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A dose of anti-cyclist rage

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A dose of anti-cyclist rage

Old 02-18-09, 11:43 AM
  #1  
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A dose of anti-cyclist rage

There was an article in the Seattle Times yesterday about a proposed new law requiring drivers to leave at least 3 feet of space when passing a cyclist. It's a law that is already in place in many states and is reasonable. Yet even in "bike friendly" Seattle there were dozens of people who posted malicious and angry comments to the online version of the article. I can't imagine why these people have so much pent up anger. Here are some gems:

1. "This is another ridiculous bill. Street lanes in Seattle or for that matter country hiways arent wide enough to handle large trucks and buses let alone going around a bike. ... Have you ever gone down hwy 202 or 203 at 55mph and had to come up on a cyclist with and oncoming log truck coming head on , sorry the bike is going to go because hitting a log truck head on isnt an option and neither is trying to stop at that speed. Byebye biker dude."

2. "I am not going to get into a head on collision to stay 3 ft away when passing. What a ludicrous proposal. In heavy traffic, it's an impossibility. The road are built for motor vehicles not bicyclisy out joyriding. Get the hell out my way!"

3. "Do you really think drivers are going to jump out with a measuring tape to be sure they're in compliance. This is stupidity personified. Keep your damned bicycles of the pavement and everything will be fine. Roads are meant for motorized vehicles, not childrens' bicycles."

4. "Let the bikers know that when they ride on the roads built for cars that it is dangerous and that they were built for cars first and foremost. That should be the rule. Bike's are much more manuverable than cars and can and should be able to stay a safe distance from cars. Now, one will argue that a bike is slower than a car and can't see what's coming from behind them. I say the biker's should learn how to see what's coming from behind them in that case."

5. "So you can go over the center stripe to provide the distance? What happens if there's another car there going the other way. Here's what's gonna happen: If I have a choice of hitting another car head-on, or running over a biker - guess what biker: SQUASHO!"
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Old 02-18-09, 11:45 AM
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this shouldn't be a surprise.
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Old 02-18-09, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Issaquatch View Post
3. "Do you really think drivers are going to jump out with a measuring tape to be sure they're in compliance."
If a similar bill passes here in Texas, I'm considering getting one of those orange flags on the long pole and laying it out sideways with the tip 3 feet from my bike. They don't have to jump out with a measuring tape.... I'll provide one.

The one point I pick up from those comments that the drivers seem to missing is this: IF there isn't enough room to leave 3 feet of room when passing a bike (because of oncoming traffic or whatever), then the driver will NOT be allowed to pass. They seem to take it as their inalienable right to pass a slower vehicle IMMEDIATELY. Hey drivers: Just chill, mmmkay?
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Old 02-18-09, 12:13 PM
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Another stupid law that can not be enforced...
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Old 02-18-09, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Doohickie View Post
If a similar bill passes here in Texas, I'm considering getting one of those orange flags on the long pole and laying it out sideways with the tip 3 feet from my bike. They don't have to jump out with a measuring tape.... I'll provide one.

...
Just watch out for when you are passing on the right !!

You might scratch up some cars ! hahaa
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Old 02-18-09, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Issaquatch View Post
The road are built for motor vehicles not bicyclisy out joyriding.
He's right... roads are definitely NOT made for bicyclisy joyrides. Bicycles, on the other hand... perhaps he should check his vehicle codes.

Although he did say "the road," so maybe there is a road specifically built for bicyclisy joyriding. LOL.
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Old 02-18-09, 12:26 PM
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I've ridden alot in Washington State

I think you guys like to think you are cycle friendly, but when it comes down to it, you're not any different from any other bunch of city slickers. All in a big hurry to go no place special

and you throw way to much glass out on the road

seriously, can't your high school kids drink beer out of cans like decent, red-blooded American kids? Does it have to be nothing but broken wine bottles on the run into every town up there?
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Old 02-18-09, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by iamtim View Post
so maybe there is a road specifically built for bicyclisy joyriding. LOL.
I always thought that was the Mt Baker Hwy up to Artist Point
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Old 02-18-09, 12:36 PM
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[quote=Issaquatch;8382659]
1. "This is another ridiculous bill. Street lanes in Seattle or for that matter country hiways arent wide enough to handle large trucks and buses let alone going around a bike. ... Have you ever gone down hwy 202 or 203 at 55mph and had to come up on a cyclist with and oncoming log truck coming head on , sorry the bike is going to go because hitting a log truck head on isnt an option and neither is trying to stop at that speed. Byebye biker dude."

