Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Pcad Dura Ace 7900 Wrap Up

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Pcad Dura Ace 7900 Wrap Up

Old 07-01-09, 08:14 PM
  #76  
patentcad
Peloton Shelter Dog
Thread Starter
 
patentcad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Chester, NY
Posts: 90,508

Bikes: 2017 Scott Foil, 2016 Scott Addict SL, 2018 Santa Cruz Blur CC MTB

Mentioned: 74 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1140 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 19 Posts
Originally Posted by RoadToNowhere View Post
Wow.
You know when you leave something for a while.. and you return, and nothing has changed.... and there's some weird comfort in that?

Pcad, I've missed you

Beth
But you had escaped. Why would you ever come back to this place? Isn't that like breaking back into prison?
patentcad is offline  
Old 07-01-09, 08:18 PM
  #77  
RoadToNowhere
mamafitz
 
RoadToNowhere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Near Hershey...TMI...not in Central PA ;)
Posts: 1,878

Bikes: Serotta CDA, Cannondale R800, mid-80's Bianchi hybrid

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
But you had escaped. Why would you ever come back to this place? Isn't that like breaking back into prison?
Like moths to a flame......
RoadToNowhere is offline  
Old 07-01-09, 09:45 PM
  #78  
umd
Banned
 
umd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 28,387

Bikes: Specialized Tarmac SL2, Specialized Tarmac SL, Giant TCR Composite, Specialized StumpJumper Expert HT

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Howzit View Post
Why go from good to worse when you can go better with Campy?
SRAM is junk. If it wasnt American no one would buy that junk.
Epic Fail

Originally Posted by Howzit View Post
I havent ridden it, so I guess its not a fair statement.
Epic Stupid
umd is offline  
Old 07-01-09, 10:34 PM
  #79  
halfspeed
Senior Member
 
halfspeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE Minnesota
Posts: 12,275

Bikes: are better than yours.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by coasting View Post
why didn't shimano shifters come with shimano cables? when i bought 105 shifters they came with the sis cables. seems odd if they come as a set.
Cervelo doesn't buy retail packages.

Originally Posted by patentcad View Post

They rely on Pcad, The Voice of BF Reason, to bridge the chasm.
We're in BIG trouble.

Originally Posted by roadwarrior View Post
The difference is, I'm correct. And for the record, I'm actually listed as "independent". I don't need anyone to tell me how to think. Especially someone in the f****ng government.

Case in point, I hear things are going well in Albany these days...this is what happens when lunatics get to be in charge.

I'm listed as an 'independent' too and for the same reasons. But with all due respect, I still think you're full of crap.

Originally Posted by UGASkiDawg View Post
California does NOT have anything remotely approaching a revenue problem.......

https://reason.org/news/show/1007038.html

back to your regularly scheduled programming
Now there's an objective source.

Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
What the F isn't made in Taiwan these days?
Super Record of course!
__________________
Telemachus has, indeed, sneezed.
halfspeed is offline  
Old 07-01-09, 11:36 PM
  #80  
mvMcfly
Not as fast as I was
 
mvMcfly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 169
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
What the F isn't made in Taiwan these days?
You know all the best stuff is made in Japan

mvMcfly is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 01:17 AM
  #81  
botto 
.
 
botto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 40,375
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 25 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by Jynx View Post
better in what sense? shimano already has better shifting.
better than 7800.
botto is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 03:24 AM
  #82  
roadwarrior
Senior Member
 
roadwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Someplace trying to figure it out
Posts: 10,664

Bikes: Cannondale EVO, CAAD9, Giant cross bike.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by halfspeed View Post
I'm listed as an 'independent' too and for the same reasons. But with all due respect, I still think you're full of crap.
With all due respect, I don't care what you think. But thanks for your input.

roadwarrior is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 03:28 AM
  #83  
roadwarrior
Senior Member
 
roadwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Someplace trying to figure it out
Posts: 10,664

Bikes: Cannondale EVO, CAAD9, Giant cross bike.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by RichinPeoria View Post
RoadWarrior and botto are your sock puppets anyhow so what does it matter

botto, Pcad and I are what you dream of becoming every waking moment of your life.

