dgasmd

This sort of started in another thread, but it brings up a very good point/question. I always hear people talk about how they ride the A ride or B ride, etc., but I have never seen a good consensus on what is really defined as B ride or an A ride. Speed, distance, or both?

To me, it is not just about speed if you don't have a decent distance to go with it. So, I would define A ride as a ride at least 45-50 miles long at 25 or 25+ MPH average minimum. Of course, you can vary the speed significantly to include very hilly rides, flats, etc. Anything less to me is a B ride or less. B ride probably same distance but 22-24 MPH. C ride same distance at 18-22 MPH. Anything less is a "beginner/joy" ride to me. This is no bragging. Note that I did not include where I fall in these.

What do you call an A, B, C, and beginner ride in your area?

patentcad

Your average speed notions do underscore your flat as a pancake Wussy locale. I've been racing in the 35+ for over ten years. 25 mph+ average speed in a RACE is fast, the fastest road race I've done averaged 26.2 mph, the fastest crit was 28.5 mph or so. On a training ride? Anything over 24 mph in my area (with a few hills, a traffic light or two) is friggin ballistic. You don't get 25 mph + 'average minimums' around here on training rides very often, and that's when it's loaded with Cat 2/3/4 racers.

Not for nothing, but to average 25+ mph you have to be doing 30 mph a fair amount of the time.

dgasmd

OK. Mine is bigger than yours. End of argument. Now, back to the question............

Hammertoe

I grew up in DC and this is the Potomac Peddlers site and ride descriptions...

https://www.bikepptc.org/ride_class_table

patentcad

It sounds like yours is flatter than mine.

patentcad

And don't kid yourself dg boy, the argument never friggin ends.

Not on my watch.

CaboWabo

That chart looks about right. That would put me in B, which is where I was in the group ride yesterday. I averaged 17.5 for 41 miles and there were a couple of guys that took off towards the end and broke off for a longer route.

Then there's the other guys that would have been AA and rode with us for just a short amount of time before continuing on their 80-100 mile ride.

patentcad

That Potomac chart is spot-on. That's how fast the rides of that ranking are up here. If your idea of an 'A' ride is 'minimum 25 mph', call CSC and see if they'll give you a try-out.

dgasmd

I understand what you are saying. Maybe I should have not made such an emphasis on the word "average". There is a ride about 30 min north of me that meets weekly. Their A ride warms up at about 25 MPH for the first few miles and then really crank up the juice around 30 MPH for the rest of the ride. That is about 30-35 miles in length. I have never done it myself, so I can't say from first hand knowledge, but this is what the local guys that have done it tell me, so I am using that ride as an example. There is a weekly ride in Palm Beach that is about the same for about 40 miles, but some of those guys are animals. There is a group of colombians that show up. It is not for nothing that they have called them "the Cartel". Those guys seem to be able to go all day long at 30 MPH while chit chating.

dgasmd

I am sure you missed the part in the original post where I said:

CaboWabo

Must be those freshly paved, flat as a lake SoFlo roads .

caloso

The Hour Record is 49.700km (30.882 mi). The Cartel ought to make a go of it; I'm sure it'd be just another training ride for them.

patentcad

You do sound like you're talking about perceived middle of the ride speed. That is often 30 mph on fast rides. But that doesn't necessarily translate into an OVERALL average speed (as measured by your bike computer) from the first pedal stroke until the last. That's usually slower. Trust me, 25+ mph is an AA ride (even AA+), not an A ride. There is a distinction here. AA are the hard core racers, and very few fast non-racers generally survive those until the end. On today's Nyack Ride for example, there may have been 18 guys (out of an original peloton of 50+) who survived until the last 3-4 mile stretch after this one little technical climb that sorts it out. I think maybe 2 of those were guys who don't regularly race. That ride is somewhat hilly in a couple of spots (1 mile climb mid-ride, the finish is a .75 mile hill top) and it generally averages 22-23 mph for about 50 miles. It would be faster on a flatter course, the fast flat parts on that ride are 30+ mph, today we went through that section at about 34 mph.

Don't worry about it. Find the hammer monkeys in your area and try to ride with them. Rinse. Repeat. If you get shelled, keep coming back. That's the only way I ever got fast enough to ride with those boys.

dgasmd

You forgot the part where the Hour Record is done by ONE MAN VS 40-60 people pulling as a group. Not the same thing.

mollusk

Average speed doesn't mean much, even over the same terrain in the same weather. Say you have Ride #1 that leaves the parking lot and hits 25 mph quickly and stays there. Then you have Ride #2 that rolls out at a sedate 18 mph for a quite some distance and then the pace swings between 26 mph and 33 mph for the rest of the ride. Both might have the same average speed, but they will be completely different rides.