"...trying to stop (or slowing down?) is not an option..."...sounds like the guys not in control of his vehicle.
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Old 02-18-09, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Issaquatch View Post
There was an article in the Seattle Times yesterday
I'd encourage you to go to the article and coments and read for yourself. From a quick perusal, there are some good counterpoints to the usual "moran" brigade, including:

1. "I think I figured it out. These same arguments and angry violent reactions keep coming out with every article about bikes in this paper. Most reasonable people read, nod, and say nothing while realizing there are some real morons out there on either side of the aisle.

By definition, these angry morons do not have the mental capacity to try and sympathize or try to find solutions to better the world around them. It's sad. Unfortunately, they are still allowed behind the wheel of a car (or in some cases, on a bike (less likely to kill someone other than themselves tho)). They're going to keep saying how much they'd love to get the chance to "accidentally" squish someone until the day they die. 1000 curses on you should you actually do it."

2. "It's sad that once again this comment section is filled with vitriol and ignorance from people who don't understand the law, seem to have little sense, and live with such overwhelming selfishness and hatred.

The proposed bill helps both motorists and bicyclists by specifying a minimum passing distance AND allowing motorists to legally cross the centerline in order to pass bicyclists by a safe distance."


It should be passed.
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Old 02-18-09, 12:40 PM
  #11  
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Michigan had a similar 3-foot law proposed, but it was omitted from the final version. The thinking was thus: If the law is enacted, it will only be enforceable if the car hits the cyclist; otherwise, the lawyers will try to argue that their client passed at 3'1" and not 2'11". Hitting the cyclist would prove non-compliance, but OTOH, that's already covered by the 'safe passing distance' language in the current traffic code. So in reality, a 3-foot law really wouldn't do anything to enhance cyclists' safety.

This year, the League of Michigan Bicyclists will be working with legislators to enact a law giving cyclists the same 'vulnerable road users' status as is currently enjoyed by road construction crews. Hit a cyclist, get a $15,000 fine and 5 years in jail.
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Old 02-18-09, 12:45 PM
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5. "So you can go over the center stripe to provide the distance? What happens if there's another car there going the other way. Here's what's gonna happen: If I have a choice of hitting another car head-on, or running over a biker - guess what biker: SQUASHO!"


...um...isn't there a 3rd option besides the choice of a headon collision and killing a biker? I guess that the Washington State DOT allows cars to operate without brakes?
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Old 02-18-09, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by veloGeezer View Post
I've ridden alot in Washington State

I think you guys like to think you are cycle friendly, but when it comes down to it, you're not any different from any other bunch of city slickers. All in a big hurry to go no place special

and you throw way to much glass out on the road

seriously, can't your high school kids drink beer out of cans like decent, red-blooded American kids? Does it have to be nothing but broken wine bottles on the run into every town up there?
I agree with you veloGeezer, which is why "bike friendly" was in quotes. It isn't much different here than in other places I've lived. In addition to the glass, we also have ridiculous amounts of gravel that never gets cleared off the roads, and the city recently installed a street car in downtown Seattle with tracks that are the perfect width to take out road bike tires...
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Old 02-18-09, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Randochap View Post
I'd encourage you to go to the article and coments and read for yourself. From a quick perusal, there are some good counterpoints to the usual "moran" brigade...
I agree. There are some good responses on the website. I just picked out the ones that made me shake my head the most.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:03 PM
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Washington and Washingtonians are hilarious. We pretend to be forward thinking liberal types who are "green", "outdoorsy", and who care for the environment, but our actions reveal our true selves.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by NYJayhawk View Post
5. "So you can go over the center stripe to provide the distance? What happens if there's another car there going the other way. Here's what's gonna happen: If I have a choice of hitting another car head-on, or running over a biker - guess what biker: SQUASHO!"


...um...isn't there a 3rd option besides the choice of a headon collision and killing a biker? I guess that the Washington State DOT allows cars to operate without brakes?
I was out riding yesterday and not one single driver even lifted off the gas before passing. I have been getting plenty of passing distance, which I appreciate. But I am just waiting for one of these idiots that give me distance and go into the other lane with traffic present to make contact. I've been seeing a lot of close calls. Every such incident that I've witnessed recently could have been avoided if the person would reduce their speed to the speed limit for a few seconds.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Issaquatch View Post
There was an article in the Seattle Times yesterday about a proposed new law requiring drivers to leave at least 3 feet of space when passing a cyclist. It's a law that is already in place in many states and is reasonable. Yet even in "bike friendly" Seattle there were dozens of people who posted malicious and angry comments to the online version of the article. I can't imagine why these people have so much pent up anger. Here are some gems:

1. "This is another ridiculous bill. Street lanes in Seattle or for that matter country hiways arent wide enough to handle large trucks and buses let alone going around a bike. ... Have you ever gone down hwy 202 or 203 at 55mph and had to come up on a cyclist with and oncoming log truck coming head on , sorry the bike is going to go because hitting a log truck head on isnt an option and neither is trying to stop at that speed. Byebye biker dude."