But you'll never get there.

roadwarrior is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 05:02 AM
  #84  
patentcad
Peloton Shelter Dog
Thread Starter
 
patentcad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Chester, NY
Posts: 90,508

Bikes: 2017 Scott Foil, 2016 Scott Addict SL, 2018 Santa Cruz Blur CC MTB

Mentioned: 74 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1140 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 19 Posts
Originally Posted by roadwarrior View Post

But you'll never get there.
You don't want to get there.
patentcad is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 06:30 AM
  #85  
kwrides
Senior Member
 
kwrides's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 3,198

Bikes: 2007 Orbea Onix, 2007 Windsor The Hour, 2008 Kona Jake

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by RichinPeoria View Post
I cant be a shill since I am in no way associated or compensated in any way by Campagnolo.

I just know their stuff is the best and I want to tell everybody!

lets review

Shill
-wiki
A shill is an associate of a person selling goods or services or a political group, who pretends no association to the seller/group and assumes the air of an enthusiastic customer. The intention of the shill is, using crowd psychology, to encourage others unaware of the set-up to purchase said goods or services or support the political group's ideological claims. Shills are often employed by confidence artists. The term plant is also used. Shill bidding, found on many auction sites such as eBay, is punishable by law[1] and may result in fines and or prosecution.
Shilling is illegal in many circumstances and in many jurisdictions because of the frequently fraudulent and damaging character of their actions. However, if a shill does not place uninformed parties at a risk of loss, but merely generates "buzz", the shill's actions may be legal. For example, a person planted in an audience to laugh and applaud when desired (see claque), or to participate in on-stage activities as a "random member of the audience", is a type of legal shill.
"Shill" can also be used pejoratively to describe a critic who appears either all-too-eager to heap glowing praise upon mediocre offerings, or who acts as an apologist for glaring flaws. In this sense, they would be an implicit "shill" for the industry at large, possibly because their income is tied to its prosperity
Nice job using "THE" sentence in a post.
kwrides is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 06:43 AM
  #86  
UGASkiDawg
Senior Member
 
UGASkiDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Denver
Posts: 928
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by halfspeed View Post

Now there's an objective source.


It the source wrong? Nothing but the facts.
UGASkiDawg is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 06:54 AM
  #87  
halfspeed
Senior Member
 
halfspeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE Minnesota
Posts: 12,275

Bikes: are better than yours.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by roadwarrior View Post
With all due respect, I don't care what you think. But thanks for your input.

Correct!
__________________
Telemachus has, indeed, sneezed.
halfspeed is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 07:04 AM
  #88  
Banzai
Jet Jockey
 
Banzai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: St. Paul, MN
Posts: 4,941

Bikes: Cannondale CAAD9, Ritchey Breakaway Cross, Nashbar X-frame bike, Bike Friday Haul-a-Day, Surly Pugsley.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 382 Post(s)
Liked 29 Times in 25 Posts
Back on topic...I remember reading somewhere after the release of 7900 that the engineers at Shimano were adamant about their traditional cable routing (the arcs outside of the handlebar wrap) providing better shifting; this is due to fewer bends in the cable. They changed it mainly because cyclists simply wanted under-the-wrap routing, no matter what that may do for function.
__________________
Good night...and good luck
Banzai is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 07:59 AM
  #89  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,910

Bikes: Cinelli superstar disc, two Yoeleo R12

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 901 Post(s)
Liked 464 Times in 373 Posts
Originally Posted by KiddSisko View Post
For the cost of one Campy S Record crank, you can buy an entire Sram Rival groupset.
Apples and oranges?

Bought from the right source, you can get comparable quality and capability at a similar price with Campy products. You should be comparing Campy Centaur to that low level SRAM.

I know it's popular to perpetuate the Campy-is-expensive myth, but it's just not true. Resale value, longevity of the components and the ability to make repairs all need to be considered.

When I moved on to 11 speed, I sold 2 year old Record shifters for $140 (with a new cable set) and got new Record 11 shifters (with cables) for $240. My 5 year old Record RD brought me $95 and I only paid about $180 when new. The cost of ownership on all of my 10 speed parts was quite low.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 10:33 AM
  #90  
PipinFan
Senior Member
 
PipinFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,296

Bikes: 2007 Orbea Onix TDF,2008 Orbea Orca in Red

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
After five months on this stuff my impressions:

• It's lighter, I like the new esthetics, I like the hidden cables on the bars.

• I like the new brifter hood shape very much, better than the old style

• At first I wasn't impressed with the shifting. A recent upgrade to Shimano SIS cables made a huge difference, now I like it. The lever throw however is longer than it was with 7800, and I consider that a negative. That being said, once you get used to it, 7900 shifts flawlessly.

• The brakes are by far the best bicycle brakes I've used. Noticeably more effective.

