NEUROSPORT

ok they have like a million saddle models and they all look similar - what is actually the difference ?

i can tell there are some naked carbon ones and some leather covered ones but that to me is 2 models.

how do all the other ones come about ?

a few weeks ago i got a bike with this idiotic Fizik seat which hurts my privates. i just read some horror stories bottom line my balls aren't going on that seat again. It will go on eBay as soon as i find a replacement.

i looked at Toupe at the LBS and the cutout on it didn't look particularly generous. San Marco Mantra looks good on pictures but i don't think i will be able to look at it in person at an LBS.

now my LBS does have Selle SMP ( didn't ask which one ) so if SMP only had one model that would be easy. but in effect i can go to LBS and try just the one model they have in the store and then i would have to make a choice from ALL of the SMP models.

HELP !

???

NEUROSPORT

also if anybody knows which shops in silicon valley i should check out for seats. so far i have seen good seats at the "front of the pack" shop but i didn't like their prices.

is "chain reaction" good ? i haven't checked it out yet.

Carbon Unit

Mostly, the different models are based on the width and the amount of padding. I have an SMP Plus which is one of the widest models at 159 mm wide. I believe the Plus also has more padding than the Pro and the Avant.

The shop where I bought mine allowed me to test it and gave me a week to decide. However, they only had one SMP saddle in stock, which was the Plus so I didn't get to try other saddles. The Plus has worked for me. I no longer have numbness from the saddle. I do feel the pressure on the sit bones which I didn't with my previous saddle. I got use to the sit bone pressure but I never got use to numbness. Overall, I am happy with the Plus and would buy it again.

scirocco

Check out Chain Reaction's website - they have them all listed with their specifications.

Different models have different widths and different amounts of padding. The Carbon and Evolution are 129mm. Stratos is 131mm. Glider is 136mm. SMP Lite is 139mm. Extra is 140mm. SMP Plus is 159mm.

I guess the theory is that anyone that is buying one of these already knows what width suits them. Personally I couldn't find one that was comfortable, but certainly they are good for solving numbness problems.

Carbon Unit

The US Distributor for Selle SMP Saddles is in California. You may want to call or email them:

Alba Bici LLC.
653 South G Street
93030 Oxnard CA – USA
Mr. Gianluca Caliari
Tel. 001-805 3853179
Mail : gianluca@albabici.com
Web : www.albabici.com

NEUROSPORT

ok i see. there is a chain reaction cycles store not too far from here i will probably check it out.

the "front of the pack" store have these stationary bikes in there they said they would let me try the saddle in the store on those bikes, i assume they wouldn't let me try it for a week and return it. do you think i could tell just by sitting for a minute or two on it in the store if it was fitting me ?

scirocco

I suspect we're not talking about the same Chain Reaction store. I was referring to https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ which is one of the better known UK mail-order stores. But your local store may have the SMP's as well.

sstorkel

Front of the Pack's stationary bike is usually setup with TT-like geometry, so it isn't the best place to try saddle. You might ask if they have demo saddles that you can try; I can't remember if they do or not. If you buy a saddle off the shelf they might let you return it as long as it's in brand-new condition. Best to ask before buying, though.

You're asking enough questions that you probably won't be able to tell whether a saddle is going to work from a few minutes in the store. I'm sure they'd happily let you pedal the stationary bike for an hour or two, which might be what you'd need to do. The alternative is to do what I did: buy a Selle SMP Extra saddle from Performance Bike ($109 retail, ~$89-99 on sale), ride it for a while, then decide if it makes sense to upgrade to a more expensive SMP saddle. Riding the Extra will also give you a sense for how much padding you want and what width you need.

FYI, you could also go to a Mike's Bikes, get measured on the Specialized Ass-o-meter, and try one of Specialized's highly-regarded saddles (Toupe, Romin, Avatar, etc). Cut-outs sound great, but you may or may not actually need one. I like my Selle SMP Lite 209 (purchased from FotP), but the WTB saddle on my mountain bike is every bit as comfortable (and far cheaper) despite the fact that it doesn't have a cut-out. Passion Trail Bikes in Belmont has a WTB demo kit, IIRC.

