tjspiel

Just a couple of quick pics (sorry, no video)

Fox Farm

As a Campy Ergo Lever user since 1994, first the 8 speed, converted them to 9 speed ($30 bucks) and then new 10 speed in 2005 and last year the 11 speed group (Chorus), I am obviously sold on their system. I have tired Shimano on borrowed bikes and really did not like the way that the shifting was engineered one bit. In fact, I hated it as much as you dislike the Campy lever, which I find very easy to use and can shift it from the drops or hoods with no problems at all. I have only messed around with SRAM on showroom floor bikes. Why would I switch my system to SRAM? I would not. Why would I switch to Shimano? I certainly would not. All of that said, both of them are well engineered and shift well and sell better than Campy. Who cares? Right now the Shimano electronic shifting is hot and SRAM is hot from recent TDF wins. I don't own stock in either of the three companies. Like some one on this thread said, it IS a personal thing. Like, why would you choose to drive a German, Italian, or Japanese made car. All three work well but it is personal.

I like the idea of SRAM, being an American owned company, however all of their stuff is manufactured off shore. Their components are engineered by both SRAM and Tru Vativ designers. I use their stuff exclusively on my mountain bike. But on the road, it's the passion of Italian made and engineered components that I prefer.

cooleric1234

That's helpful, thanks. What kind of handlebars are those? Seems like for this to work ideal you'd need bars like that, somewhat more ergo than the classic bend.

tjspiel

They're Salsa Bell Laps which were designed for cyclocross. I also have Campy on my Specialized Allez and its stock bars. I have not found a place for the shifters on the Allez bars that I like really well but I had the same problem with the 105s that were on there before. I'm probably going to get some different bars for that bike next year. I like the Bell Laps alot but they're not really intended for the road.

tjspiel

With the right Jtek "Shiftmate" a lot of Shimano/Campy shifter/rear derailleur combinations will work.

TMB

Did you really just say that shifting gears on a bike is a burden?

Good gawd.

New depths of inanity.

AusTai

This thread reminded me of when a good friend visited and saw my bike. He has ultegra on his much more expensive bike, and rides better than I do, but he doesn't know any bike tech. Anyway, he saw the thumb levers of my Campy-equipped bike and said, with total sincerity, "Oh, just like the Sora -- so it's low-end, huh?"

teterider

I'd be interested to know who shifts with their thumb, and who uses the middle thumb knuckle.

On the hoods, I use the middle of my thumb to shift at the knuckle, and not the tip. Anyone else?

bradtx

Man, this is one of those Ford vs. Chevy type debates. I use DA because the hoods are more comfortable for me, the thumb shifter is a non issue, IMHO. It took a friend of mine about an hour to become accustomed to the difference when he converted from STI to Ergo.

Brad

garysol1 

As a Super Record 11 user, I miss my D/A. Thumb shifter is fine but I am more precise on my up shifts with the larger lever that the Shimano provides.

LowCel 

I have a buddy that used to borrow my backup Fuji SL1 when he was having bike issues. He was a shimano user but he never once complained about using the campy on my bike. Considering that he still runs shimano it didn't convert him, however running campy certainly didn't slow him down any either.

JamieElenbaas

I ride 2010 Athena 11.

Regarding the question:

I can only say, it is so instinctive and a non event that in order to answer your question, I'd actually have to get on my bike and see how I do it. Seriously, I doubt very much that anyone with gripes about modern Campy has ever used it for much more than a ride around the block.

Blackdays

:facepalm:

Flash

And here some of you thought it was campy envy...

AusTai

Is this true of Shimano or SRAM, that they perform the same throughout the range?

Blackdays

I'm stripping the Chorus/Super Record mix off my future bike and replacing it with Red.

One of you want to buy it?