Overall, very satisfied, much more so since the cable upgrade. That's key. Many OEM bikes ship with cheaper cables (the Cervelo did). The Shimano reps say the SIS cables are important, they appear to be correct. I do like the fact that I was able to incorporate the 7800 bubble indicator on the 7900 cables. If you can find a spot on your bike where that would be visible, it's not hard to do.
Thanks for the info... how do you compare the DA 7900 with Sram Red? have you experienced Sram? I love Shimano but I think I will give Sram a chance next..
PipinFan is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 11:08 AM
  #91  
UGASkiDawg
Senior Member
 
UGASkiDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Denver
Posts: 928
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by DaveSSS View Post
Apples and oranges?



I know it's popular to perpetuate the Campy-is-expensive myth, but it's just not true. Resale value, longevity of the components and the ability to make repairs all need to be considered.

When I moved on to 11 speed, I sold 2 year old Record shifters for $140 (with a new cable set) and got new Record 11 shifters (with cables) for $240. My 5 year old Record RD brought me $95 and I only paid about $180 when new. The cost of ownership on all of my 10 speed parts was quite low.
These things are all true of Shimano and SRAM as well. You got screwed on your resale of Record shifters. I sold some 7800 shifters for $195 without cables. Campy still costs more to begin with than either Shimano or SRAM (at comparable levels) and you can resell both of those if you want to upgrade. The facts are that Campy charges a premium for a product that performs essentially exactly the same as the other two. If you want to pay that premium...go ahead but some people don't want to. I like DA (7800 at least) better than Red but that's just a personal preference and many differ. Shimano also charges a premium over SRAM so.....

The simple facts are that from a pure value standpoint SRAM is the best deal out there right now.

I'm not a racer so my bike is both a jewel and a tool so I am sometime willing to pay for something just for the snob appeal....but I like DA better than Record so and think it functions better....but that's just my opinion and only worth what you paid for it
UGASkiDawg is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 02:12 PM
  #92  
patentcad
Peloton Shelter Dog
Thread Starter
 
patentcad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Chester, NY
Posts: 90,508

Bikes: 2017 Scott Foil, 2016 Scott Addict SL, 2018 Santa Cruz Blur CC MTB

Mentioned: 74 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1140 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 19 Posts
Originally Posted by PipinFan View Post
Thanks for the info... how do you compare the DA 7900 with Sram Red? have you experienced Sram? I love Shimano but I think I will give Sram a chance next..
I've only ridden Sram Red around the block, I think I could get used to it. I'd give it a chance. But my overall impression is that it's lower quality than the D.A.(also that of my LBS), and I hear mixed reviews from users and mechanics on it. Some love it, some not so much.
patentcad is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 04:10 PM
  #93  
KiddSisko
Has coddling tendencies.
 
KiddSisko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Topanga Canyon
Posts: 8,360

Bikes: 2008 Blue RC8 w/ '09 Rival

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 8 Posts
Originally Posted by DaveSSS View Post
Apples and oranges?

Bought from the right source, you can get comparable quality and capability at a similar price with Campy products. You should be comparing Campy Centaur to that low level SRAM.

I know it's popular to perpetuate the Campy-is-expensive myth, but it's just not true. Resale value, longevity of the components and the ability to make repairs all need to be considered.

When I moved on to 11 speed, I sold 2 year old Record shifters for $140 (with a new cable set) and got new Record 11 shifters (with cables) for $240. My 5 year old Record RD brought me $95 and I only paid about $180 when new. The cost of ownership on all of my 10 speed parts was quite low.
"that low level SRAM" Hmph!
KiddSisko is offline  
Old 07-02-09, 07:11 PM
  #94  
PipinFan
Senior Member
 
PipinFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,296

Bikes: 2007 Orbea Onix TDF,2008 Orbea Orca in Red

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
I've only ridden Sram Red around the block, I think I could get used to it. I'd give it a chance. But my overall impression is that it's lower quality than the D.A.(also that of my LBS), and I hear mixed reviews from users and mechanics on it. Some love it, some not so much.

