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looking to upgrade front Derailleur

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looking to upgrade front Derailleur

Old 04-27-09, 01:07 PM
  #1  
kaitanium
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looking to upgrade front Derailleur

im wanting to change out my sora front derailleur on my 08 allez as it hangs too much for my enjoyment ( i suppose i can get around this by shifting earlier before i hit a hill...) and want something faster.

i was looking at the ultegra SL (unless there is a better choice at that price range) and was confused by model numbers. whats the difference between GB and GF and 6600 vs 6603? also stated to be a 10spd item but my allez is 9 speed can it work? i havent upgraded my drivetrain on my bike so i know almost nill about this. shimano website isnt insanely helpful either.

eventually id imagine i swap all parts on my allez to ultegra.
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Old 04-27-09, 01:09 PM
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I got a Dura-Ace 7700 (9 speed) FD on ebay recently for $26.
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Old 04-27-09, 01:20 PM
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The 6600 vs. 6603 designation is for double vs. triple compatible front derailleurs.

There should be no practical difference between a 9 and 10-speed front derailleur.

All that said, front derailleurs are really simple devices; I've never encountered a front derailleur that shifts very well under load.
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Old 04-27-09, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by KevinF View Post
All that said, front derailleurs are really simple devices; I've never encountered a front derailleur that shifts very well under load.
hmm i expected this in the back of my head...i guess i should follow gut instead of trusting advertisement! maybe ill save that cash to get myself a new crankset as i have heard these stock sugino comps have a tendency to crack....

so what about shifters? if its for a triple (i understand this part. aka ultegra ST-6603) but it also says 10spd...will that be able to control my 9spd or will it just throw my chain off the cassette?
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Old 04-27-09, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by kaitanium View Post
hmm i expected this in the back of my head...i guess i should follow gut instead of trusting advertisement! maybe ill save that cash to get myself a new crankset as i have heard these stock sugino comps have a tendency to crack....

so what about shifters? if its for a triple (i understand this part. aka ultegra ST-6603) but it also says 10spd...will that be able to control my 9spd or will it just throw my chain off the cassette?
Shifters are indexed and have a certain number of "clicks". You need to match the shifter and cassette.
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Old 04-27-09, 01:35 PM
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i disagree with kevin, i have a sora equipped bike, and the FD never worked quite right for me. i swapped it out with an ultegra piece and the difference is more than noticable, it works great now, for the price, it is well worth the upgrade, and a very simple install.

as for model numbers, i cant speak directly to the two you mentioned, but remember there are three variations in fd's

triple vs doubme; braze on vs clamp on.
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Old 04-27-09, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Tristan86 View Post
Shifters are indexed and have a certain number of "clicks". You need to match the shifter and cassette.
oh great. i guess this will be more expensive as i practically have to upgrade the entire drivetrain then....
upgrading shifter means i need to upgrade cassette, which means i need to upgrade rear deraileur...which means LOL.

Originally Posted by AngryScientist View Post

triple vs doubme; braze on vs clamp on.
and whats the difference between braze and clamp? i know i am aiming for a triple
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Old 04-27-09, 01:54 PM
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braze on dr's get screwed directly into a boss brazed onto the frame, clamp on dr's literally use a band style clamp onto the frame.
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Old 05-05-09, 02:48 PM
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hmm i see.

so if i want to upgrade my shifters (to an ultegra) ill need to upgrade my 9spd cassette to 10spd, which means the tiagra deraileur needs to go since its only 9 speed. upgrading one thing means i gotta open a can of worms to upgrade the rest since mines a stock 9speed!
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Old 05-05-09, 02:55 PM
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the RD you don't have to worry about, it can do 10sp no problem. it doesn't need to be changed.

the FD you should get a 9sp FD because a 10sp FD is narrower and can lead to rubbing in previous gears where there were none.

pretty simply, you should readjust your FD and make sure it has proper cable tension if you feel the shifting is sloppy.
if it's still sloppy, probably time for a new chain and possibly cassette if the teeth are worn out.
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Old 05-05-09, 03:00 PM
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If you've got a triple make sure you get a triple FD. 10/9 speed rear is fine.

