justabikegirl

Just a warning to my bike friends. I wanted to build up a bike for myself so I purchased a "2010 Project 1 Trek Madone WSD" frame on e-Bay at Christmas. The frame arrived and looked good, but my enthusiasm was tempered by the fact that when I turned the frame over there was a big Trek sticker that clearly showed the frame was manufactured Jan. 15, 2008.

I contacted the seller (nixonvw) who told me the frames had not changed since 2008, so it didn't matter. I disagreed, since she advertised it as a 2010 frame. She would not agree to a return or a reduction in price so I contacted e-Bay who I thought had a Buyer Protection plan. Guess what? The seller "escalated" the complaint and e-Bay sided with the seller without ever contacting me for my side of the story. Evidently, once someone escalates a dispute the other person is locked out of the discussion.

What a shame for people legitimately wanting to sell their bikes or components. I have had good luck in the past both buying and selling on e-Bay but this $860 mistake was a HUGE lesson for me. I have appealed their decision, but my shopping days on e-Bay are over. Buyer Beware.

Velo Gator

keep going. Dispute with PayPal, and then file a chargeback on your credit card. You'll win.

Mr. Embrey

It's because they get paid a hefty fee from the sellers. Other than setting the price for which they base their fee, they get squat from the buyers. It's polictics 101

patentcad

Oh relax. EBay is so biased towards buyers it's ridiculous. It's gotten so bad big sellers are ready to pull the plug.

Why don't you threaten the seller with negative feedback? They can't even respond if you leave negative feedback as a buyer now.

At the end of the day, where are your damages here? You have a new bike frame that's not the right model year? So how much less is it really worth? $100? It's still a late model pristine high end CF frame.

Mr. Embrey

Yes, Paypal is about your only avenue for recourse.

patentcad

Incorrect. EBay is so concerned with buyers that they have made it impossible for sellers to respond to negative feedback, which is often left without warning, for lame reasons. It's a huge problem on eBay these days.

Caracalla.

agreed, print the auction page mentioning the 2010 model and take a pic of the manufacturing date on what you got. call your credit card to dispute it. this is a clear case of misrepresentation.

patentcad

Yeah, in the end, I'll be utterly ASTONISHED if eBay doesn't make this seller take the frame back and refund your money.

MegaTom

^^ That ^^

Buyers ALWAYS have the upper-hand on eBay/PayPal these days. And if, in some freak one in a billion chance, eBay fails the buyer, his credit card company or bank can do a chargeback.

twobadfish

I am declined to believe this story.

Buyers = always victorious

Mr. Embrey

Did you even read the first post? She didn't win. How is feedback going to fix the situation after they've already ruled in their favor? C'mon man.

Mr. Embrey

It'll only be because Paypal made them.

lechat

just doesn't ring true. Ebay should have frozen the funds in the sellers Paypal acct. when you filed a complaint. and with what you're telling us, would have decided in your favor.

walie

um, eBay owns Paypal

Velo Gator

The problem is, she went through eBay. I don't think they'll do anything. Do it through PayPal (I know it's the same company, but it's a different ladder for complaints).

BikeNube

This. Just call your credit card company. What the seller did is what we call in the united states "Fraud".

Makel

Can you post a picture of the sticker?

Makel

Are you sure the sticker wasn't more of a: mold made on date, or a copyright date?

Caracalla.

1st sentence 2nd paragraph of OP's post. Seller did not dispute it and practically admitted and defended it was a 2008 model frame.

Mr. Embrey

Umm, doesn't mean they operate the same.

echappist

exactly. I mean it's false advertising at the least. The more legally-minded can chime in on whether this constitutes wire fraud.

Also, you don't want to ride a trek frame. Those things have a tendency to break

nacler22

Small world, I bought some Bontrager Pro X light take-offs from Nixonvw about a month ago. Wonder if they were from OP's frame?

Caracalla.

legal term is more of fraudulent misrepresentation.

Orbea2009

I have heard from my LBS who is a trek dealer that trek can only date the frame when it is ordered and boxed so if it was made in 2008 the molds are the same, apparently they only date it when you order them and they box the frame. Unless the frame changes, especially now with their custom/choice of paint jobs they leave the frames bare until the order is put through would be difficult to find out when the frame was actually purchased unless seller has copy of when they purchased the frame to prove that the frame is a genuine 2010 frame

bostongarden

Here's another take for the OP to consider.

Interesting situation and I'm sorry this happened to you. I'm not keen about misrepresentations. My understanding is that you bid with the expectation that this was a 2010. Your behavior may have been different were the bike listed as being of a different year (e.g., perhaps you would not have bid at all, or, you might have entered a lower proxy bid). I don't claim to have all the facts; but, keep your eyes on the prize/frameset and fair treatment. Is there something that would make you happy to keep the frameset? If the answer is no, then, indeed, you should seriously be putting forth a strong effort to get your money back. If however, some form of fair compensation would make you happy, then think about focusing on that.

Some thoughts that I hope you find helpful (if you like the frameset and would consider keeping it were you compensated in some way):

1) The frameset was described as new; hence -- assuming no difference between a "2010" and an item indicating a mnf date of Jan 2008 -- there may be no meaningful impact between receiving a "2010" and one indicating a mnf date of Jan 2008 with respect to riding. Although, resale value might matter, it may not be too much. I'm not fully aware of the relationship between mnf dates and "year." Perhaps this one is a "2009"? Perhaps it is a "2008."

2) I didn't research fully the selling history for this frameset, but, the price you paid seems reasonably good.

Some little points that I would want to clarify include asking Trek if such a label is used for their framesets (send them a photo and ask). Maybe it did not apply to this frameset (and maybe it does not preclude it from being a 2010 -- although, I would be curious to find out how the seller came to list the frameset as a 2010). I suspect that the color doesn't help you determine year as this was a Project 1, where the same color may have been available for more than one year. It would be great if there were some cues on the frameset to determine it's "year."

Good luck. What folks have suggested here about Paypal and your credit card company sound like they could be effective actions. However, if you like the frameset, maybe look at coming to some sort of compensation agreement.