palesaint

For me, much of my confidence in descending comes from my confidence in my bike. If you have a twitchy bike with bald tires and questionable brakes (just thinking worst case), you might not be going as fast as on a comfortable frame with well maintained components and good tires.

What size tires were you riding on your crash? You can get better traction out of 25mm vs 23mm tires. Might almost be worth considering 32-35mm tires with a bit of tread.

AngrySaki

I wimp out pretty bad on a lot of descents. There's something about the feeling of accelleration that bugs me, especially if there's a turn on the hill. I'll go fast down some straight hills, but usually brake at about 50km/h. If there's a turn, I'll usually brake really early and putt around the corner at <30km/h. I do not enjoy riding down mountains at all, and my hands usually hurt pretty bad by the end.

umd

Tread decreases traction.

umd

Sounds like you have a death grip on the bars. Holding the drops loosely usually helps with this.

nutt

It is totally different here. I live in Austin, and the entire western part of the city is overpopulated with complacent deer. They are completely unafraid of anything, and will even let you pet them in places. I almost never scare them into running, even if I pass within 5 feet of them. Once you get outside of the suburbs that changes. The only other wildlife that have given me trouble are buzzards. They really are not willing to leave their corpse on account of a bicycle. I usually have to yell at them to get them out of the street. I am really surprised you scared a herd of cows, all the cows I have ever ridden past look as if they genuinely don't give a crap.

It is a lot more fun than I would have thought to sit and remember all the things I ride past on the bike. Sorry if it has derailed the thread.

ftp1020

Would it help if I said I'm over 50 and did it on a 20+ year old Nishiki (steel) with a 14-28t cassette? :-D

On the advice side, definitely know the hill you're descending. The hill I did 79KM on is very short (under 1km in length), has a busy hospital parking ramp exit right after a sharp left at the bottom, and a set of traffic lights that you can't see immediately after the sharp left. Indeed, there was a crash in that very spot during the World Championships and they didn't have to worry about either the light or the parking ramp exit. Knowing the hill is probably the most important thing, but going down it white-knuckled in fear probably isn't a good thing either. Go as fast or as slow as you feel comfortable with.

Mr. Beanz

Evethough I don;t really want to go down fast all thetime, it's safer to avoid the brakes. Braking in a turn does not allow for free movement, a miscalcultion of pressure to the lever and it's over!

Sure you've seen my descent before but if you watch the lines on the road, I am using the tech shown in the diagram above. IF anything, I might lightly feather the brakes before entering the turn. Like when the car in front of you won't get out of the way.

After some practice, it's natural and trying to go slow is more difficult. I'm doing over 30 mph in the video, 42 on the descent in some sections girl has to gun the engine to stay ahead (smoke form the exhaust at 25 seconds)

gregf83 

This advice might work OK on a motorcycle or car on a flat course but it's not really correct for descending fast or safely. The problem is when going downhill gravity is causing you to accelerate through the turn. If you don't want to brake in the turn you have to slow way down at the beginning and try and anticipate what your exit speed might be. It's better to apply enough brake to maintain a constant speed until you can start 'unwinding' the steering. Jobst Brandt has a reasonable explanation here: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/descending.html

umd

Depends on the descent and the turns. Some turns, hairpins for example, are too tight to not brake and drop a lot of speed before the turn. 40 mph into a hairpin and you are going to need to more than feather the brakes.

umd

I didn't read the link but that's basically what I do... brake before the turn to close to the speed I want to take the apex and then gradually release braking as I go through it. By the time I've hit the apex I've released the brakes and start accelerating.

Daytrip

That's usually the case here as well. But this was in the early spring, and they'd been cooped up in the barn all winter, so they were a little nervous about being out in the field. All it takes is one to get spooked and they all follow suit--buncha cattle. I felt a little guilty about it--hated to spoil their fresh meal. But I guess that's what they get for not being terribly bright.

PlatyPius

I'm pretty much fearless on descents. My high speed to date is 56mph. It's only after the descent that I say to myself "Holy Sh!+!"
Hate climbing though. Well, it's a love-hate thing, really.

zeo_max

Too cool not to post for the 1 millionth time

rmhaas

I like descending as well but only on roads that I am familiar with. My primary fear is a car will pull out in front of me and I wont be to slow down go around or stop in time. My max seed so far is about 48 mph which is pretty fast for me. Not sure what max speeds would be safe on my bike and wheels as well which tends to make me hold back a little.

msincredible

Lots of excellent advice already posted:
- look through the turns
- relax and use your abs to hold you up - stiff arms work against you
- good lines and late apexing (per Eric's diagram)
- majority of braking before the turn; accelerate coming out of the turn
- mostly front brakes for descending (although if it is slippery conditions then use both brakes)
- never whack on the brakes - ease them on and off
- go at a pace that feels comfortable for you

I do the majority of my braking before the turn and a bit of trail braking through the turn. I accelerate as I exit the turn.

banerjek

The trick to descending is to relax. Control your breathing. Your body, arms, and hands should be relaxed with a light grip on the bars.

I use my brakes as little as possible. If I must apply them, I modulate them so the rims have a chance to cool. At higher speeds, I think it's wise to avoid using the brakes on curves -- slow down before the curve rather than in the curve.