Eclectus

I got Red in May 09, just before it swept TdF podium several weeks later. I was riding Shimano. Campy was appealing, loved it long ago. But I wanted to try something different. Red was getting good mag reviews. A bike shop offered a Cervelo build with Red priced at $1160. They had a return-for-full-refund-if-you-don't-like-it policy. Red turned out to be really nice. I mean, I've been riding roadbikes since 1963, tried lots of stuff. (Have you ever ridden Simplex and Suntour?) You can downshift SRAM 3 rear cogs with a single sweep. If you want 4-5 in a single sweep, go with Campy. With Red you need two sweeps, not that hard. I've gone 9000 mi with only barrel-adjuster twists needed to keep it in tune, nice.

SRAM claims the last 10 TdF winners rode Red in TdF '10. Lance finagled himself a share of SRAM ownership. That's pretty impressive pro-peloton endorsement, I think.

When some people say they love their Campy, of course Campy is really good, really fun stuff. SRAM is making really good, really fun stuff too.

tjspiel

Even with Campy you have to be careful. For some model years the mechanicals aren't much different from one range to the next. In other years there are significant differences. For example, from 2007 to 2008, the lower end Campy shifters had the "Escape" feature which most people saw as a significant downgrade. Campy dropped it in 2009.

As far as Shimano goes, Sora has always been kind of a different beast. The others at least are operated in the same way.

Until recently I did have similar aged 105 and Ultegra shifters. I couldn't tell one from the other from the way they shifted. But a couple of years ago as I understand it Shimano made a change to the 105 mechanism that made it much more prone to break. They've since changed it back.

I have no personal experience with Tiagra or DA. I have heard people really rave about DA and claim that it's much better than Ultegra so I'm assuming there is a difference in the mechanisms and not just materials.

kimconyc

I don't know about Shimano but SRAM Red has Zero-Loss for the rear shifting (right shifter), a hollowed out cassette, and Red also has ceramic bearings in the BB and pulleys, aside from the weight differences and such.

FWIW, I was REALLY impressed with Shimano 5700 when I played around with it at my LBS.

jr59

YES! I do!
Please send pm

Homebrew01

Campy is reintroducing it in 2011 for Veloce 10, Centaur 10 & Athena 11. Called "Powershift", it has limited multi-shift functionality. However, limited multi-shifting is still better than no multi-shifing at all (Shimano & SRAM)

tjspiel

I really like multi-shift but to me the bigger downside to the old Escape shifters was the lack of micro-adjust. Will that be missing from the Powershift models too? I suppose it's not that big of deal when your components are matching.

DaveSSS 

A few corrections. Shimano and SRAM have multi-shifting, but only to larger cogs. Shimano's latest shifters can only shift 2-cogs with one sweep of the brake lever, while the other brands can shift 3-cogs larger.

The new Campy power shift will have the same type of single cog smaller shifts, but with the thumb button.

As for "microshifting", that's a bit off. Pre-2009 shifters had 12 clicks available on the left side, but only 3-4 were used for a double FD and 7 for a triple FD, the rest were worthless. Only one click in either direction was ever used for trimming. The 2009+ models can still operate a triple FD with 6 clicks. When operating a double FD there is no need for a trim click from the big ring, if the FD is setup properly, with 3 clicks. Only 1 click of trim is used, with the finger lever, when in the little ring.

tjspiel

The reason "microshifting" is so great is that it is in essence ratcheted friction shifting. This allows you to use a wide variety of FDs and cranksets without worrying about compatibility. Really nice if you want an offroad crankset for example. So I don't agree that the clicks were worthless. It's also a relatively simple and reliable mechanism that works well without perfect adjustment. To me indexed shifting on the front introduces completely unnecessary complication.

wunderkind

Sora fans say the same thing too. 2300/Sora/Campy riders unite!

Apart from drops, the thumby lever is fine. But if one is on drops and hustling, the last thing you want is moving one of hand grip in this case the thumb area from gripping the handlebar. You want maximum control of the handlebar at high speeds. It's ok for slower riders.