cuda2k

I've run the Micelin Pro 2 Race and Pro 3 Race tires on a number of bikes, but considering going with a pair of the Conti 4000S tires for my new wheel build. The all-black tire with silver lettering will go really nicely with the color scheme of the new rims (Ambrosio Excellight SSC) and as well as the bike (my Serotta). Also they are running $7-10 cheaper (each) than the Pro 3's right now. I've stayed away from the Conti tires in the past due to running a lot of Campagnolo rims which have a harder than average time getting Conti tires mounted on them. But I've heard the Ambrosio's fit tires much like a Mavic Open Pro so I'm considering giving them a go.

So, those of you who have used both tire, give me some comparative points on these two tires if you would please. Thanks!




























timing how long it will take for pcad to comment on this decision...

SushiJoe

I am also interested to see what folks say. I've only ever run Pro Race 2/3s.

Psimet2001 

You know my feelings on these. In general I would say there is no comparison if we were talking "pre-black chili". But because you specifically mention "S" I have no solid input.

I also have no real reason to switch from PR3's I absolutley love their conering performance now. Real performance tire.

BTW - PR3's are now $31 at PBK thanks to the exchange rate changes recently. Almost bought 3 today.

wfrogge

Pro race 2 and 3s are a little too slick in the corners for me. Had the 3's on this year during the Soto downtown Nashville crit and was sliding if I hit a corner faster than 30mph. Had to accelerate out just to get back on the pack. Changed to the 4000s tires for the Masters crit and didnt have that problem anymore.

YMMV.

tekhna

I wish I had that problem...

Psimet2001 

See....I'd agree with you when it came to the 2's, but with the 3's what I have loved about them is the fact that I've taken dicey corners at 30+mph in the last couple of crits this year and been amazed with the hookup.

You know the corners....the one's where you are like "oh crap. I'm going to slide out....I know it." But you just commit and lay it over hard while keeping real relaxed....

...and they just stayed connected. Enough to bang out of them as soon as the pedals would clear.

I have heard enough to know the Chili compound tires are good tires, but I just feel like I'm riding the wheels through a viscous fluid when riding Contis....like somone is grabbing your saddle and holding you back.

cuda2k

So I see. Didn't catch that earlier, was remember the price from the last time I'd bought some a few months ago. So I guess the price each is only about $3-4.



... tries to remember the last time he was in a 30mph corner...

deadly downtube

this is so funny... i'm sure some cyclists actually believe that's how much a tire can effect your performance... just like if i replaced my ultegra parts with dura ace i would notice a huge difference! i can notice a big difference when i go from my 37c touring tires with tuffy strips and slime tubes to my slick 23c on my road bike, but from one ridiculously expensive road tire to another?? one is like molasses the other is not??

SushiJoe

Ok, wait-- so is the black-chili the real deal or hype?

haimtoeg

I tried PR2 about two years ago, they ride really nicely but I found that they get flats much more frequently than GP4000 or GP4000S that never flat.

cuski

I haven't tried P3Rs yet, and it's been a while since I rode on P2Rs. Right now I'm on 4000S and I was well impressed with them. No flats yet with 2200 miles, and they roll very nicely - they seem fast, grippy, and solid in the turns. They also seem to get better with wear. You can't go wrong with either - P2R or 4000S.

cuski

Not sure what you find so funny... I can easily tell the difference between 4000S and the Gatorskins.

Psimet2001 

You don't ride fast enough.

Most of the comparisons between one tire and another have to do with how they feel on the road. True, the rolling resistance between one or another at this end of the spectrum is agruable at best, but the feel of the tire is undeniable.

The tires ride differently than each other. My way of describing the difference to to say that my experience with Contis is that they feel slow/sluggish.

You can discount how I feel on tires if you'd like. At the same time throw out those that claim they can feel a difference between a tubular or a clincher. I'm sure they'd understand.

