle will always need a certain front to back weight distribution to perform at its best - and the problem is typically getting enough weight on the front wheel. Yes, there's more than one way to change the weight distribution, such as lengthening the chain stays, but good luck trying to find such a frame without going custom. Even if you do find one, you've done exactly what I'm talking about - you've picked the appropriate geometry to suit your fit needs in the best way.
And yes, there is indeed an infinite number of body types and proportions, but that just means that not everybody will be able to achieve an optimal ergonomic fit that will also provide optimal performance on just any frame they happen to like. Somebody will need a taller frame, somebody will need a longer frame, and somebody will need to go custom, if they want the best fit and the best performance.
Eddy Merckx example is just that, an example, not evidence that 130mm is some Holy Grail perfect stem length no matter what the frame size or geometry - I actually explicitly stated this was so in the very post you quoted.
Spot on! I do apologize. I have actually made a couple of changes to the bike recently that might warrant a new entry, though it's still just a lowly triple with old Shimano shifters with exposed cables. I'll do my best to provide a picture in the following days.
11-11-13, 06:37 PM
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11-11-13, 07:05 PM
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11-11-13, 07:42 PM
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Meh, I like my bike. Maybe I should have posted it with my Jet 50's and Vector's, but regardless it was obviously not bought at a garage sale; you just wanted to get a reaction. Typically saying someone needs 'thick skin' is just an excuse for being a **** which is pretty easy posting from a seat hundreds of miles away.
I'm not really mad that you don't like my bike, just that you thought I was an easy target for insults.
I'm not really mad that you don't like my bike, just that you thought I was an easy target for insults.
11-11-13, 09:32 PM
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I don't care, I say hot. I like vintage steel bikes, especially those that look like the 80's exploded on them. I'd ride the hell out of that bike. I'd remove the dork disk tho.
11-11-13, 09:41 PM
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I also say hot to the Panny. And if it's going to have a dork disk at least have it be a proper vintage metal disk.
11-12-13, 11:52 AM
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OK enough talking nonsense. Hot r Not?
11-12-13, 11:55 AM
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I like it. Hot.
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11-12-13, 12:05 PM
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Hot! Does it have a different color on the other side?
11-12-13, 12:27 PM
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11-12-13, 12:34 PM
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@Rustle, I don't like the thin seat mast topper and the thin looking spacer stack under the massive stem. I like everything else, it's very well put together. And that two-faced paint job just brings it over the top for me. Very hot.
11-12-13, 12:48 PM
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11-12-13, 01:06 PM
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post a NDS picture
11-12-13, 01:07 PM
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11-12-13, 01:08 PM
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11-12-13, 01:26 PM
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