AngryScientist 

fwiw, i think the specialized ass-o-meter is just a piece of memory foam you sit on, then when you get up, they measure the distance between the deepest impressions. theory is that where those impressions are is where your sit bones will interface with the saddle. i think its a great starting point, and it worked to get me onto a toupe 143, which i love, totally disappears under me during long rides. even if you dont wind up with a spec. saddle, its a good reference point to know the saddle width that will work best for you.

finally - the physical size of the cutout is not the best indicator of the "pressure relief" it will offer you. the saddle design overall should dictate this, and thats based on how it supports your weight, not entirely on the cutout size...

good luck.

fskywalker

See the chart below:



A mentioned above, they vary in general on width, length, material of construction and amount of padding. As the ad says, check www.sellesmp.com I have a TRK with steel rails and a Stratos with carbon rails. Hope this helps!!

NEUROSPORT

how would you say the Lite compares to Extra ? did you return Extra to Performance Bike for a refund ?

the fact that my old cheap specialized mountain bike seat ( came stock on a $350 bike ) was always comfortable does bother me. i never spent even 5 seconds thinking about that seat when i was on it. i am thinking about stealing that seat from my parents to whom i gave that bike.

is there any reason not to use MTB seat on a road bike ?

i think the reason why my specialized MTB seat worked and this Fizik Aliante doesn't is because specialized was flat ( so it supported my 230 lbs weight ) and it had an indentation of sorts as a poor man's cutout. Fizik is rounded so it doesn't support my weight as high up and there is no cutout.

i liked how flat the toupe is when i looked at it but the edges do look razor sharp as others have pointed out. i am looking for a seat that is flat in the back so it supports my weight better, but has rounded edges the middle so it doesn't look like a razor, and i want it to have a very big cutout. of course this is pure guesswork as far as what i THINK i need.

NEUROSPORT

is there any feedback on durability of the SMP ? i was thinking if they used a soft leather which i think they did it might wear out pretty quick ? how many miles do you think i should expect it to last ?

would a molded foam seat like the Extra last longer ?

Surferbruce

all I can say is I rode a Composit for a couple months and it was the worst saddle ever. like riding on a 2x4.

Carbon Unit

This doesn't surprise me. I would expect it to be as hard as a 2X4. I bet the carbon fiber saddles are even worse. My SMP Plus has enough padding that it is comfortable.

jwible

I have a Composit. With good bibs it's fine. With lousy bibs it's painful.

sstorkel

There isn't much I can tell you about the Lite that you can't glean from reading the SMP literature: it's lighter than the Extra, it's slightly narrower, and it has quite a bit less padding. Overall, I find that it's much more comfortable especially on longer rides. It also seems to be quite a bit more durable than the Extra.

I rode the Extra for a year, so I didn't bother to return it to Performance. It's been demoted to use on my commute bike.

Again: cut-out size doesn't matter much when it comes to determining saddle comfort. If you think you want a flat saddle, you'll probably love Specialized's BG saddle line: Toupe, Avatar, Phenom, Romin, etc. You probably won't like the SMP saddles, however.

Companies that use leather on saddles tend to use stuff that's durable enough to last. My Lite 209 seems to be wearing better than my Extra. The Extra has a very thin vinyl cover. The graphics wore off in short order and the cover seems somewhat vulnerable to tears.

NEUROSPORT

i don't understand the purpose of composit. if it doesn't have padding why not have bare plastic ? why cover it with leather ? i think it's a conspiracy - they do it on purpose so that once the leather wears out you have to buy a new one, because if the surface was simply carbon loaded nylon it would last forever and you would never come back with more business.

instead they left the bare chassis design for the $500 carbon seats. so if you want a seat that lasts forever you have to spend $500. for $200 you only get a seat for a few years. pretty clever business strategy.