If you are taking issue with my choice of terms for expressing the differences that I feel - that I overexaggerated how they feel "slow" to me, then I can agree with you to an extent. If I truly felt the Contis were crap I would have said as much. Instead I chose to express what I feel as a difference using descriptors that to you seem extreme. meh. To then suggest that I'm a fool for feeling a difference and trying to describe that difference is just....silly.

Don't think conti's have a problem with high rolling resistance on their 4000 series tires when compared to PR2/3? That's why they came out with the Chili compound....to directly address their higher rolling resistance....the perception by riders that the tires felt "slower".

At the same time Michelin pursued the PR3 to address the perceptions of poor grip with the PR2's.

FWIW - the rolling resistance between the PR2 and the 4000 were shown during some study and is floating around here somewhere. Without rememebring the specifics regarding the magnitude of the difference I do recall that the 4000 had a higher rolling resistance.

..........and something to keep in mind.....if I lose a race and can blame the tires....and not because of a flat......well....it'll never happen.

SushiJoe

OK it's late on a Friday and my brain is on pause.
The Chili tires felt slower or they were introduced because the older 4000s felt slower?

Psimet2001 

Latter. The older version was just a 4000. The "S" designates the Black Chili compound which was designed specifically to address the higher rolling resistance feeling of the 4000 when compared to the PR2.

Much anecdotal evidence backs up the claim that they have eliminated a lot of that feel through the use of the Black Chilli compound.....thus the reason for the thread in the first place - sorry cuda. I am assuming cuda wanted to really know if that feeling was solved with the "S".

yogi13

I've got PR2 on one bike, 4000s on another. I get better feel for the road with the PR2, and I feel faster on them, though that's awfully hard to confirm. It feels like the 4000s sidewalls aren't as compliant or something; I have more confidence cornering with the PR2, though I've never lost it in a corner with the 4000s. The pluses of the 4000s seem to be that they are more flat-resistant, less likely to suffer sidewall cuts, and now that I've got 900 miles on them, seem to get better as they age.

I haven't run PR3 yet, but if the prices are down to the low $30s at PBK, I might pick a few up.

woodduck

I have not ried the S version either. But, all the gp 3000-4000 I tired were horrible, like trying to pedal out of a bucket of wet cement.

pro race3 are fine for what they cost, good all rounders. Fell good, grip and don't flat much. For the price they are hard to beat.

garysol1 

Just to confuse..Last years black 4000 tire was not an "S" but had the Black Chili. The colored tires did not have the Chili compound last year.

Psimet2001 

FYI - PR3's feel VERY different than the PR2's. Myself and a riding buddy (colorchange) both switched at the same time and had the exact same impressions after the first ride: softer. Almost spongy feeling. Much grippier. Felt slower at first, but returned to that "fast" feeling as the started to wear a bit. FWIW

Psimet2001 

That's why I just say "look for the S" if you're shoosing Conti's. The possibility of not having the black chili would be unacceptable for me.

garysol1 

I also have a set of Maxxis Columbiere tires. They felt very good, much like a Black Chili 4000 but I cut one deep with only 100 miles on it. Could have been just one of those things. I need to buy another one and give them another try......

OC Roadie

I felt the same the first time I tried the Conti 4000's a year or so ago. I recently decided to give the 4000s a try. I really like these, they don't feel soft or sluggish anymore. I've been riding PR 2's for the last couple of years, and I like the 4000s better. I've never tried the PR 3s, so I can't compare. To me the Contis seem to corner better, and take a little longer to start getting cuts and squaring off.

garysol1 

The 3's do square off VERY fast. Less than 1,000 miles for me but the performance has not seemed to fall off much if at all.

Psimet2001 

+1 - I have found this to be the case as well. My PR3's squared off in less than 1,000 miles. Probably about 700-800. I weighed 175 at the time. Used for racing and training. I still am using the first set though. Even racing some great TT's and crits on them end of season. Best results to date. They now have about 1,800-2,000 miles on them. Maybe less.

Youngin

Chilis felt slow to me compared to my super cheap contis