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Looking at a new frame - DeRosa King, Super 6, Prince, or 586

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Looking at a new frame - DeRosa King, Super 6, Prince, or 586

Old 04-26-09, 09:07 PM
  #1  
foresthill
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Looking at a new frame - DeRosa King, Super 6, Prince, or 586

I'm currently riding a 2006 Specialized Roubaix Expert frame. It's been great, and I've got no specific complaints with it, but an unexpectedly good tax return has me contemplating a new frame. (I'm very happy with my components and wheels and will be transferring them to the new frame.)

I went into my LBS, and for the price point I mentioned (< $5k), here are the ones they recommended based on what they carry. This LBS has treated me very well, so I'd really like to buy the frame from them:

DeRosa King
Cannondale Super 6
Pinnarello Prince
Look 586 (they don't stock this, but can order it.)

I'll be bringing my bike in this week to get geometries and see which one is likely to fit me the best depending on sizes offered and the like.

I don't race, but do ride a fair bit year round (100 - 200 miles/week usually.)

Anyone have any suggestions or things to look out for in particular?

Thanks!
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Old 04-26-09, 09:33 PM
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I have not ridden this but it looks so sexy:


I have ridden the Cannondale Super 6 equipped with Di2 and I will say that it was a cookie-cutter "nice bike". It had a relatively relaxed geometry (not as much as a Roubaix) and felt a lot stiffer--although heavier--than my Bianchi. I'm not sure if I would like it as much when climbing because it seemed sluggish at times for some reason (had Dura Ace 7850 clinchers). The Super 6 was not inspiring enough to make me want to pay MSRP for it. If I were coming from a Roubaix, I think I'd be disappointed.

CC has a demo program and 3 of their bikes are the Pinarello Prince, the Cervelo S2, and the BMC Pro Machine. I actually plan on renting a bike next time I am out of state on vacation just to mess around with a high-end bike for a week and I am thinking either the Prince or S2. If you are willing to cough up $300, it might be an option for you to check out those 3 high-end models by demoing them.
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Old 04-26-09, 09:50 PM
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Cannondale's out.

It is definitely between the LOOK, DeRosa, and Pinarello.
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Old 04-26-09, 09:53 PM
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I also agree that the Cannondale is "light" compared to the other frames you're considering. I think the Super and even the LOOK are tailored better for racing than striking an equilibrium between racing and comfort, like the Pinarello and the De Rosa.

I know that you're only buying the frame, but maybe a test ride's in order here?
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Old 04-26-09, 09:57 PM
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Yeah, I should be able to test all of them except the Look. As far as I know, there's nobody in town that stocks them.

(test, as in, keep it overnight and do a real ride on it)

Last edited by foresthill; 04-26-09 at 10:52 PM.
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Old 04-26-09, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by foresthill View Post
Yeah, I should be able to test all of them except the Look. As far as I know, there's nobody in town that stocks them.
Those are all really awesome bikes. If you can't really tell a difference after riding them--and try to convince your lbs that you deserve to ride around for more than a loop around the parking lot--I would get the one that simply excites you the most.
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Old 04-26-09, 10:21 PM
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If you haven't already tried a Tarmac SL2, I think you should. You can get it with regular geometry or in team geometry (which has a shorter head tube). It's what I'll be buying as soon as I save a few more pennies. Of course, if my budget were $5k, I'd have a really hard look at the Wilier Cento1...but I'd probably still get the Tarmac and a set of HED Stinger 6s for that $5k.
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Old 04-26-09, 10:27 PM
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i have a great bike but i have 5k to burn ... adopt a family of starving children??
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Old 04-26-09, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by deadly downtube View Post
i have a great bike but i have 5k to burn ... adopt a family of starving children??
Guess it wouldn't be BF without one of those. What are you following a script or something?

(FWIW, I give lots of money to what I believe are worthy causes that help people, but that's hardly relevant to this thread.)

Thanks for the feedback so far, folks. I appreciate it.

This is likely my last bike for a very long time, so I'm sure I'll agonize over the decision a whole lot.
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Old 04-27-09, 12:12 AM
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I haven't ridden any of them, so take my opinion for what it is worth...nothing! I'd get the De Rosa!
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Old 04-27-09, 01:23 AM
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Originally Posted by twoflats View Post
If you haven't already tried a Tarmac SL2, I think you should. You can get it with regular geometry or in team geometry (which has a shorter head tube). It's what I'll be buying as soon as I save a few more pennies. Of course, if my budget were $5k, I'd have a really hard look at the Wilier Cento1...but I'd probably still get the Tarmac and a set of HED Stinger 6s for that $5k.
+1 I agreee w/ TwoFlats.
I recently tested the Look 586 and the FP3 [Although FP3 is a different carbon, the geometry is the same] . Anyway, I can't really justify the difference b/w the Look and the FP3.

Now, however, about a month ago I did have an opportunity to test ride the SL2 [2009 version-very improtant and very differnt--I'm sure UMD can explain] and if my memory serve me right, the SL2 was alot smoother and quicker on the sprint / initial crank force.