Just make sure your shifters match how many gears you have. Triple or double front, and 8/9/10 speed rear.
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Old 05-05-09, 10:50 PM
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IMHO a Tiagra FD is a good compromise. Much better than Sora, and hardly any worse than 105 or Ultegra. The good thing is that the cage is wider than the 10-speed ones and you never have to trim the FD to avoid the chain rubbing.
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Old 05-07-09, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by AEO View Post
the RD you don't have to worry about, it can do 10sp no problem. it doesn't need to be changed.

the FD you should get a 9sp FD because a 10sp FD is narrower and can lead to rubbing in previous gears where there were none.

wait are we mixed up here...i want to upgrade to an ultegra RD but they are 10spds? hence why i have to change cassettes and why i have to change my sora shifters...like a chain reaction. currently i have a sora FD triple/tiagra RD 9spd combo....stock as it came on my 08 allez. are you saying my tiagra rated at 9spd can do 10spd?

changing from a 9 to 10 spd cassette is doable right? dont need new wheels or anything? i suppose the gear discs are just placed together closer?

so my logic here in terms of stages of upgrading:
1st upgrade - change out FD to ultegra
2nd upgrade - change out cassette to 10spd, change out tiagra RD to ultegra, change out shifters to ultegra
3rd upgrade - change out crank to ultegra triple

Last edited by kaitanium; 05-07-09 at 12:40 PM.
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Old 05-07-09, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by kaitanium View Post
wait are we mixed up here...i want to upgrade to an ultegra RD but they are 10spds? hence why i have to change cassettes and why i have to change my sora shifters...like a chain reaction/.

currently i have a sora FD triple/tiagra RD 9spd combo....stock as it came on my 08 allez


so im looking to take the drivetrain to an ultegra group. i want to stay a triple crank so i suppose i can get the FD first in an ultegra triple compatible FD.


changing from a 9 to 10 spd cassette is doable right? dont need new wheels or anything? i suppose the gear discs are just placed together closer?

so help me with my logic here in terms of stages of upgrading:
1st upgrade - change out FD to ultegra
2nd upgrade - change out cassette to 10spd, change out tiagra RD to ultegra, change out shifters to ultegra
3rd upgrade - change out crank to ultegra triple
You can upgrade your RD to Ultegra but you don't have to. The same RD can do 8, 9 or 10 speed cassettes as the amount of RD travel is controlled by the movement of the cable which is controlled by your shifters.
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Old 05-07-09, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by kaitanium View Post
wait are we mixed up here...i want to upgrade to an ultegra RD but they are 10spds? hence why i have to change cassettes and why i have to change my sora shifters...like a chain reaction/.

currently i have a sora FD triple/tiagra RD 9spd combo....stock as it came on my 08 allez


so im looking to take the drivetrain to an ultegra group. i want to stay a triple crank so i suppose i can get the FD first in an ultegra triple compatible FD.


changing from a 9 to 10 spd cassette is doable right? dont need new wheels or anything? i suppose the gear discs are just placed together closer?
You don't have to change anything else to run a 10spd RD with 9spd Shimano stuff just set your limits correctly and you are good to go. I am running an ultegra sl 10spd RD with my 9spd ultegra shifters/chain/cassette shifts perfect.

As previously mentioned you shouldn't use a 10 spd FD with 9spd chain because you will rub. First hand experience here as well. 9spd FD with 10spd, works fine.

Oh and I shouldn't need to say it but the chain and cassette should be the same, 9 or 10 speed.

Lastly you the hub bodies for Shimano 9spd and 10spd are the same so you don't need to change the wheels.
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Old 05-07-09, 03:37 PM
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The chain on a 10 speed is more narrow than a 9 speed chain. because the cogs on the cassette are closer together on a 10 speed verses a 9 speed. The small ring should lso be changed to a 10 speed specific one. the space between the rings is narrower on a 10 speed setup. the teeth on the small ring are off set towards the large ring to keep the chain from getting stuck between the chain rings.