Doing either of these things will prevent you from seeing things in time. When you are descending at high speed, you don't want to kick a piece of gravel, collide with a squirrel, hit a small pothole, etc -- particularly on a curve. If you do hit something or encounter an unpleasant surprise, keep yourself relaxed both physically and mentally.

Navigate with slow fluid motions so you have as much time to react as possible to everything. Look far ahead, keep track of the various threats, and feel the bike.

Even if you ride the same bike all the time, what you're carrying, wheels, tires, and the like make an enormous difference in the descent experience and how fast you can go.


If the bike feels under control, it is. If it doesn't, that's a sign that you need to slow down and/or that you're doing something wrong. Don't worry about how fast you are relative to the others. Just play things by feel, and don't try to force anything that doesn't feel right to you.

clarkgriswold

"Descending is like riding a motorcycle on a track; "

I roadraced for 12 years and I disagree. Bombing a hill on a bicycle you are basically riding in underwear and a foam hat, with brakes and rims that can overheat and actually cause a crash.

On a track with a motorcycle, you get a sighting/warmup lap to view track conditions, safety workers in the corners looking out for oil/dirt/mud, and are wearing leather suit, boots, gloves, protective helmet, and back protector. The gloves and boots usually have carbon fiber reinforcement.
You can also increase the power to pull you out of a slide and prevent a high-side. Even all that can't prevent a crash but that goes way beyond what happens on a bicycle. I've crashed my motorcycle at Road Atlanta on the last turn (after the old gravity cavity) and walked away, and crashed on the street a couple of times before I wisened up and raced only on a track. I'm not looking forward to crashing on the bicycle.

You gotta have something special to nail a twisty downhill on a bicycle. I've only done relatively straight and relatively short runs but even there I get nervous when I hit a turn... a tiny amount of gravel is enough to wipe out on - and you have nothing really to protect yourself.

I'm highly impressed and yes it's a massive rush, but it is a dangerous run.

msincredible

Another thing that helps is doing the same descent over and over, as much as possible. Learning the road and the turns really well will help your technique and your confidence.

spyro1123

get a MTB, go downhill on said bike, suddenly the road will seem like a very easy descent. You mean that there aren't 3 foot drops to deal with? The road is a mostly uniform surface? SWEET!!

I can sympathize though, it took a long time after my big MTB crash to bomb downhill as fast as I am capable of.

Oscuro

I love descents. I don't know why, but I love the feeling of the bike at high speed, and literally hooked into a line around a bend. It's pure exhilaration for me. Well, except for the one last year that scared the ever loving crap outta me!

There's this hill here in Vic called Mt. Douglas. Brutal climb for me, (to be honest, I haven't yet conquered it...), but descending is ridiculous. The road is not very well maintained, and it is really worn concrete, with pot holes, root heaves, frost heaves, etc. Oh, and THIS hairpin:





I lacked the testicular fortitude to try and bomb that hill. Doubt I ever will....big part of it is that well, that's a 2 lane road, and it IS open to cars. Full lane to work with? I might have a bit more guts.

calamarichris

+1 on all of these, EXCEPT for mostly using the front brake. Even if your rear brake doesn't offer as much braking force as the front, it still offers some and is therefore useful.
MsI's top two tips sound simple to the point of being silly, but it takes a good deal of practice & self-control to NOT tense up at least a little when you're flying toward a guardrail (or a cliff) at 30+ wearing only lycra.
Also, looking through the corner is counterintuitive too, because our slow-evolving primate eyes tend to focus from point-to-point-to-point, rather than looking fluidly through a corner as it unwinds--this tends to make us look for the softest spot on the guard rail to land, rather than on helping one concentrate on the unfolding corner. [Google: "Target Fixation"]

Finally, it's probably better to ride at your own comfort level, rather than feeling embarrassed about how slow you are compared to others. Descend slowly enough to feel a little excited, but still remain loose & serene.

stevegor

Rode both sides of my favourite climb this morning, on the way down the first time a HUGE kangaroo leapt out across my path
as I rounded a very steep high speed left hander. As Maxwell Smart would say "Missed it...by that much"
I didn't panic or brake, I just altered my direction slightly and got around him, just happy he didn't stop and stare like they usually do.

Believe me those rodents can kill you at that speed.

idcruiserman

I never had any trouble with descents until I got a front tire flat @ 40MPH. Thankfully the leak was slow, and I managed to keep my bike upright. My current road bike (Felt F3C) likes to wobble @ high speeds which doesn't help. I never had that problem with my CAAD4.

patentcad

The only thing that scares me about descents are the friggin stupid deer. In Greece (no deer) I was beating the cars down the mountain roads. Interestingly they'd catch me on the straights, but I could generally corner faster than they could, particularly if I had enough visibility to use the entire road to get the right line through the turn.

Your bike will go down hills @ 60+ mph. The bike can handle it. Can you? That's the question. RELAX. 90% of this is getting into the Zen of Descend. That's where you tuck in, take a deep breath, and go with the flow. Knowing how to set up for a corner helps of course.

msincredible

I've occasionally had the nice person in a car or on a Harley pull over to let me by.

Yeah, having to emergency brake for a deer while on a descent kind of sucks.