Same here,some people say it good and others that is not as smooth as DA,not even close... I don't know but I'm so used to DA that I don't think I should change it... but I have time to decide,one day I'm all Sram and another I'm Shimano...but Shimano is on my mind 70% of the time.
PipinFan is offline  
Old 07-03-09, 08:20 AM
  #95  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,910

Bikes: Cinelli superstar disc, two Yoeleo R12

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 901 Post(s)
Liked 464 Times in 373 Posts
Originally Posted by UGASkiDawg View Post
These things are all true of Shimano and SRAM as well. You got screwed on your resale of Record shifters. I sold some 7800 shifters for $195 without cables. Campy still costs more to begin with than either Shimano or SRAM (at comparable levels) and you can resell both of those if you want to upgrade. The facts are that Campy charges a premium for a product that performs essentially exactly the same as the other two. If you want to pay that premium...go ahead but some people don't want to. I like DA (7800 at least) better than Red but that's just a personal preference and many differ. Shimano also charges a premium over SRAM so.....

The simple facts are that from a pure value standpoint SRAM is the best deal out there right now.

I'm not a racer so my bike is both a jewel and a tool so I am sometime willing to pay for something just for the snob appeal....but I like DA better than Record so and think it functions better....but that's just my opinion and only worth what you paid for it
I think you missed my point. Campy products hold their value much better than other brands and the total cost of ownership is often no more than the other brands.

Some parts, like the shifters, cost far LESS than the competition. I only paid $100 to upgrade my two year old Record shifters from 10 speed to 11 speed and I made no attempt to get a high price from the old shifters. I just put a low buy-it-now price on E-bay and sold the shifters in about 10 minutes. I'm sure that an extended auction would have produced a higher price, but I'm often generous with my old parts sales. I only paid $270 for some of my Record 10 shifters, when new. Same for my 5 year old RD and 5 year old brakes. I got over half what I paid for them in about 5 minutes on E-bay.

As for function, DA7900 can only shift one cog smaller with a tap of the finger lever. Campy can still drop 5 cogs smaller with a push of the thumb button and 3-cogs larger with one sweep of the finger lever. DA 7900 can only shift 2-cogs larger with a sweep of the brake lever (a loss of function). The DA shifters are also heavier, in addition to being priced a lot higher. I can also repair Campy shifters, but the new design has eliminated the most frequently replaced item (g-springs) and is rarely expected to need maintenance. If maintenace is needed, the new shifters are simple to take apart. Even the cheapest 10 speed Veloce ultrashift lever can also be upgraded to 11 speed.

https://forums.roadbikereview.com/sho...2009+ergopower

Last edited by DaveSSS; 07-03-09 at 08:31 AM.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 07-03-09, 09:51 AM
  #96  
itri-45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: DC Metro
Posts: 146

Bikes: Orbea Onix 2005; Ordu 2007

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by botto View Post
unless shimano comes out with something better, i will most liekly switch to clunky sram with my next bike.
I'm looking for a new group too and wonder if the new Ultegra will be better. I don't really like the required BB maintenance on the Red.
itri-45 is offline  
Old 07-03-09, 11:31 AM
  #97  
botto 
.
 
botto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 40,375
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 25 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by itri-45 View Post
I'm looking for a new group too and wonder if the new Ultegra will be better. I don't really like the required BB maintenance on the Red.
i'm not looking for a new group.
botto is offline  
Old 07-03-09, 12:39 PM
  #98  
LeRenardBleu
EPO Junkie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bridgeport PA, land of excitment!
Posts: 27

Bikes: 2008 Specialized Tarmac Comp Double Team Gerolsteiner

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Scorer75 View Post
Why would the cables make that much of a difference?
the SIS cables have a Teflon like coating on the first third of the cable that allows it to slide around a little smoother. as someone else already mentioned, Shimano thinks that cable routing under the bar is "cosmetic" and they weren't really fans of doing it.
LeRenardBleu is offline  
Old 07-13-09, 09:46 AM
  #99  
gsteinb
out walking the earth
 
gsteinb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lake Placid, NY
Posts: 21,441
Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 912 Post(s)
Liked 751 Times in 342 Posts
How good could the brakes be if yours are always rubbing?
gsteinb is offline  
Old 07-13-09, 11:09 AM
  #100  
Bah Humbug
serious cyclist
 
Bah Humbug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 19,156

Bikes: S1, R2, P2

Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8066 Post(s)
Liked 2,879 Times in 1,538 Posts
Having had a good test ride on a bike with Rival, and owning a bike with Ultegra, I honestly prefer the Rival. This is, of course, just an opinion from a rank amateur who probably has less miles total than most of you do in a good week, but there it is.

I haven't tried Campy yet, and much as I want to drool over Italians, I'm not sure how I'd feel about the thumb shifters. We will see, hopefully.
Bah Humbug is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.