NEUROSPORT

i think u may be wrong on both counts.

i think they might be using vulnerable leather on purpose to make sure you keep buying the saddle.

i also think the Extra probably doesn't have any cover. i think the "cover" is merely the surface finish of the padding itself so even if you slice and dice it with a box cutter it can't "come off"

ideally what they would want to happen is for you to first buy Extra and realize it is too thick. then buy Evolution and have the leather disintegrate in about 3 - 4 years. then finally you would have to go for carbon to make sure it doesn't happen again. in this scenario they will have collected almost a thousand dollars from you.

of course if you have a tendency to crash the carbon won't last forever either.

NEUROSPORT

problem is at the Mike's bike shop ( specialized ) they said they won't take a saddle back if there is so much as a hair thin scratch on the rails. and i am not so convinced i would like the toupe because even though my other specialized seat was flat it had almost an inch of padding so in actual riding it would probably round out on the edges.

when i was at the FOTP i held the SMP saddle in my hands and i was very impressed with overall quality - it was much sturdier than Toupe which felt like a piece of cardboard. but i didn't pay attention to leather - i will have to look at it again.

njkayaker

The OP's a troll.

He's right about one thing:

Carbon Unit

I haven't seen any indiction that the OP is a troll. What makes you think so? It appears that he is actually trying to get an answer to his SMP saddle question.

njkayaker

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...tte&highlight=
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...mma&highlight=
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...me.&highlight=
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ain&highlight=

Once a troll, always a troll.

NEUROSPORT

stopped by Mikes' bike shop today for the ass-o-meter. the guy who works there said 115-120 mm. then i checked it myself and came up with 95-100 mm. i sat on the thing 3 times. by the way its quite nifty - i didn't expect the indentations to be that clear.

anyway this puts me on 143 mm specialized seats but those are very flat. with the shape of SMP i think i will need more like 155.

performance bike only had Evolution which is 139, and FOTP is closed on mondays. hopefully tomorrow i'll stop by.

NEUROSPORT

So today i tried Mantra and SMP Pro at the FOTP on a trainer. SMP was super painful. Mantra was medium painful.

I then went to Mike's bike shop and they let me ride around the block on two of their bikes - one with 143mm Avatar Gel and one with some other softer saddle in 155 mm.

i liked the 155 mm soft cheap saddle the best, but i decided to buy an uncomfortable seat on purpose so as to be more hardcore. i didn't want it to be so uncomfortable though that it would prevent me from riding.

so at the end of the day i got Specialized Lithia 143 mm Gel. it's same as Avatar only the padding is about 50% more substantial and the cutout is also about 50% more substantial. yeah it's a "women's" saddle but i don't care.

i wrapped some electrical tape around the rails before mounting in case i needed to return it and rode my usual 10 miles today. i like it. i am keeping it.

if they had a 155 mm Lithia maybe i would have gotten that but they didn't. they only had 155 mm Avatar but Lithia is head and shoulders above Avatar for the same price.

so it's not perfect. i do get sore around the sit bones a bit on it ( unlike the 155 mm specialized cheap soft seat which i don't feel at all ) but not so bad that i expect it to be a problem. most importantly for me is that the cutout on that seat works for me.

i didn't bother trying the Toupe. i am 200% certain it wouldn't be half as comfortable as Lithia.

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...jsp?spid=47302

NEUROSPORT

Drove to Los Gatos and exchanged the 143 mm Lithia for 155 mm Lithia.

I tried it today for about 30 minute ride. Much better than 143 mm, even though the chart put me between 130mm & 143mm seats.

The gel design has stiffer padding around sit bones and softer padding everywhere else. It's quite dramatic.

My ass still feels the 143mm seat from the day before so i couldn't tell what i was really feeling on the 155. All i know is while on the 155mm i felt not the 155mm seat but the 143mm from the day before - which means its a SOLID upgrade.

the shape appears near perfect. hopping on feels almost like putting a key into a lock - perfect match. the only thing i am not so sure about is the padding - this saddle definitely puts my weight on the sit bones which is supposed to be the goal but i don't know if maybe i would like to spread it around a bit more - a similar specialized seat without the gel pads under the sit bones would do just that.

I will need some time for the final judgement.