2. "I am not going to get into a head on collision to stay 3 ft away when passing. What a ludicrous proposal. In heavy traffic, it's an impossibility. The road are built for motor vehicles not bicyclisy out joyriding. Get the hell out my way!"

3. "Do you really think drivers are going to jump out with a measuring tape to be sure they're in compliance. This is stupidity personified. Keep your damned bicycles of the pavement and everything will be fine. Roads are meant for motorized vehicles, not childrens' bicycles."
4. "Let the bikers know that when they ride on the roads built for cars that it is dangerous and that they were built for cars first and foremost. That should be the rule. Bike's are much more manuverable than cars and can and should be able to stay a safe distance from cars. Now, one will argue that a bike is slower than a car and can't see what's coming from behind them. I say the biker's should learn how to see what's coming from behind them in that case."

5. "So you can go over the center stripe to provide the distance? What happens if there's another car there going the other way. Here's what's gonna happen: If I have a choice of hitting another car head-on, or running over a biker - guess what biker: SQUASHO!"

Actually, you'd be wrong. The roads were built first and foremost for horses and bikes and pedestrians, well before any mechanical vehicle was invented. "We" were here first, dude.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Issaquatch View Post
I agree. There are some good responses on the website. I just picked out the ones that made me shake my head the most.
Those attitudes are pretty universal in a car-crazed world.

I did a 600km brevet last August that went down "across the line" to Glacier, back up through Arlington, over to Bellingham, etc. The road surfaces and cleanliness put BC to shame (never been the same since maintenance was privatized!) but I must say we ran into an uncanny number of morons in black pickups and teenage ragers in muscle cars.

Not that we don't have our share, but it seemed like every one in the state was out that day.

BTW, in '05 I did a 400 that continued through Glacier and up to Artist's Point. It was over 80F and they'd just resurfaced the road. Beautiful, smooth pavement ... but what a stink! Tough climb. That got us to the 165km mark.

One motorcyclist that day got carried away on the decent and launched himself off a 300ft cliff at one of the upper hairpins. That was the end of him.

Beautiful place, especially Picture Lake. I used to teach my X-C ski classes there in the 80s.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:38 PM
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Do I really get to be the one to say:


A&S
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Old 02-18-09, 01:45 PM
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In France in the cities the law says, you can't pass with less than one meter. About three feet. In the country side it's 1.5 meters. Or almost five feet. And it is enforced. Well, randonmly at least; as are every other single law on any given juridisdictions domain.. And police do enforce it . Why would they not. Lots of police are cyclists both on the job and off.
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Old 02-18-09, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by gfrance View Post
Actually, you'd be wrong. The roads were built first and foremost for horses and bikes and pedestrians, well before any mechanical vehicle was invented. "We" were here first, dude.
Not really; unless the road you live on hasn't been changed since the early 1900s, it will have been built and designed for automobiles.

Either way, none of the roads around where I live are (is? i hate grammar...) wide enough for someone to pass me without leaving the lane - considering the fact that I ride about two feet into the lane, and people have to pass in the oncoming lane. I'm lucky in that traffic is extremely directional on the roads I ride on, i.e. everybody's going northbound in the afternoon and there are very few southbound cars they have to yield to, and vise versa in the morning.
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Old 02-18-09, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by SoreFeet View Post
Another stupid law that can not be enforced...
Perhaps its difficult to enforce, but not impossible. If an officer observes an unsafe pass, he can ticket the driver, and in the event of an accident, it provides a clear basis to cite the motorist.

But more important is the educational opportunity. Many motorists think its their right to pass you at any time regardless of whether it can be safely done.

The law gives a concrete standard which any reasonable person can understand, and will hopefully make some drivers better undertand their obligation around bicyclists. Particularly new drivers that will be instructed on the statute in driver's education, and tested on it on their driving test.

The law's no panacea, but it's a tool, and with some advocacy/education efforts by the Cycling community it can help.
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Old 02-18-09, 03:24 PM
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the thing about this law, if it passes, is that 95% of drivers will never hear about it..
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Old 02-18-09, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mattm View Post
the thing about this law, if it passes, is that 95% of drivers will never hear about it..
And the 5% the do will ignore it anyway.

Nothing is going to change until riders HTFU, band together and start lynching aggressive drivers.
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Old 02-18-09, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mattm View Post
the thing about this law, if it passes, is that 95% of drivers will never hear about it..
And the other 5% read about it here on BF.
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