BarryJo

Our tuesday night A ride is a total hammer fest, slow warm up for about a mile or 2 and then it usually averages 23+ for 50-60 miles over some pretty hilly terrian
The B ride has grown to epic proportions over the last couple of years. Last year we were averaging about 18.5 over 40-50 milles. This year with all the new people riding it usually clocks in at over 20.
One of the biggest differences between both rides is if you go out with the A ride, even if you're in the best of condition you'd better know what you're doing or you are seriously going to get yelled at.
The B ride is less organized with little attention to paceline riding, or obeying any traffic laws. Pretty much do whatever you want type ride.
C ride is saturday morning and is for beginners learning to ride as part of a group.

San Rensho 

Lots of variables.

Here in dead flat Miami there's a training ride/race 4 times a week, about 30-35 miles long. Group is 40-80+. I don't check an average for the whole ride, but when we're going (which seems like always), its always above 24-25. We will go in the low 30's for a good portion of the ride if the group is chasing. Its gone a bit above 40 for not so short spurts. Have been dropped on several occassions because all I have is a 53/13 which spins out quickly.

BarryJo

The more I think about this I think I think it boils down to this:
A ride you need to be fast with endurance, possess good bike handling skills and the ability to ride a tight paceline.
B ride is for anyone who can't or is afraid to ride with the A's.

roccobike

The group I ride with does not label the groups in our rides, each rider just naturally falls into one of the five or six groups that participate each week.

What I found to be the big difference between what I refer to as the "C" and slower groups (under 17MPH) and what I call the "B" group (18 MPH), "A" group (20MPH) and "AA" (22-25??basically a blur) are how orgainzed the groups are. The three higher levels are well organized pace-lines with riders focused on the ride, only occaisional chatter. Each rider takes a turn pulling the line, back markers (non-pull riders) are only permitted with the "B" group. The C and lower rides have little or no organization, no pace lines except by accident and lots of chatter, sort of social thing as opposed to a focused ride.
On the plus side, no one, I mean NO ONE ever gets "dropped" by the "D" or slowest group. Thats a rule and they mean it. It really helps attracked new, inexperieced riders.

NomadVW 

With rolling hills, our weekly group ride the last few weeks (I would call it an A ride):

bruin11

The club I belong to does rides for a variety of levels on weekdays and weekends. Here are the levels of rides. We have lots of variety. The club is more of a recreational club as opposed to racing but of course there are members who race. Yesterday I did a C+ ride which was 62 miles and 5000 feet of climbing and it finished in the middle of the posted avg speed scale at 14.5MPH.
A group
Very Fast – 20+ MPH (Avg, 25+ MPH flat road speed)
Vigorous riding with excellent bike handling skills, expected cooperative
contribution to group within abilities. No sweep, possible regrouping.
Riders are expected to navigate on own if dropped.
B group
Fast – 17-19 MPH (Avg, 22+ MPH flat road speed)
Brisk to vigorous riding with above average bike handling skills, expected
cooperative contribution to group within abilities. No sweep, possible
regrouping. Riders are expected to navigate on own if dropped.
B- group
Fast – 16-17.5 MPH (Avg, 20+ MPH flat road speed)
Brisk to vigorous riding with above average bike handling skills, expected
cooperative contribution to group within abilities. No sweep, possible
regrouping. Riders are expected to navigate on own if dropped.
C+ group
Moderately Fast – 14-16 MPH
Moderate to brisk riding with good bike handling ability. Some
cooperative pacelining skills required. Riders are expected to be selfsufficient
but there will be some regrouping. A sweep may be appointed.
C group
Intermediate – 13-14 MPH
Moderate riding with more attention to scenery.
Regroups often. A sweep is usually appointed.
D group
Slow/Intermediate – 11-13 MPH
Leisurely to moderate riding, sightseeing and destination oriented.
Regroups often. A sweep is always appointed.
E group
Slow – Less than 9-11 MPH
Ride is paced to the slowest rider.
A sweep is always appointed.

RideCO

Can someone help me to define what constitutes Hilly and Moderate for the Potomac chart?

thx

Cleave

Hi,

Either try doing those rides and report back firsthand or download someone's Garmin or PowerTap data because I flat don't believe those speeds. People are not slouches in SoCal and I don't see rides that go 1 hour plus at 30 MPH. Sorry, but in my experience post-ride discussions of ride speed tend to be inflated.

For my non-racing (but highly motivated club) our "look-down" Group A speed is anything over 22 MPH. There are stretches at 25+ MPH (I can show my download data if you want ) but 25+ never lasts more than 10 miles (including stops at traffic lights).

Group B rides at 19-21 MPH look-down speed.

Cleave

Hi,

I guess I'm glad that I don't live in Miami.

Must be a lot of Euro-pro caliber riders there to hold 40+ more than a minute or two on flat ground.

I don't even want to think about how fast your races average.

patentcad

Any ride here with 50+ racers on dead flat terrain with warm temps and no traffic lights would generally be about that fast too. But we have traffic lights and in the summer some hills. In the winter it's often <40ºF on that ride, so even though the hills are gone, the heavier air and generally lower fitness levels in winter months slow things down somewhat.