Overall, it isjust my 2cents. If you have the $$ why not open up more options.
FWIW
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Old 04-27-09, 06:18 AM
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Personally, I would choose the Look 595 instead of the 586. Again, just a personal choice and bias since I own one. The Prince has extremely good reviews, which are better than the DeRosa. Take that from someone that loves all things DeRosa. The Ridley above as well as the Time RXR would be other very very good choices. In the end, I would tell you to choose the one that appeals to you aesthetically since they are all beyond great!!
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Old 04-27-09, 06:28 AM
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pinarello. just because.
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Old 04-27-09, 06:55 AM
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+1 Pinarello
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Old 04-27-09, 07:47 AM
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Pay attention to the geometry. The Roubaix has a tall head tube that make it easy to produce a tall bar height. If you need that, most of your proposed frames may create a fit problem or a dorky looking stem/spacer setup. I'd figure that out FIRST. If you can get the bike setup to fit, then give it consideration.

When you move into the $5K range I would never buy a prebuilt bike. I'd build one from scratch and get the exact components that I wanted (including Campy 11 speed).

Rather than a LOOK 586, consider a leftover LOOK 585 Ultra frame for $2200. IMO, $4K for a 586 is too much, although you might find a leftover 586 for $3K.
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Old 04-27-09, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS View Post
Pay attention to the geometry. The Roubaix has a tall head tube that make it easy to produce a tall bar height. If you need that, most of your proposed frames may create a fit problem or a dorky looking stem/spacer setup. I'd figure that out FIRST. If you can get the bike setup to fit, then give it consideration.

When you move into the $5K range I would never buy a prebuilt bike. I'd build one from scratch and get the exact components that I wanted (including Campy 11 speed).

Rather than a LOOK 586, consider a leftover LOOK 585 Ultra frame for $2200. IMO, $4K for a 586 is too much, although you might find a leftover 586 for $3K.
OP is just looking for the frameset; he already stated he likes his components and wheels.
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Old 04-27-09, 08:37 AM
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get your LBS to start carrying Wilier, then order a Cento Uno from them

no but seriously I'd probably go with the Look
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Old 04-27-09, 08:57 AM
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Pinarello Prince
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Old 04-27-09, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by kimconyc View Post
OP is just looking for the frameset; he already stated he likes his components and wheels.
I've got a bad habit of not reading closely enough. In that case, spending over $3K on a frame is usually way into the range of diminishing returns for the money, but everyone has to set the limit for themselves. I've built both of my LOOK 585 bikes for not much more than $5K with Campy 11 speed. I'd rather have a whole bike than an overpriced frame.

I'm not sure I'd put those old parts on a new frame. Some may not fit depending on the FD clamp needs and how the reach of the new frame affects the stem length. The old bike might resell better if it was complete.
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Old 04-27-09, 09:49 AM
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Look at Parlee and Crumpton also in this price range.
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Old 04-27-09, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS View Post
I've got a bad habit of not reading closely enough. In that case, spending over $3K on a frame is usually way into the range of diminishing returns for the money, but everyone has to set the limit for themselves. I've built both of my LOOK 585 bikes for not much more than $5K with Campy 11 speed. I'd rather have a whole bike than an overpriced frame.

I'm not sure I'd put those old parts on a new frame. Some may not fit depending on the FD clamp needs and how the reach of the new frame affects the stem length. The old bike might resell better if it was complete.
I'll get a new FD or stem if necessary. My SRAM red stuff is all 2008. DV46Cs are the best wheels I've ever had and I'm not getting rid of them for anything.

I'll be selling my existing frame to a ride partner cheap. It'll be a nice upgrade from his current ride (probably drop a pound or two at least!), and he wouldn't be able to afford it otherwise.
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Old 04-27-09, 10:55 AM
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In that case, it seems that you need to look at potential geometry problems, as I suggested in my first post. The new frame must fit or it's not a wise move. There are also differences in the steering geometry that would affect my decision.

One of my objections to the LOOK 586 or 595 is the integrated seatpost. They are a pain to make small height adjustments and the post has a single bolt clamp with limited angle adjustment. That and the much lower cost led me to the 585. My 585 Ultra for $2K was a bargain.
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Old 04-27-09, 11:52 AM
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DeRosa King!!!! Dare to be different...lol

plus that bike is BAD ASS!!!
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Old 04-27-09, 01:40 PM
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Went by and got my current bike and position measured and analyzed this morning. They should be calling me back today or tomorrow with a list of what would fit best, and what they would have in stock now vs what might take a little while.

As far as adjustment of the seatmast, i would be concerned were it not for the owner of the shop, who's a fit guru and will definitely make sure that whatever I get is able to be properly adjusted for me. The current integrated seatmast stuff looks like it's a lot better in that area than just a year or two ago. I'm not so worried about resale value. By the time I'd be looking at selling this frame, I wouldn't be able to get much for it anyway.

Initial thoughts after reading some reviews and feedback here are starting to lean toward the DeRosa, but actually riding the bikes is obviously going to be the key.
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Old 04-27-09, 06:36 PM
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Buy this. Take it from a guy who did.
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