To go from 9 speed to 10 speed you will need. shifter(s) at least right side. front derailure( cage spacing is different) . small front chain ring. chain. cassette.
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Old 05-07-09, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by ls01 View Post
The chain on a 10 speed is more narrow than a 9 speed chain. because the cogs on the cassette are closer together on a 10 speed verses a 9 speed. The small ring should lso be changed to a 10 speed specific one. the space between the rings is narrower on a 10 speed setup. the teeth on the small ring are off set towards the large ring to keep the chain from getting stuck between the chain rings.

To go from 9 speed to 10 speed you will need. shifter(s) at least right side. front derailure( cage spacing is different) . small front chain ring. chain. cassette.
I went from 9 spd Ultegra to 10sp DA and did not change my rings or FD.....I've had no problems
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Old 05-08-09, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by ls01 View Post
To go from 9 speed to 10 speed you will need. shifter(s) at least right side. front derailure( cage spacing is different) . small front chain ring. chain. cassette.
i think this is what i needed. i plan to upgrade my shifters anyways i as i find i ride my drops more and i cant downshift with my sora shifters without getting up. if i swap for a say an ultegra SL triple setup for both shifters, the left will be able to control my current triple crank right?

"small front chain ring" - i currently have the stock sugino triple crank...what needs to be changed here? kinda mixed info here with the latest responses.

my hub is a white industries H2, doesnt say on their site but ill take your word for it that i can take a 10spd cassette

this thread has been extremely helpful to me!!
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Old 05-08-09, 05:25 PM
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My 3403 sora FD shifts better than my 6503 FD, but I'm sure a 6603 FS would better both of them.
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Old 05-08-09, 07:57 PM
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Get a better crank or just chainrings with more ramps and pins.

I upgraded my crank and BB to tiagra on the same kind of bike and they worked great, even before I got other shifters.
The FD is pretty simple. you can shift your front gears with a stick if you had to.
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Old 05-08-09, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Razorhoof View Post
Get a better crank or just chainrings with more ramps and pins.

I upgraded my crank and BB to tiagra on the same kind of bike and they worked great, even before I got other shifters.
I had the same experience. My bike came with a Sora 3403 front derailleur and an FSA Omega crankset. I installed a Tiagra 4503 crankset and the shifting between rings is much quicker and smoother.

OP, what crankset does your bike have?
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Old 05-08-09, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by kaitanium View Post
i think this is what i needed. i plan to upgrade my shifters anyways...

...i currently have the stock sugino triple crank...what needs to be changed here? kinda mixed info here with the latest responses.
What bike do you have?

If it's an entry level bike like mine, I suggest not changing much as you might end up like me, not so much wanting nicer components but wanting a nicer frameset.. and that means wanting a completely different bike. Which often means selling your current bike which means you either remove your upgrade parts from the bike or you sell them with the bike and take a greater loss.

Try to change only those parts that can be easily removed and if you change shifters, try not to spend too much as you'll probably be reluctant to remove those shifters if you sell the bike as changing shifters is a time-consuming chore.
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Old 05-11-09, 03:15 PM
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practically a stock '08 spec. allez triple except for the brakes (upped to 105s), custom wheels, pedals and added aerobars.

yea i doubt i will be selling this bike. im not the type of guy to want the best thing. take my instruments for example, my guitar and bass and what not...i bought the most mediocre instrument so i could play it. sure the more expensive ones soundd better and are easier to play but i never looked back on my purchase or regretted it. same way goes with my bike. those orcas and those tarmacs sure look nice but oh well. even with my MTB, i have a 02 hardrock and im still loving it...but yea those stumpjumpers sure are crazy! im satisfied with mine haha
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Old 05-11-09, 05:20 PM
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Chances are you have the sugino comp, which compared to a 105 or ultegra crank is a POS. Go down and test an 09 allez elite and check out the FD shifting, and compare the ramps and pins to yours.
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Old 06-18-09, 11:39 AM
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sorry to resurrect this thread but ive been doing alot more research here and there.

quick question: are sram components compatible with shimano stuff if i want to mix my parts? such as sram force shifters controlling an ultegra SL FD? i want a tripe crank but sram seems to have only doubles i would love to stick with just sram as their groups are lighter (and cheaper per gram shaved off) but really want a triple crank and dont mind carrying the extra weight of that...
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